That’s not weird. That’s how functional societies reconcile when they aren’t subjected to endless propaganda and fear mongering.
I mean, it is weird in the sense that it is unusual. But that doesn’t make it bad, in fact it should become more normal.
I’d go so far as to say it’s bad that it is unusual
Yeah, I wouldn’t say history shows humans usually treat outsiders really nicely but I agree this should be an example we strive for.
i came to say this. being friends is healthy and normal.
I’m just so fuckin burnt out on xenophobia and i feel like that shit got pushed on me a lot growing up.
That’s just what I’d expect from your kind
/s
Making friends? In this economy!?/s
With these social bubbles?!
They got the good ending
I still don’t think the natives got the good deal here
Who’s to say?
I was going to joke about an Amish casino, but then I remembered the move Kingpin
True. Ideally the Amish would have a “immigrated”, assimilated, and become another tribe in the area hundreds of years ago. However, this is still a better outcome than the tribes still litigating treaties signed hundreds of years ago, like in Oklahoma.
Migration leading to mixed cultures instead of genocide and colonization. Americans: “This is so weird!”
“In this here melting pot, we burn away all our differences until we’re left with only the pure white flame of Christian nationalism.”
I had to put the statement in quotes because while being hyperbole, it’s not too far from how some people think, and I don’t want to be confused with those folks.
Are you implying Americans started colonization, or…?
It’s the result of colonization.
They’re implying that the US was founded on migration which led to genocide and colonization.
That actually sounds awesome
The true American dream
I want to see a picture. In mind, it looks pretty dope.
I don’t think jewelry wearing is compatible with the Amish conception of propriety and modesty but I’m not going to say it wouldn’t happen.
My grandpa rents some of his fields out to an amish guy who also rents a lot of other fields in the area. The amish in our area are known to be pretty loose with their rules so my grandpa wasn’t surprised when the guy showed up with combine harvester but he was kind of surprised with how new it was. My grandpa asked him how he could drive a combine when they weren’t allowed to drive cars. To which the amish guy responded, “Well, I don’t actually drive the combine; it drives itself. I just sit in it.”
Sounds like the Amish would be ok with a robotic vacuum as long as it charged itself from a solar panel.
Jewish people on Sabbat vibes.
Nice ha ha
Most based Amish dude I’ve ever heard about.
Good for them. Culture should evolve.
The “rules” the Amish live by are determined by the Elders of that group. They can be quite strict or fairly loose. And can vary by a fair bit from colony to colony even as neighbors. Cell phones can be fine for one group and be forbidden for the next.
Like some much in life, the rules are open to interpretation.
I saw some Amish or similar community teens freaking out in a Sheetz over the touch screens. They were having so much fun.
On top of that, many people will see a Mennonite and think “Amish.”
I’m one of those, but I will educate myself. Thanks for the information.
Right I get that, but the underlying value that the prohibitions are designed around is promoting humility and preventing vanity.
If the jewelery was given as a gift in good will, it would be worse to reject it or to accept it and never use it.
That sounds like pride and pride sounds like sin!
But they’re people. People can revisit and reconsider the values they live by. They can change things despite the tradition they were born into or even the tradition they helped establish. That allows the society to progress and survive changing conditions. Let’s support it.
Maybe it depends on the branch of Amish. I’ve heard the ones in the Midwest are a little more relaxed than the ones in Pennsylvania.
Everyone’s just making shit up based on their feelings anyway, let them do as they
wiltwill.wollen
The Amish around where I live (Midwest) run a bunch of great little stores (which is most of the contact I have with them personally, but my partners mom has friends in their community who come to visit now and then.) The stores all take credit cards and have refrigerators for the cheeses/dairy, and many of them do use machinery for farm work. Some even use cell phones.
I haven’t noticed any jewelry (haven’t paid attention), but they really do seem to pick and choose which portions to adhere strongly to.
My understanding is the faith has exclusions to the rules for when its necessary for work, so an Amish IT Administrator wouldn’t be impossible!
It mainly depends on if it makes them money or not.
That does, honestly, seem to be the threshold for the communities around me.
Can they use it in a way they can argue complied with their religion? If yes, and money, do thing. If yes, no money, do thing. If no, but money, try harder to argue, then do thing.
If no and no money, leave the community.
Yeah the more I’ve found out and paid attention over the past few decades. I think the Amish how they were originally envisioned, died out many many years ago.
The current ilk, use that perception to make money and at best give lip service to the original ideals.
I figure in 50 years Amish will be indistinguishable from any other modern religion.
I mean even now they are just another niche religious community… I get what they were going for, but…
Their communities have a lot of problems. Like a lot. And because they mostly have that year of going into the world (intended as a culture shock, but really is just an introduction to modern convenience technology, which is mmmmm so enticing) their numbers are dwindling. And that sucks for the culture loss, but I doubt they will even exist in 50 years, honestly.
Or say they do exist in 50 years… they will be the people buying all the cheap shit that doesn’t meet emission regulations because they “have to weigh each new innovation”.
For as long as I’ve lived in close proximity to Amish communities (most of my life, again Midwest), they have always made weird questionable allowances that I don’t really understand because I’m not part of the community. Most of them get around their religious limitation by just hiring someone, that’s why they need money. I know this because my family was hired on multiple occasions (because we often did poultry trades and other livestock deals with them) to operate machinery (chainsaws, modern farm equipment, etc) on their behalf.
And doesn’t that just seem like modernizing with more steps?
Also inbreeding is a huge issue, I know back in the nineties there was a big deal about the large communities (Midwest, PA, NC?) intermarrying to try and help the issues
Really depends on the community, some have cars.
Also worth noting often if you see what looks like Amish folks driving a car, especially if its for personal errands they’re often not Amish but Mennonite.
I very consistently manage to shop at the same time as one Mennonite family, so I’ll see them getting groceries then load up their car and drive home
That’s not weird, that’s how things should be. Working together.
agreed. technically, both are native.
Well no, the Amish were settlers too. They’re just working with the Indians instead of in spite of the Indians.
they were all born there. we need to stop considering ancestors and consider the living.
We can stop when we actually give them the same opportunities and protections white people get. You don’t get to oppress a population for 500 years and then just act like nothing happened.
did the current, living Amish oppress them? did I? did you? who is the “you” in your sentence?
Apparently it’s you, literally.
Which laws and policies specifically give preference to people with white skin?
Civil Asset Forfeiture, fleeing felon rule, subjective reasons for searches, qualified immunity…
Pretty much everything that allows for selective enforcement of laws.
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My native american father in law prefers to call himself an Indian.
From his point of view he wouldn’t call himself a “native american” because he belongs to an actual nation and indigenous people aren’t a homogenous group.
He prefers Indian because it makes white people look bad. Incredibly based
He prefers Indian because it makes white people look bad.
I know nothing else about him, but I like him already.
A sentiment I’ve heard a bunch is “oh, so you called us Indians and now you’re uncomfortable with that label? Well fuck you, you don’t get to keep unilaterally changing what’s acceptable. If thinking about colonialism makes you uncomfortable, then great! Start sitting with that discomfort and recognising the crumb of self determination that we express by identifying as Indians. You gave us that label, and it’s ours now.”
Me, Native American (heh): Indigenous to where? lmfao
Indigenous [Continent/general area here] would be the closest all-round. Indigenous North American just too many syllables though. Trying to fucking get away from the fucking whirlwind of every 10 years Anishinaabe, Algonquin, Ojibwe, Chippewa, Native American, Indian, Injun shit please. The fewer syllables the better, and nothing people already have please. And no stupid fucking people first word semantics dumb shit when you’re literally using the same words but it’s better in THIS order not the other…
I swear people just pick the worst words to describe people sometimes when going down the slippery slope for PC language. It’s all so arbitrary lol.
People first language literally creates more in-groups and out-groups who have to jump literal semantic hoops, usually just to make the in group feel a little better labeling someone because people turn a blind eye to racists.
I have rarely, and I mean very, very rarely seen new language originate from minority or out-groups being used by their own people first then co-opted by the in-group. There’s some random language here and there, but anything race/ethnicity related, it’s almost always the in-group getting too racist to call people by what they used for the out-group before, and they have to start calling them something else or fear being branded a racist… Rather than, you know, ostracizing people for being fucking racist.
Maybe I’m just too mixed or too ND to care, but for the same reason why if you get the pronunciation of my name close enough and know you’re referring to me.
TBH, I wish Injun made a comebock.
I like Namen/Nnamen. (Native North American, human, man, woman, his noodly appendage) too. No, I don’t care if you say Nay-men or Nah-men.
You’re wrong if you pronounce GIF as JIF though.
You’re wrong if you pronounce GIF as JIF though.
Everything was fine until you said that. Now we’re mortal enemies.
I COULD care less… hue
‘Indian’ is still pretty widespread in the US
It’s still technically called Indian Country and there are a variety of Indian services type organizations in the government.
I’m falling into the old person category lately but prefer to stay in the know. What is the proper nomenclature in 2024?
“Indigenous” seems to be acceptable most people. When you know them personally, use their nation or tribal affiliation. Like if your friend was Korean, and you only referred to them as “Asian,” it might feel like you don’t care about the difference.
I’ve had members of the Métis community tell me to use “indigenous” with a mixed group because in Canada the Métis and the Inuit don’t fall under the Indian Act.
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Different people prefer different nomenclature, but the generally accepted standard has switched from native American a couple decades ago to American Indian now. IIRC the change happened because calling people natives sometimes seems synonymous with calling them primitive. Most US tribal groups use American Indian now
Thank you. That makes sense.
20 years ago it was “native, aboriginal, or first nation’s” people
Not sure which is the current flavour
Depends on your country. Really every place has come up with something different: First Nations, indigenous, native, etc.
Native, I would assume
I was reading it and genuinely thought it meant South Asian Indian at first
Same. I was getting really curious about this Amish group in India
My understanding is they call themselves Indians and it’s only dipshitty non-indians tripping over themselves to be publicly offended on others’ behalf who say it’s bad.
I don’t know for certain but that certainly seems to be the consensus.
There’s actually a diverse opinion even within the indigenous community, Indian can be a uniting identifier, but it can also be representative of everything wrong with colonism.
While I’m not American, my understanding from my grandfather who was warded to a government school in Canada (though it’s never been clear if he is first nations, he was documented as such but his cultural experience once he joined the army and moved countries to has been white, and I am white, so I can not truly speak to any of this), whether an individual or a tribal group are more comfortable with the label Indian or Native American, or indigenous, or first nations, tends to depend on the relationship between the person/group and reservations and government programs that historically used the terminology of Indian.
My grandfather for example would use First Nation’s/Indigenous (though he used to say that he was “treated like first nations” rather than he “is” first nations, because even he had no idea if he actually was or not), he couldn’t bring himself to say “Indian” because that’s what he was labelled as while subjected to the abuse of the educational system at the time, it’s a traumatic term for him. Meanwhile some of the men he knew from that time united under the label “Indian” to claim it back from those that used it to oppress them, it’s a point of pride for them.
That’s been my impression too.
Whole thing sounds like the people who call every black person everywhere an African American.
anon discovers cultural exchange
Is part of the agreement to trade fashion accessories?
isn’t that a part of every agreement
Yes but only among girls.
As a father who raised 4 daughters, you try and stop a young woman from wearing jewelry, perfumes, and even makeup. That’s a fight you WILL lose every time.
You should see the dating scene. A young Amish boy holding hands with a young Native walking down a hallway, (or vice versa). It ain’t right I tell you.
I learned very quickly I had already lost on the makeup battle by the time my daughter was 2. I thought maybe we could make it until she was a teenager but NOPE
Perhaps I’m missing something - what’s wrong with makeup?
Makeup is pretty bad for your skin but really I was most concerned about how it might become a crutch or even cause of self esteem issues, as well as not wanting to perpetuate the stereotype that all women must wear makeup. But I think I might have been wrong about it on the emotional and gender fronts because she has so much fun putting makeup on as well as doing her younger brother’s makeup and nails
Yeah, I agree it’s a complex phenomenon. But I don’t think it’s that bad for your skin if you learn to clean it properly. I admire your approach.
This is local politics in action. In a federation this is protected. In a federation this could also be forced on all federated states or banned. In a federal system it is also allowed that damaging actions are outlawed or embraced and cherished by the state. It is all imperfect but the entire idea is the hope that all the various levels of legal authority check and balance themselves for the benefit of the people and are accountable to wrote law.
I am just writing this for people to maybe remember that this is how a federation (see: The United States of America) is fundamentally supposed to function.
Are there actually Amish people in India?
I can’t tell if this is real or not.
Many people refer to the people who were living in North America before Europeans as “Indians” and there’s even a good portion of those people that use it to self identify as well, even if “Native American” is more widely used, if not also somewhat an inaccurate if you’re getting technical.
Absolutely fair enough, I’m just a somewhat ignorant Welsh man!
They have only ever been described here as American/Native American.
Though now that you mention this, Cowboys & Indians suddenly makes a lot more sense to me.
Christopher Columbus, who discovered Americas, thought he was heading to India.
American Indians, the term hasn’t died out in the New World quite yet.
