Right wing movements requre an enemy to attack to distract from their lack of helpful policy
Nothing will meaningfully improve until the rich fear for their lives
Because it was never about protecting children. It’s about upholding normalcy.
Yes, some people are legitimately concerned about “what if they regret it?”. In some part it is to convince both “the normies” and the “they go low, we go high” type liberals. But for the most part, it’s nothing more than what I call “Power Play”.
Power Play in a nutshell is about being hypocrites, kind of on purpose, but usually behind the thick veneer of “concerns”. It’s to showcase “we are the ingroup, we can do this”, while the “concerns” are nothing more, than all the time school bullies convinced their teachers the bully victim stole their lunch money, but they took it back.
In this case, it’s nothing more than to put them gays back in their place. They can sexualize minors, they can consume lolicon doujinshi, they can even get actual CSAM and molest children. Maybe they will let their token transphobic femboys away with shotacon stuff. But the most important stuff is that you cannot even exist, not even if you not harming minors.
(How can I write the next Innuendo Studios video?)
It’s about upholding normalcy.
Does calling it “normalcy” play right into their hands? It kind of implies that they’re right, that their vision is objectively normal.
It being statistically normal doesn’t make it better. Whether it’s true is irrelevant because even assuming it is, it’s still not better just because it’s normal.
I’m just questioning whether it’s productive for allies to label cis/hetero as “normal”.
One of my kids came out as gay, and was immediately bullied by both staff and students (they were in trade school). I did the usual furious parent stuff, but also added a piece of flair every day to tell the world I was bi, and wore a bow in my hair. They came to me a few days later and came out as non-binary, and asked for help getting clothes to match who they were.
It wasn’t the threats I made to the teacher, it wasn’t the death stares I gave their classmates, it was seeing someone they trusted showing them not everyone is straight that did it. I am so very proud of them.
I didn’t do anything spectacular, I don’t want praise, I just want to tell everyone I meet that tiny actions like that ripple out.
You deserve an award for being an excellent parental figure. This is the kind of support kids around the world need more of.
You deserve an award for being an excellent parental figure. This is the kind of support kids around the world need more of.
I’m sorry I don’t mean to be combative here, but I absolutely don’t. This is the bar for being a parent, not a great parent, just a parent. Backing up your kids is quite literally the least you should be doing.
So please, I appreciate what you’re meaning to do here, yet I don’t want that to be how this story reads. I want people to hear that and know that’s what we need to be doing as a bare minimum. Even if you’re not a parent, this is basic community stuff. Kids bullying the poor young girl who’s trying to transition? Shut that shit down. Store owner won’t let certain races in? Shut that shit down. Kids feel like they can’t be themselves because it ‘isn’t normal’? Shut that shit down.
i’m trying to wrap my head around deciding to come out in an educational setting-- like were they all on his social media or did he stand in front of class and give them the update, directly?
They painted their nails to match their overalls. Then when asked, said they were in fact gay.
Telling friends or just casually slipping it into the conversation (“my boyfriend said…”), I guess.
They painted their nails. Classmates asked “are you a fag?” They replied something like “Guess so.”
I was talking about the Doctor Strange Multiverse of Madness movie with a friend of mine and he mentioned the pride flag that America wears. He said something like “That’s just Hollywood propaganda. There’s no way a 13 or 14 year old would know enough to know they were gay.” And I said, “I knew I was straight by that age.” He didn’t seem to have an answer for that one.
the reason they wouldnt know, is because they wouldnt allow themselves to consider it.
when queer people are seen as an icky out-group, or not even truely discussed, it pushes people to ignore and supress their feelings. “i cant possibly be one of them! im normal!” “i might feel like i dont want to be my birth assigned gender, but there is nothing to be done about that :<”
it often takes time, positive awareness of queerness and an accepting environment or the ability to emancipate oneself from toxic environments to be able to overcome this conditioning.
so the illusiont that children cant know they are queer, is completely created by the heteronormative system opressing them
This is why there somehow wasn’t a single gay or trans kid in my high school in the 90s. I sometimes wonder which ones actually were now.
The null hypothecis. If only I had thought to ask if I’m cishet sooner.
I figured out I was lesbian at 11, what kinda bs is that?
At Christmas family gathering, a few people talked about their early childhood discoveries - I think all three were younger than that.
Wonder how confused the people who say that teens can’t know were when they were teens. Not insulting them - I was one of those who was really confused as a teen (I questioned if sexual attraction was made up).
Besides, it doesn’t really matter if they find out that they aren’t gay/bi/ace/whatever later. It’s not like I took an oath of lesbianism at 11 and now if I ever kiss a guy or identify as something else I spontaneously explode.
You didn’t take the oath? You’re missing out! Baphomet’s an amazing friend.
I don’t want Sappho’s ghost to come and get me.
I do :3
BOO!
My sister in law was complaining about friend of her son that is ace, saying that nobody was ace until now. And I had to remind her that priests and nuns have existed for hundreds of years, in the past she would be forced to an unhappy marriage or to become a nun.
Priests and nuns arent ace… well i mean im sure some were, but dont lump them all in. Asexuality != celibacy.
“Nobody was X until now!1!” and every single person who has studied history at all laughs.
I wanna say “Nobody was white until [I need to research when]”, I’m sure that would go over well 😂. IIRC “whiteness” and “race” in general are only a few hundred years old.
I think what you’re saying is completely correct and I agree completely, kids know they’re straight when they’re young, so of course it stands to reason that they know they are gay or any other thing too.
I do have young relatives who changed their mind also though, and I worry too much of you “you just know, it’s so obvious” can have a negative impact too, if a growing child decides to change their mind on what their sexuality is, they should not be worried that it might appear disingenuous or abnormal.
It can be obviously one thing at one point and later it can be obviously a new thing, sometimes it can be not obvious and that’s all fine and part of the human experience. Generally I’m saying: we should all be allowed to decide whatever we like about ourselves and our identity, and change those decisions whenever we like too.
What I’m trying to clarify is: let’s not let people changing their mind about their identity be used against the argument of you know whether or not you’re gay when you’re young.
Though I think it’s fair to say that the above post does not say “you know” but rather “I knew”…
Anyway I’m rambling now, out of fear of being taken out of context, so I’ll stop :)
You’re absolutely correct. Some people “just know” and stay thay way, some “just know” and change, and some take a while to find out. There is absolutely no reason why that should be a problem.
My brother knew he wanted to be a doctor when he was five and he stuck with it. I’m 36 and I still wonder if I chose the right profession. Why is this considered normal for what you want to work with but not who you want to be with?
this is what bothers me so much aboit the “born this way” narrative. living is changing and experimenting. trying to galvanise people into one specific identity for life is just another face of cis-heteronormativity. we need to be free to be our authentic selves in every moment, as we feel in that moment.
A lot of narratives like “born this way” are oversimplified by design so cishet people can begin to comprehend it. And sometimes they can’t even understand that.
They were “born that way,” but some people take a while to figure out what exactly “that way” is.
Was I born this way though? That question might not even make sense, humans are very complicated and constantly changing. “Born this way” is a retort to the “it’s just a phase” argument, but I think it misses the mark. Perhaps it’s a phase, perhaps not, why should it matter?
We can philosophize about how hidden variables control how people develop, and those variables may exist, but that’s really just a scientific curiosity, it should have no bearing on how we treat people.
the more i learn about humans the more one thing becomes clear to me: humans are incredibly good at adapting to new environments and accepting them as their new normal.
we are so incredibly shaped by our environments, i doubt there is much essential about people other than maybe a few inherent tendencies. that doesnt mean tho that people dont aquire attributes during their lives that become basically impossible to change. what has been unleashed once might be impossible to lock away ever again.
but whether inherent or not doesnt matter, because imo we should always let people be the way they wanna be and support them, unless they are being harmful (by a libertairian understnading), which is when we should try to help them or at least protect ourselves from them.
Yeah, I sometimes wonder what if [something] went differently in my life when I was younger, but I realize that future “me” is a different person. Maybe I would’ve preferred to have been them, maybe not, but I’m not them and I don’t want to be them now.
Was I born this way though?
The original ‘born this way’ movement wasn’t so much to imply people are ‘X’ way and there’s nothing that changes, it was a response to (Christians) claiming that people we being made gay, or that they chose to be gay instead of ‘what they were born as’ which was heteronormative stuff. It was the idea you could ‘anti-gay’ it out of them.
Now though, of course you’re right, there’s no ‘way you are born’ and everyone grows and changes as they age and experience. At the time though we were fighting a post-Reagan society that was hell-bent on turning back as many societal acceptances as possible (sound familiar? :( )
So yes it’s both out of date and not entirely correct, but the spirit is why it’s still used, I think. 2SLGBTQIA+ aren’t a monolith, and I don’t speak for everyone, I just lived through it.
It’s because if you think you’re gay and kiss the same gender then discover you weren’t actually gay, you become tainted forever and upon death your soul turns into a cold sore in someone’s mouth instead of going to the Promised Land to play the harp with everyone else. Or something that makes about as much sense as that.
cooties 😔
Also, children are too young to see a couple who love each other unless they’re heterosexual.
The world would be such a better place if the majority of people understood that statistically uncommon does not mean there is a problem when they encounter the uncommon in the world
I was 11 years old when I came to the realization that I am gay. Granted, I was also unusual in that I was a male who went through precocious puberty starting around age 8 so that might’ve altered the timeline a bit.
So… Presumption of asexuality?
Sounds nice
No? Society presumes heterosexuality?
that’s what it does now
Imagine having anything about yourself figured out by the time you hit 30.
I know that I like mangoes. Got that figured out at least
At 30 I did not like fish, but shrimp was okay. Now I am allergic to shrimp (violent vomiting) and really like fish, especially if I catch and cook it.
I think we all just constantly change, just to a lesser degree the older you get. I don’t think it’s settling into “who you are” so much as just having less and less elasticity in your personality to accomodate the change.
Mayhaps. But if I ever stop liking mangoes please end me. Life is not worth living without those fruits from the gods. ಥ╭╮ಥ
Am 31, still figuring shit out.
Everyday is a learning opportunity, it’s up to you whether to seize it or not.
It… It doesn’t stop 😭
I think that’s a personal thing. I more or less knew who i was going to be/develop into by the age of maybe 13.
If you don’t trust your future adults, than why should they trust you. Ageism at its finest.
this rules
Idk if I trust teens to know they are allocishet - hard to know if its just societal pressure brainwashing them into believing it. /hj
Speaking as a boring cishet guy, I know it would have taken some major, science fiction-level brainwashing to get me to stop liking the girls I went to high school with, and/or start being interested in the boys. “Societal pressure” would not have been nearly enough.
It’s much more humane, and kind, to simply accept and support people.
I use to think I was cis and het too. Up until my late 20’s. Turns out I was wrong on both. Still don’t think we should start assuming people who say they are cishet are just delusional though.
I didn’t figure out I was nonbinary and asexual until my mid twenties. I had an entire gender crisis in high school too. But at the time I didn’t know either were things you could be so I’d just concluded that I was cis, but that I was deeply uncomfortable with the expectations society puts on boys/men.
Sexuality was an even wilder journey. Not only did I initially think I was heterosexual but I was outright homophobic. Turned out to be that I was mistaking being uncomfortable at overt sexual advances as dislike of gay people. I didn’t have the same problem with women because “of course I like girls, I just haven’t found The One™©® yet” lol. Then when I finally thought about it more I realized that I didn’t really feel any differently about men and women so I must be bi. Finally I eventually realized “Yeah dumbass, 0 = 0. Good job.”
When I was in high school, I was confused how other autistic people could be trans because I couldn’t understand how they’d have a gender without buying into the socially constructed bit. So me considering myself technically cis-by-default was primarily because of not knowing agender was an option.
In terms of sexuality, I preferred that some people thought I was gay and I had even considered I might be some sort of ace-spec, but didn’t realize horny ace was an option and probably mistook some envy and non-sexual attraction as sexual attraction.
Seeing them get some support and positive reinforcement makes me incredibly happy
Ship. Ship. Ship!
