An Israeli missile has hit Iran, two US officials have told the BBC’s US partner CBS News.
Iranian state media is reporting that flights have been suspended over several cities, according to Associated Press.
Iran has been on high alert after Israel said it would respond to an Iranian attack against it on Saturday night
It would have been nice if this world wasn’t run by fucking children.
literally every anarchist has been saying this for centuries.
whatever your politics, welcome to team ‘at least some of the people in the room should be adults, we have nukes floating around ffs’
Great, like that the world, nukes included, would be ruled by the strongest, which often aren’t the brightest of us.
youre thinking of ancaps.
That’s not something I know about, mind putting me in the loop?
In any case, I was sarcastic if that wasn’t obvious. There is good people among anarchists, as well as among those who aren’t. But not having rules make it way easier for the bad apples to get their way with it, as with them it requires a lot more investment and careful planing to break them.
Anarchism, like most other social organisation theory, isn’t immune to mass manipulation, coercion, or similar techniques used by the few to impose their view and interest to the broader masses.
As far as I understand, Anarchism doesn’t mean no rules, it means no rulers. No hierarchy of people.
The rules would be set up in such a way to actively discourage individual accumulation of power as much as possible. But a system like that could still have rules, just enforced collectively instead of power being parceled out to individuals. I think there are a lot of practical ways you can try to reduce power accumulation, like term limits is a very obvious example that is a concept we are familiar with. Or like ways of reducing wealth inequality can also be seen as a way of trying to reduce hierarchy.
I don’t know all the theory, I honestly feel like that kinda shit isn’t always the most useful anyways. But there are obvious things we can do now to reduce hierarchy and they seem like things that would be good. Having an ideological stance that hierarchy is bad, and we should reduce it as much as possible… that’s Anarchism.
Anarchy is not not having rules, it’s not having rulers.
Think democracy of the purest form. Not elected (and bribed corrupt) representatives who pay themselves from our pockets to push their own agendas.
what exactly is this argument you’re making? would it not apply to switching to democracy? would it not apply to moving towards liberalism? how come when it comes to going further left suddenly “no system is perfect” arguments come out as if better needs to be perfect
therefore you must put the few in charge without contest? compromise with tyrants? edit: except forgetting to negotiate for yourself, and being all in on team tyrant?
sorry I dont mean to sound rude, its just it always sounds like a christian standing up in the pews, proclaiming that the pastor is being corrupted by the devil, and declaring that he’s done with this blasphemous church, and he’s starting his own church (of the devil. but not in like the cool way, because he’s a christian)
it just sounds like an excuse to not try. and its not like there aren’t measures to take; forms of organization, social leveling conventions, etc.
sounds like you don’t know what the word sarcasm means. is the word you were looking for ‘flippant’? its a good word and I’m sad I don’t see it more, so I hope you did.
so yeah its not perfect? nothing is? but most criticisms of anarchist thought seem to just be describing the present as what-if, and most of the ‘solutions’ to ‘avoiding’ those involve ‘let’s just do that on purpose right now!’. including this one. the point is resistance and resilience, not immunity. also like human dignity and well being and flourishing and junk.
whatever your politics, welcome to team
Nothing an old anarchist hates more than a new anarchist. They ruined anarchism, I tell you!
Epstein already proved that and allegedly a Mossad agent. How much blackmail does Bibi have on Biden?
Biden expressed his love for israel way before Netanyahu was a political candidate.
True dat… Biden, “I’m a Zionist,” knows his place.
Israel is doing its part by killing them all.
Demented sociopathic children. Normal children would do a better job.
Fuck Netanyahu.
If he starts WW3 he can get fucked… though we should try and grant asylum to all current residents of Palestine and Isreal.
If he starts WW3 he can get fucked… though we should try and grant asylum to all current residents of Palestine and Isreal.
You can rest well that russian cunt Putin has already warmed up the engine for WW3
Team Rocket powered nuclear bomb will do it together.
Prepare for trouble, make it double.
Removed by mod
Israel is not “the Jews”. You might think it’s pedantic but now is really not the time to make that generalisation.
As a Jew who is against Israeli apartheid and genocide, thank you.
Some Jews are absolute cunts. Most are decent people. Which makes Jews exactly the same as everyone else imo
I see you’ve met some of my relatives.
Sounds like some of my relatives, but I’m German. No assholes there…
Clue Holder
/s for those who don’t have one.
Removed by mod
I’m not prepared to be the kind of asshole to condemn a whole race of people. The majority of Germans supported Hitler and then the war ended and they’ve gotten a lot fucking better.
I’d be happy to accept any Isrealis that are willing to abandon ship.
not a race. fuck that racist bullshit.
if they already left; vet their shit, make sure they’re not still affiliated, and sure. dont hold the shit hole they were born in against them. but starting now, when they’re just afraid? nah. main lesson from world war 2 was we didn’t kill enough Nazis.
However you want to group or define Isreali citizens you are making a too broad generalization.
I don’t really care? they have been unwilling to stop for longer than I have been alive. they’ve been offered the moon,and turned it down, because they prefer genocide. they haven’t stopped. they haven’t had substantial internal strife or attempted revolutions or internal assassinations of particularly warmongery leaders.
their soldiers literally sing while they do atrocities, their prime minister says it, their citizens say it, their children say it.
Not a single joule of energy should be wasted attempting to preserve “Israeli” life. not ever. to do otherwise would be an insult to their victims. stopping this genocide and world war three must come first.
I dunno, maybe you think 1 genocidal pedophile life is worth global thermonuclear war. I guess agree to disagree?
Jews are an ethnic group, culture, and religion, but not a race. It’s a common enough misconception spread via the media. Also any given Jew is not necessarily all three.
The lesson from World War II is that war can only delay the spread of an idea, but not destroy it. Ideas have to be fought with other ideas. Killing Nazis only bought us time to think of better ideas, spread them, and deradicalize people. Thanks to conservative propaganda networks and social media, we’re on the verge of a fascist takeover. We are in an information race against fascists. The fascists are turning the US into a christofascist dictatorship, by controlling the narrative and driving the news cycle, not by killing anyone. We have to beat them in this race to stop them.
“Race” has no biological definition. Star Wars fans can be a race if you want them to.
Typically when people are saying Jews are a race, they referring to the idea that Jews are not White, as in they cannot be White. Jews can be White, but they can also be Black, Native American or Hispanic. Jews are not in a racial category that excludes them from being part of these groups. That’s what I was referring to when I wrote race.
That’s not really the main point, I was agreeing with the person I responding to and adding some clarification. It seemed to have distracted from the issue at hand.
Killing people isn’t how we stop the spread of fascism in the modern day. We need to spread information, for example, that fascism is a self-destructive ideology that will destroy hundreds of millions of lives and that the Republican Party is controlled by fascists. I think most people know that on lemmy, but there are plenty of people who will check into politics in the months leading up to the election and form their opinions then. A misconception I see on lemmy is that some people assume we can defeat fascism with guns alone. That isn’t going to cut it. We have to reach more people with true information before fascists reach them with misinformation. Once a person forms an opinion they are unlikely to discard that opinion when presented with new information in the short term. That short term can easily last until the election, so these months leading up to the election are crucial. edit: capitalization
Race is a well documented biological fact actually. It’s not subject to political interpretation.
By Alan Templeton.
According to Templeton’s research, perceived differences in races are more related to cultural perceptions and biases than any underlying genetic reality.[5] For example, Templeton’s statistical analysis of the human genome shows that much greater genetic diversity exists between populations of chimpanzees than humans from different parts of the world.[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Templeton
Do you think maybe you’re misunderstanding him?
From your source:
Humans have much genetic diversity, but the vast majority of this diversity reflects individual uniqueness and not race.
And
The question of the existence of human “races” now becomes the question of the existence of human subspecies.
… One definition regards races as geographically circumscribed populations within a species that have sharp boundaries that separate them from the remainder of the species (Smith, Chiszar, & Montanucci, 1997).
… A second definition defines races as distinct evolutionary lineages within a species. An evolutionary lineage is a population of organisms characterized by a continuous line of descent such that the individuals in the population at any given time are connected by ancestor/descendent relationships.
And
It is critical to note that genetic differentiation alone is insufficient to define a subspecies or race under either of these definitions of race.
You seem to have linked something that argues and shows the opposite of what you intended there, bud.
Why not pretend breeds of horses don’t exist while you’re at it?
Breeds are used to refer to domestic animals where artificial selection was used to exemplify specific traits.
Are you saying that the traits of different “races” were artificially selected for? Who was doing the selecting?
Israeli is not the same thing as Jewish.
Many Jewish people hate Israel.
Israeli is not the same thing as Jewish.
Yes, I am Jewish, but not Israeli. I assumed most people referring to Israelis as a race are referring to Jews a race. It seems weird to confuse nationality with race in the 21st century.
Many Jewish people hate Israel.
I don’t hate Israel, because hating Israel is more taxing to me than it is to Israel. I think Israel is an apartheid state that’s committing genocide and war crimes in Gaza, Zionism is a fascist ideology, the current Israeli government is dominated by fascists, and that the concept that we need a Jewish ethnostate in order to be safe is ridiculous. Israel needs to change radically and it needs to change as soon as possible.
I’d be willing to bet you could find one or two Israelies (Israelites?) that hate Israel too.
Israeli is modern inhabitants, Israelites are the ones from the old testament
I thought one of the best lessons was that you don’t deal with an aggressive and genocidal nation through appeasement.
We should be fighting against Israel, not appeasing them.
I thought one of the best lessons was that you don’t deal with an aggressive and genocidal nation through appeasement.
That was also one of the lessons. It’s why we are sending weapons to Ukraine to fight Russia and plan on defending Taiwan against China.
We should be fighting against Israel, not appeasing them.
It would be a lot easier to do that if we hadn’t be allied with Israel for over 75 years. It’s not normal for allies to turn on each other like that.
Regardless, there can be more than one lesson from a historical event. Fascism is an idea. It has to be fought with other ideas.
that was the lesson from the start. that theres one way to stop fascism and genocide both.
the lesson from the end was: you didn’t kill enough fucking Nazis.
who the fuck mentioned Jews here?
I’m talking about Israelis, cut your equivocating antisemitic bullshit. talk like that gets people killed by idiots who can’t tell the difference, but know genocide is bad and Nazis dying is good.
we didn’t stop Nazism because we didn’t kill enough Nazis, on either side of the ocean. the fuckers who got social media in on it can be traced back to that. if we’d killed more Nazis then, we wouldn’t have these problems now.
who the fuck mentioned Jews here? I’m talking about Israelis, cut your equivocating antisemitic bullshit.
If someone refers to Israelis as a race I would assume they are confusing Jews, an ethnic group, culture and religion as a race as opposed to confusing Israelis, a nationality, as a race.
we didn’t stop Nazism because we didn’t kill enough Nazis, on either side of the ocean. the fuckers who got social media in on it can be traced back to that. if we’d killed more Nazis then, we wouldn’t have these problems now.
Even if we had killed everyone who was a Nazi, the ideas could be still be spread by people who are not Nazis and then internalized and adopted by a new group of Nazis. Ideas outlive the people came up with them and believed in them. The best that would do is kick the can further down the road, but we still have to deal with this problem eventually.
don’t think I referred to tfem as a race but I could have. I’m not super likely to bother scrolling up for a hezbarite though.
the ideas could have been spread by people who weren’t Nazis, but were I’m this actual extant timeline spread by actual Nazis.
american civil war was the same. every one of those slaver families needed to die. every adult, and possibly the children, if they weren’t adopted out (possibly to the people who should have got the property and would have done the raising if the slavers had won anyway). yes that’s technically genocide, but I’m saying it should have happened to some of my shitty ancestors, and I still think I’m right. that culture of keeping human beings imprisoned as chattel slaves needed to die, and because we left them alive; it didn’t.
The Germans during WWII actually were referring to nationality when talking about race, so that one slides believe it or not.
its so much dumber than that. it kind of comes down to mystical bullshit and oh hey, that’s in this one too
but theres this kapo trash tendency to draw equivalency with all Jewish people in the world and smear their crimes onto the innocent
Didn’t know “Aryan” is a nationality.
Solidarity amongst the working class, where ever they may be.
acceptable wars:
-
class war
-
stopping genocide
if you fail at either, so many die.
How does refusing asylum to working class Israeli refugees advance the class war or stop genocide?
I’m sorry but being a laborer doesn’t magically make someone my friend.
genocide is genocide, and they all participate. not one joule.
Do they all participate though? A coworker of mine is in Isreal right now caring for her mother, she grew up in Isreal and was staunchly antiwar. She’s once again an Isreali resident - does she deserve to die?
Do the three year olds deserve to die to? Do they deserve to be made orphans?
Please realize that you’re so far gone that you’re advocating for the erasure of a state… your stance is one that Netanyahu would applaud.
its not about deserving to die. its about going literally an inch out of your way to save one while stopping a genocide. which you shouldn’t. saying otherwise is an insult to their victims.
-
Israeli people deserve to live just as much as Palestinian people do.
no. that isn’t to say they should be killed, but wasting a joule of energy to keep one alive is a waste.
I vehement disagree.
you commit a genocide, you are no longer the priority. your victims come first. everyone else comes first. you are no longer human.
if they want to save you, your victims can do it. but literally every other person on earth gets falgsc before I offer you a grain of rice, or steer my car out of the way to avoid hitting you.
honestly, a policy where food etc aid is only allowed to these genocidal monsters through Palestinians is pretty reasonable. it would be a way to beat some humanity into them, but they must be allowed to die, so the Palestinian people’s goodwill is the only way they survive.
Never in the history of the world has grouping literally everyone of a particular group together has gone poorly, except for all the time. To say every Israel is culpable is factually untrue. Hold the accountable accountable.
only way to stop the genocide.
so who would you rather share a world with?
genocidal warmongering ghouls whose reproductive cycle falters without attocies, who are edging on world war three?
or Palestinians? because I would rather have Palestinians.
if you don’t like this choice, you should have stepped on the bastards 20-50 years ago.
Removed, genocidal content.
He is a bloodthirsty idiot of the worst kind
Oh FFS. This had better be an extremely limited response to Iran’s response to Israel’s bombing of an embassy. Here’s hoping it’s just the same type of symbolic attack that Iran made last weekend - all show and no intent. Just Israel refusing to let anyone else have the last word.
Anything more serious and things are about to become very messy and even more expensive. Although it would explain why Israel is suddenly arranging to get dozens of jets from the US in the last month or so. Lord knows they don’t seem necessary if the only goal is to keep blowing up Palestinians.
Although it would explain why Israel is suddenly arranging to get dozens of jets from the US in the last month or so.
Forgive what feels like a nitpick, but we should take a moment for wider historical scorn. WaPo at the end of March:
Last week, the State Department authorized the transfer of 25 F-35A fighter jets and engines worth roughly $2.5 billion, U.S. officials said. The case was approved by Congress in 2008, so the department was not required to provide a new notification to lawmakers.
Biden owns the fuckup, but it comes after all the shit Israel put the administrations of Dubya, Obama, and Individual 1 through, and after all the atrocities upon the Great March of Return and the other surges of conflict. The planes could fill another allies’ order, the MIC could get their warbucks, and Joey could have kicked the can down the road, but here we are.
why the fuck do they have f-35s?
the Americans aren’t even giving peripheral NATO countries f-35’s, are they?
why the fuck are they getting f-35’s?
even RPing as an american imperialist, I cannot think of a reason other than ‘for the evulz’.
ugh that makes sense.
is… is Donald trump the less apocalyptic option?
is… is Donald trump the less apocalyptic option?
are you serious?
that’s why I’m fucking shocked. all biden has to do is just fucking… well at this point he needs to glass the shit hole, but all he had to do last month was stop.
Yes, the US nuking Israel would definitely be less apocalyptic…
I choose Ranked Choice voting
Damn. 80 year old man was not the easy fight i thought it was gonna be.
I pick marijuana
Suffocated by tits
Best we can do is this
Immediate nonexistance after a happy life.
What do you mean by “peripheral” NATO countries? If you mean NATO countries other than the US, then I can inform you that some do have F-35 jets.
feel like youre missing the point here, maybe kind of on purpose.
You did ask a question that I attempted to answer… That does not entail in any way that I did not understand the other stuff you wrote nor that I dismissed it.
no? like I know France helped design the thing, so obviously they’re getting them, but I know Poland and turkey dont have them yet, and I dont think they’re going to soon.
the point is theyre not going to the people who serve amrrica’s military interests.
Poland waiting has little to do with politics and more to do with when contracts were signed. They only signed in 2020.
Turkey is trying to develop their own 5th generation fighter after getting kicked out of the f35 program due to being a leaky sieve sending data to the Russians. That’s on them.
By and large, the wait elsewhere is mostly to do with the bad reputation the program got before it was operational. Now that it’s all in the past and it’s proving to be an excellent fighter, contracts with allies are coming in faster than they can be produced. That’s the price of waiting.
That’s a fair point, no need to apologize for keeping me accurate. I had read and forgotten that detail honestly, because in my head I lump the two deals together - the other one being the new $18 billion contract for F-15s that Biden’s administration is seeking approval for currently. I think I mentally shorthand it to “arrangements for new jets going to Israel” but there is definitely detail involved as you point out.
Measured retaliation leads to measured retaliation leads to measured retaliation…
It’s fucking hard but Isreal suffered minimally from Iran’s bullshit aggression - Netanyahu could “be the bigger man” without losing any face.
Real leaders - real manly men - real strong people of any stripe - those are the people who have the strength to forgive and compromise.
Israel bombed their embassy first, full stop. What are you on about? Iran had a right to defend itself.
Bibi, who has never shown a modicum of restraint when there’s potential for bloodshed, isn’t going to change course until the US forces him to by withholding funding. Considering how Zionist Biden and 2/3 of Congress are, that ain’t happening, so buckle up for some real shit “leadership,” Jack.
Was that first? The embassy bombing was certainly before Iran’s counter attack but if you’re searching for justification then it’s not like Iran and Isreal were buddies before this. Iran has repeatedly funded Hezbollah launching rockets into Isreal and funded the Houthi rebels attacking shipping.
My point was that constantly retaliating is an unhealthy cycle and your take away was that “But actually it’s okay if it’s in retaliation.” Wut.
And Bibi funded Hamas, his (now realized) end-goal being to destabilize the region and provide cover for further Israeli violence and land grabs from the indigenous people.
I agree with you on tit-for-tat bringing about undesirable results, but you lost me on “Iran’s bullshit aggression.” Israel is 6mo+ in all-out genocidal warfare on innocent Palestinian civilians, and still maintains this stems from their “right to defend themselves.” Iran on the other hand exercised immense restraint, coordinated with western powers, and executed a highly telegraphed counter-offensive focused exclusively on military targets in Israel as an overly nice way to say “please don’t bomb our stuff.” In this way I think Iran’s counter-attack was in fact beyond justified. Unless you meant it was bullshit in that it was entirely orchestrated, but I doubt that was your intent.
Netenyahu, being the absolute child that he is, had to strike again anyway. This is in fact unjustified and unprovoked, but to use your own terminology it appears Iran will be the “bigger man” and doesn’t plan on further hostile action. Again highly coordinated with the west, in order to walk on eggshells around the unhinged Israeli government.
The fact of the matter is this: Bibi is a far-right war mongering zealot who needs to be deposed immediately. The US is despicable for providing him cover the way they have. Despite who’s in charge in Israel, they at least offer their citizens basic social safety nets like universal healthcare and paid family leave. America doesn’t have these things, yet it can afford to send Israel 10s of billions to continue murdering brown children?! Israel are warmongers, and America is shameful for backing them.
Bombing consulates and embassies is a nazi move.
“Iran’s aggression”
Another day another banger from sh.itjust.works
Iran was aggressive in their retaliation - how the fuck else would you describe launching rockets into another country?
Whether that retaliation was justified is separate from the fact that it was aggressive.
It killed 0 unlike the Israeli attack. Pls zip it back up after you are done.
Au contraire, it was defense and very mild at that. If Israel can kill 40,000+ people because “wE hAvE a rIgHt tO dEfEnD oUrSeLvEs” Iran absolutely can volley some missiles in response to Zionist actions
Neither is justified.
No, it is extremely justified to respond to an attack on an embassy
It’s also extremely justified to respond to someone launching missiles at you. Are you really that much of an idiot that you can’t see how this ends or are you just arguing in bad faith?
Although it would explain why Israel is suddenly arranging to get dozens of jets from the US in the last month or so
That’s just a quid pro quo kickback between the corporatocracy.
“We’ll channel more tax payer money through your military industrial complex if you let us continue with our nationalist ethnostate genocide… We may even start another gulf war and channel trillion$ more”
It’s certainly not 300 drones and rockets.
Can we fucking not
we? yes.
biden, evangelicals, and “Israelis”? no. no they physically must do the worst most destructive shit.
The US was aware of the Israeli attack plans, according to CNN. If the US is shooting down Iranian missiles, why don’t they shoot down Israeli missiles as well? Nothing good will happen from any sort of missile exchange in that region.
Israelimissiles*American missiles
Lol
This guy hegemons 💪
So, are they going back to opposing the invasion of Rafah, then?
You know, seeing as how Israel just got concessions for promising not to do a thing, then immediately went and did the thing regardless.
Or does Biden just have a humilation fetish? Which fine, no kink-shaming here but maybe keep it in the bedroom.
I have to admit, the phrase ‘lifestyle democrat’ has a nice ring to it…
wild how Iran launched missiles at Israel and then was struck by Israeli missiles… the Israeli missiles weren’t launched, though. They just sprang into existence above Iran
Importantly, Iran’s missiles did not strike Israel, they were shot down in flight.
The same way that a lot of Hollywood dicks were sucked. By Nancy Reagan
I wish the EU would grow a backbone and tell the US to stop stoking fires in our backyard
Germany and Italy are also big on giving aid to Israel so Idk if the EU is going to be able to help either.
Germany pretty much makes it illegal to even say anything negative about Israel
It is not illegal. You will only get publicly humiliated, have your house raided on bullshit reasons and if you get any government funding for anything you did, you can say bye bye to that. Especially if you are jewish and dissenting to the zionist agenda. Jews are disproportionaly targeted by these measures. Because nothing protects Jews form antisemitism, like targeting Jews that “stepped out of line” in the eyes of the pro zionist government.
I don’t have the link handy but I read that Jews make up about 1% of the population of Germany and have been the accused in about 30% of the cases of antisemitism, lol.
I don’t disagree with you there. Labeling people as antisemetic and a Nazi has been used as a weapon for a long time to target anyone that went against the Zionist agenda.
Germany is also the second-largest provider of aid to Palestinians since 1948 and was the largest provider of food last year.
I wish the EU would fucking invade the US already. Either put us out of our misery or save us, either way, it stops our leaders from spreading the evil and murder around the globe.
Some capitalist will sell the USA for profit, just give them a little more time. They already tried once
A good Wikipedia dive, Smedley Butler seems an interesting person to read about.
Irresponsible decision from Israel, the initial exchange seemed justified with no reason to escalate things.
It wasn’t justified by israel the first time either. Anyone with iq above room temperature knows Israel is doing all of this for a reason .
To drag the US into an Afghanistan-style quagmire conflict with Iran, something American evangelicals and far-right military gumbas have been chomping at the bit for since the Carter Administration?
John Bolton literally has made this his life’s mission and has been working non-stop for it
We don’t want to go to war in the middle east. You are 100 percent right that some conservatives have been after that forever. Luckily I hope that as a nation we have grown past policing the world and being involved by sending troops. We can’t handle another war right now.
Welp…
I hope Kate Winslet has sex with me before I die
don’t worry i’m sure the us and uk will come out as forcefully against this as they did against iran right?
Listen, Israel has a right to exist, and part of Israeli’s existence is firing missiles at its neighbors, so maybe back off and stop being anti-Semitic about this why dontcha?
This is too subtle for the internet, or at least I hope it is
don’t worry im gay so i roll advantage on sarcasm checks
Did Fallout release at the perfect time?
" I don’t want to set the world on fire, oh fuck it, yes I do." - Netanyahu
1997?
This is 53 years early according to the lore. Not sure if we can make it that long.
I think you mean 70 years late? That was definitely the 50s in the show.
No, the Great War in the Fallout universe happened in 2077. The 50s revival was just the fashion at that time.
Just like the 50s were a time when technological advances were spreading rapidly, the Great War happened during the time of technological breakthroughs like personal assistant robots and fusion power.
Ok, that does explain some things. But it seemed to me like the technology is all kind of slow and bulky. The mech suits, and the doc was able to outrun those turrets. I thought that was because it was the 50s when the war happened, but I guess not?
Wait.
So, in response to the 300 weapon systems that US/Israel roughly blocked all of. (1 casualty from defensive shrapnel)
In turn Israel launched 1 missile, and it hit?
Ooof.
that US/Israel roughly blocked
Israel, the US, the UK, Jordan, and Egypt. Israel didn’t do it on their own.
Based on US and EU reports, Israel intercepted very few of them. The US alone claimed more than half, and the EU+Jordan was another roughly 25%
ive been saying it for a long time, but you make a choice every day: do you want the possibility of world peace, or do you want to draw ‘protocols of the elders of zion’ fanfic on your maps.
and I guess they’re just hungry for fanfic.
I’d be careful about considering Israel’s defense as a complete success, or at least an easy one. According to Israeli sources cited in this article, achieving that result cost Israel as much as $1-1.3 billion USD, and I can’t find out if that includes the price of interception by other countries - a lot of the heavy lifting was done by the USA after all. Given that they say that’s the cost for Israel specifically, I don’t think it does but I can’t find sources. Regardless, it’s a big bill for an attack that everyone knew was coming days in advance and gives a sense of the economics involved in an open war several times more intense.
It’s also incredibly significant for future missile attack that all their radars turned on and all those intercept assets are revealed and clocked and analyzed. Assuming a video going around portrays what it claims, Hezbollah even zeroed in and missiled an Iron Dome launcher site during the attack.
Counterbattery in general is fucking hard. If the proxy can pull that shit off, you had better expect the state actor to take even greater advantage.
Iran also gave notice of their attacks.
It was costly, but the relative cost to Iran to launch the attack was far larger.
Source? Because the articles I can find such as this one from Reuters say very much the opposite: “Although Israeli officials have given no details, according to calculations by a number of analysts, the price of Iran’s attack probably amounted to $80 million to $100 million — but cost Israel and its allies around $1 billion to repel.”
Here’s another analysis: “Experts have calculated the cost of the April 13 attack for Iran at $100-$200 million — perhaps five to ten times less than what Israel spent to repel it. That means a huge recurring bill if Iran were to keep attacking.” They go through the math of it and cite specific weapon systems costs.
I’ll wait to see if you can back up your assertion, but I’m quite skeptical at time of writing.
Key word relative. The US did the vast majority of the heavy lifting. $1B is 0.0625% of the US military budget. $100M is 0.4% of Iran’s, nearly an order of magnitude more costly relatively, more than one if it’s on the high side.
That would only be a fair comparison if the US was willing to devote it’s entire military budget to these actions the way Iran can. It would also assume that the US can (and is willing to) spend 1 billion dollars + costs required with overseas operations every time Iran spends 100M on missiles. Iran broke the top 15 for military spending a few years ago so they’re going to have decent capabilities when it comes to being a pain.
It also ignores the cost of dealing with Iranian proxies like Hezbollah and the Houthi, which has Pentagon officials worried as detailed in this article “A $2M missile vs. a $2,000 drone: Pentagon worried over cost of Houthi attacks.”. I’m definitely not cheering for Iran, but I don’t think your total budget vs. total budget comparison is true to the actual economics of a US defense of Israel in the case of sustained attacks. Or even relative cost given that the US has it’s budget spread across many more pursuits than this region.
To add to that, every commitment to defending Israel while it is provoking and escalating things in the region, means less resources to Ukraine. So if the western European countries are committing more to helping Israel in its bullshit, that shifts the power balance in Europe more in Putins favor.
So it is not only about the relative cost to cost and relative cost to economy/budget but also relative from budget to budget.
Sounds like drones as well according to BBC.
Who would win; tens of billions of dollars worth of US-built air defence systems, or whatever surplus scrap the Chinese or Russians have flogged to Iran recently
All is going according to plan:
WHICH PATH TO PERSIA? Options for a New American Strategy toward Iran
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I did. It’s all going as planned. Found a vidya that summarizes it.
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For those curious: it’s just an analysis by the Brookings think tank. It has nothing to do with the official position of US agencies.
And for bonus points, it’s basically just a list of every possible approach, starting with diplomatic approaches at the top:
- diplomacy
- military intervention
- regime change
- doing nothing at all
It’s “all going to plan” in the same way “guessing all 52 cards in the deck until one of them is right” is a magic trick
Actually given your comment, it’s more like someone else listing all the cards until it’s right, and then just saying “tada” when they say the right one
I just provided a link that shows sometimes those guesses have merit. But continue to dismiss those trying to provide background information. I’m sure it won’t lead us like it did in Iraq or to WW3.
Edit: Let’s look at the careers of the signees of this foreign policy document:
So, this paper isn’t just for fun. These people are CIA, ambassadors, advisors and served in administrations. This is the shit that gets things done in Washington. To dismiss it is negligent.
I, too, enjoy reading only half a comment.
The issue isn’t “providing background context,” it’s presenting an advisory document of all the possible approaches to a diplomatic scenario as being some sort of conspiracy, rather than the result of some people literally just doing the job they are paid to do.
By just linking an enormous document and presenting it as if it were some massive revelation, you’re basically just relying on people not bothering to read the document and accepting the inference that the document actually just says only the thing that has happened.
Yeah, sure. War is spontaneous, and not planned at all. It’s not a revelation or conspiracy, it’s years of groundwork and planning. I displayed that war with Iran has been in the works for at least a decade. You- it’s a conspiracy.
You’re (intentionally?) misunderstanding literally every sentence of my comment
Does the document “Which Path to Persia” exist?
Is the Brookings Institute a reputable think tank that advises government foreign policy?
Does the document suggest a procedure for conflict and regime change in Iran?
If all of this is true, my statement still stands. Practically every decision America makes towards Iran has been planned and contemplated.
the result of some people literally just doing the job they are paid to do
So. A plan. Just like I stated in my original comment.
No, these people are former CIA, ambassadors, etc that have pivoted to a think tank, which is common. There is a revolving door just like in any ecosystem of industries/entities that overlap. Also, the document addresses multiple strategies.
former CIA. lol 😂 Revolving door! Your words.
I never said this attack is in the document. I’m only showing that the Warhawks in and out of think tanks in the government have been contemplating and planning for a war with Iran.
The military and think tanks plan for everything. But no, they have no plans for Iran. Just lots of former government officials earning 3 figure salaries for funsies.
Yes, every professional field has adjacent areas of operation. Geneticists aren’t going to work in astrophysics and truck drivers aren’t suddenly going to child education conferences. That’s what the revolving door refers to. Shocking, I know.
Point?
For those curious: the Project for the New American Century (PNAC) was a think tank in D.C. that provided the blueprint for the war in Iraq.
Of the twenty-five people who signed PNAC’s founding statement of principles, ten went on to serve in the administration of U.S. President George W. Bush, including Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, and Paul Wolfowitz.[8][9][10][11] Observers such as Irwin Stelzer and Dave Grondin have suggested that the PNAC played a key role in shaping the foreign policy of the Bush Administration, particularly in building support for the Iraq War.
This is important, pinning it for now.
Let’s keep the discussion here and not post it 14 more times.
You heard it folks, 13 more times is ok!
:P
Lmao inverse whataboutism
