• TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
      138·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Well I’m here so I guess I’ll answer.

      There are many human drivers of fire, the first and foremost being, well you know, lighting a fire. And boy, do humans light a lot of fires.

      Take for example, here is a map of active fires around the globe, right now:

      First order human drivers of fire are things we actively or accidentally do to light a fire. Ignition is a fundamental for fire to happen, and humans cause WAY more ignition events than nature does. Things like a cook fire, burning brush or downed debris for management purposes, infrastructure like power lines or fueling stations, car accidents, lit cigarettes being thrown out etc… etc… The timing and frequency of these events directly influence the frequency of fires.

      Second order drivers are things like vegetation management, home placing and construction, and other biophysical drivers. For example, introduction of invasive species like bromus tectorum, which burns very readily, represents more fine fuels in the environment. Yadayadayada more fires. Other things around vegetation management would fall into this category, such as the suppression of fire, or the psychical thinning of fuels in forests, or prescribed burns.

        • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
          76·
          vor 8 Monaten

          No no no, I’m an et al, just no any of those particular et al. I focus on wildfire risk and have read much on the topic. I’ve read McCarty and many more when it comes to understanding wildfire and wildfire risk. Some of my research focuses on wildfire risk, and spatial features as they relate to wildfire risk, so drivers becomes pretty important when it comes to wildfire risk modeling. I have taken several courses through NASA on the matter even though I don’t focus on drivers directly.

          This is the kind of thing I’m working on:

          The nodes are features, the edges are weights. In this case I’m just looking at structure:structure risk.

          • ricecake@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            11·
            vor 8 Monaten

            When you refer to that diagram, is it a way of gauging fire spread risk? Like this grill could start a medium sized fire, and it’s close to a shed which could become big fire, and that could spread to house, etc, etc?

            • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
              30·
              vor 8 Monaten

              So to be clear, I’m not trying to model spread. I’m taking a pretty different approach which is to look at metrics I can derive from an entire network, like centrality and modularity, and use those to predict the overall probability of survival. I’m not trying to say where or how a fire might progress through a network, but rather looking at the overall structure of a network at, for example the parcel resolution, to estimate the likely hood that a given structure might survive a wildfire.

              So in the above figure, (it was literally a screen cap of what I had on at that moment, so no effort into graphic design etc.), the diameter of the circle corresponds to the exposure, which is weighted by the total facing. The units on the edges are kilojoules per m^2 per 300 seconds. The circles are on the ‘receiving’ side of the network (this is a directed kpartite network, and we’re only looking at structure:structure edges).

              So you can imagine that if you stand with your face to a campfire, you receive more radiation than if you stand edgeways. Likewise if you take a step back. Same principal. I’m not adjusting the edge weights for structural composition or construction (although I’d like to. in the metaphore, all the campfires are the same size and intensity). This is just assuming that each structure will put out about the same amount of energy when burning. However, because of the physical arrangement of things in space, they do not necessarily all experience the same exposure. We can use those differences to create a set of weights, and then by looking at how ‘modular’ the system is at a given exposure rating (IE, how fully connected is the graph at a given kJ/m2), we might find that the network breaks into some interesting or predictive components.

              So, very long answer, but trying to make it shorter: I’m not trying to model spread or predict how fire would move through this system. I’m trying to come up with an overall probabilistic assessment or risk based on how ‘connected’ features are in space.

              • ricecake@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
                8·
                vor 8 Monaten

                Well that’s pretty cool, thanks for sharing! :D To repeat to check my understanding, you’re looking at where structures are relative to other structures, their shape and orientation, and how that goes together in a big system to influence general structure survival in a wildfire situation.

                Do you foresee the outcome being something where you could “tune” a neighborhood to be more survivable, or would it end up with too many combinations to be viable?

                • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
                  7·
                  vor 8 Monaten

                  yeah so there was a nature publication last year basically demonstrating this, however, they were working on 30 meter pixels.

                  I kinda got scooped, but I was always working in much higher resolution data.

                  But basically yeah. We can look at the network and identify where it can be hardened in or broken apart to be make more resistant.

          • nyahlathotep@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            11·
            vor 8 Monaten

            Cool! I have no idea what any of that means, but cool! I get the feeling that you really enjoy what you do, and if that’s the case I’m glad for you :3

          • Tar_Alcaran@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            7·
            vor 8 Monaten

            No no no, I’m an et al, just no any of those particular et al.

            I’m going to steal cite this. I guess it’ll be ‘et al et al.’

      • elbucho@lemmy.worldEnglish
        7·
        vor 8 Monaten

        …such as the suppression of fire, or the psychical thinning of fuels in forests, or prescribed burns.

        I’m definitely picturing Jedi clearing debris from the forest floors using the Force, now.

      • merc@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        3·
        vor 8 Monaten

        Take for example, here is a map of active fires around the globe, right now:

        By “fires” do they mean fores fires? Controlled fires to burn crops, or burn land to clear it for crops? House fires? Bonfires? Campfires? Fires in fireplaces?

        Ignition is a fundamental for fire to happen, and humans cause WAY more ignition events than nature does.

        A car causes hundreds of ignition effects per minute. But, I’m guessing you mean a certain kind of ignition?

        The timing and frequency of these events directly influence the frequency of fires.

        The timing and frequency of things like lighting a fire directly influence the frequency of fires? Do you mean the frequency of out-of-control fires? Because otherwise that seems like a pretty obvious conclusion.

      • LucidNightmare@lemmy.worldEnglish
        1·
        vor 8 Monaten

        Thank you so much for sharing something that you are passionate about. It was awesome to hear about, and I hope you continue to share the knowledge you have with others like myself. 😁

    • Hobbes_Dent@lemmy.worldEnglish
      69·
      vor 8 Monaten

      I use geospatial science and data to document, analyze, and predict complexities of wildland and human-caused fire, from individual to global scales. I have a particular interest in fire emissions and modeling, regional food security, land-cover/land-use change, and the Arctic. As a mom, I am concerned with helping children and future generations have better lives.

      https://jmccartygeo.org/

        • BallShapedMan@lemmy.worldEnglish
          4·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I think it’s a great use, but not only.

          Resume building, cover letters, aggregating open text responses, summarizing complex texts, and so on.

          While the AI can’t be left alone to do these things and if you do it’ll be clear it’s AI but it can reduce the time to do them significantly.

          I firmly believe this is like the age of the computer before it. Those who fail to become AI natives in knowledge work will become under employed or unemployed in 10-15 years.

          So I encourage you to make an excuse to learn it and get good at it.

    • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.netEnglish
      35·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Probably just the totality of human influences on wildfires. This can include a wide range of activities and factors including climate change, forest preservation or cutting, changes in wild or domestic mammal herbivory, accidental ignition events, controlled burns, irrigation or diversion of streams, damming rivers, invasive species introductions, etc.

  • stoy@lemmy.zipEnglish
    132·
    vor 8 Monaten

    Funny, but what does the skin color have to do with the situation?

    • southsamurai@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
      100·
      vor 8 Monaten

      When a given demographic is a dominant presence in a given area (not necessarily work, it can be anything), there is a tendency for they demographic to start making assumptions about other demographics.

      In most places, men are the dominant presence, and in most of the “western” world, they will also be white.

      In this case, the individual who a white male was doing what’s called colloquially, “mansplaining”. He was correcting a woman when not only was the woman right, but was the very source he was using to correct her.

      This is a consistent and very unpleasant fact of the world that white men will treat anyone of any other demographic as less than equals.

      In this specific case, I suspect that the person making that post was pointing to the prejudice and stupidity of the person indirectly insulting her being a systemic issue arising from both gender and sexual entrenchment along with the privilege that allows the dominance of the white male demographic despite their being no quantifiable factor for that group to be dominant other than that privilege.

      She, in other words, was pointing out a systemic issue by using an anecdote. Which can be a bit difficult to accept as evidence. Or would be if there wasn’t a good century or so of giant piles of anecdotes from real people pointing to that systemic issue not only existing, but being something that holds everyone back.

      Truth? Yes, women and people of color are going to assume they’re right and whoever they’re talking to is wrong just like any humans will. But white dudes have been pulling that crap for multiple generations, and anyone that isn’t both white and male get sick of the bad behavior.

      • casual_turtle_stew_enjoyer@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        39·
        vor 8 Monaten

        This is a consistent and very unpleasant fact of the world that white men will treat anyone of any other demographic as less than equals.

        Pls stop generalizing this bad behavior upon all white men. It only serves to further the divide, and is completely unfair and uncalled for against those in the demographic who don’t subscribe to those beliefs or patterns of behavior.

        I’m not sure if that was your intent, that’s just how it comes across and it makes it hard not to completely write off your argument/viewpoints for being unable to respect your neighbor.

        • southsamurai@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          33·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I’m a white man. I can absolutely generalize about a well known aspect of reality. It isn’t in question that white men are currently in a position of overall privilege, and that as a group that position of privilege has the effect stated.

          I pretty much also said that this is true in the western world where white men are the supposed majority. I said that the same would be the case with any dominant group because humans are just like that.

          A generalization can not only be true in general, but it doesn’t inherently mean that the entire group is at fault (beyond any unintentional benefits from the situation, which is what’s called privilege in current discourse on matters of gender and race in specific, but applies to more than those alone).

          Here’s the thing. Until and unless we, not just as white men (speaking of the group I’m in) work on calling out and correcting bad behaviors as a group, to the point that it ceases to be a problem for others, we are part of the problem, no matter how little any individual likes that.

          Divisions currently exist. They will always exist because any time there is a place of authority/power, there will be those that seek it and use it. Over time, you might see a given demographic shift in and out of that place of power, but it won’t change humans being humans; there will be abuse of power.

          That’s the real key. The fact that white men have held dominance over most of the world for centuries (for a given value of most, and a given value of white) is simply fact. One could argue that the position of dominance really covers all the world since anyone wanting to disrupt that has to contend against that hierarchy. There are definitely places where, within a region* white men aren’t the dominant group, kinda impossible to be otherwise. But trying to pretend that the world isn’t the way it is is just silly.

          • casual_turtle_stew_enjoyer@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            4·
            vor 8 Monaten

            Completely agree with your points. But also hope you can see it may be more fruitful to appear as though you’re ready to attack the problem, rather than your fellow man.

            I say this because I didn’t read this as an outright attack or denigration of your fellow man, but I very much fear how easily any other man may interpret it and how it could serve to further the divide and make the problem even harder to address. That is my chief concern.

            I appreciate you taking the time to clarify your position fellow internet stranger <3

        • worldofbirths@lemmy.worldEnglish
          15·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I think the generalization isn’t really about white men per se, but about the demographic in power. Give a group unchecked power long enough and they forget how that came to be. I agree that it’s not a rule, and maybe should be expressed as more of a heuristic: if you are speaking to someone that is in power, and you don’t look like them, they might think you are not empowered.

          Don’t let the lack of nuance in that statement take away from all the very valid points being made. The plight is real, and hopefully the white men who are enlightened enough to not confuse circumstance with natural order will read and know to not take it personally.

          • casual_turtle_stew_enjoyer@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            3·
            vor 8 Monaten

            Thank you for the civil discussion.

            Completely agree about unchecked power and your interpretation of it as a heuristic rather than an ambiguously defined trait.

            I most certainly realize the plight is real and wish it never was like I’d hope all of us can say. But the lack of nuance struck me as dangerous. I understand how disenfranchised men will interpret things, and when people willfully neglect the opportunity to be concise it leaves a worrying amount of room for misinterpretation and effectively is ragebait that can serve to further entrench a misguided incel or the like into their toxic niche.

            And for anyone who thinks I’m overreacting: see how Reddit powermod awkward_the_turtle intentionally acted to provoke men, then wrote off everyone who took issue with it as inherently being member of the ideology they were allegedly targeting. Reddit, the company, enabled and encouraged this mod and their collaborators to attack users on their platform indiscriminately.

            If Lemmy is to serve as only a new platform for abuse, then it deserves to die with the rest of social media. Please, do not let it come to this. Discuss and debate civilly.

      • stoy@lemmy.zipEnglish
        37·
        vor 8 Monaten

        I still don’t see why adding the skin color was important, but eh, I have other things to deal with, so I don’t really care, just found it slightly annoying.

        • JoBo@feddit.ukEnglish
          7·
          vor 8 Monaten

          Because the 'splaining phenomenon is about perceived but unearned superiority which leads the 'splainer to 'splain to someone who knows a great deal more than they do and, crucially, someone who the 'splainer ought to realise knows more than they do but doesn’t because of the illusion created by the society they live in.

          I’d have added “(born) middle-class” because that’s an important part of it too.

      • ashenblood@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        31·
        vor 8 Monaten

        This is a consistent and very unpleasant fact of the world that white men will treat anyone of any other demographic as less than equals.

        Citation needed.

        In all seriousness, I understand your point and respect you for trying to deconstruct the mechanics of privilege.

        But I just factually disagree with your assertion. I would argue that every human being has an inherent preference for people that they perceive as similar to themselves in some way, and this can result in bias along racial or gender lines. However, this arguably applies less to white men than any other demographic, because such behavior is so consistently condemned and shamed when exhibited by white men.

        In contrast, people of other demographics are less frequently made aware of their own biases, because calling it out has not been construed as some kind of ethical imperative, as it has with white men.

        It’s also well documented that women have a much stronger in-group bias compared to men.

        In essence, women can be characterized as “If I am good and I am female, females are good,” whereas men can be characterized as “Even if I am good and I am male, men are not necessarily good.” This sex difference in cognitive balance suggests that a mechanism that promotes female preference in women does not similarly contribute to male preference for men.

        https://rutgerssocialcognitionlab.weebly.com/uploads/1/3/9/7/13979590/rudmangoodwin2004jpsp.pdf

        • Stoneykins [any]@mander.xyzEnglish
          15·
          vor 8 Monaten

          Your barely-in-context paper is not support for your main argument :

          However, this arguably applies less to white men than any other demographic, because such behavior is so consistently condemned and shamed when exhibited by white men.

          Do you have any citations that actually support your claim? Because it sounds like vibes “please don’t say mean things about my group” bullshit.

          • ashenblood@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
            18·
            vor 8 Monaten

            That’s not my main argument, it’s merely a supporting clause.

            OP asserted that

            white men will treat anyone of any other demographic as less than equals.

            I countered that by pointing out that it’s obvious that any human being tends to prefer people who they consider similar to themselves. That’s my main argument.

            And if that is true, then attempting to frame such behavior as particular to white men is just silly and unproductive.

            I obviously can’t definitively measure the amount of social stigma around white male prejudice, but I don’t need to. I’m not saying that white men are definitely less biased than other demographics, I’m merely pointing out that it’s a distinct possibility, even as you all indicate that they are the demographic most deserving of condemnation for such behavior.

            Now, one could make the argument that even though white men may not be especially biased, the effects of their bias may have greater impacts on other demographics due to the disproportionate amount of power they collectively wield. I think that’s a fair point, but it doesn’t really hold any ethical implications, it’s simply a description of a material reality.

            • Stoneykins [any]@mander.xyzEnglish
              6·
              vor 8 Monaten

              If this is your main argument then:

              …it’s obvious that any human being tends to prefer people who they consider similar to themselves.

              Doesn’t your paper you linked imply it isn’t so obvious? I still stand by that it’s not really relevant so I’ll just say that I fully disagree with your argument or the implication that you have somehow proven anything.

              I’ll repeat something I said in another comment:

              It is intentionally, intellectually dishonest and obtuse to pretend that condemnation of systemic problems resulting from unfair biases for/from certain demographics is as bad as the systemic problems in question.

              You just pretend you are unaware of massive swaths of history in order to act offended that anyone would make generic statements about an infamously problematic demographic. And you falsely equate any attempt to talk generically about the problematic behaviour to the same issue, as a transparent tactic to suppress discussion of the problematic behaviour entirely.

              I’m sure you will have some bullshit response that will annoy me again but I’m gunna try to let it go because I find talking to you unpleasant.

              • ashenblood@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
                8·
                vor 8 Monaten

                Doesn’t your paper you linked imply it isn’t so obvious?

                Yeah sure, in the absence of any other data.

                If you refuse to acknowledge that people like people similar to themselves, you’re not being honest with yourself, let alone me.

                What is the systemic problem/problematic behavior that you are trying to solve? You clearly believe that white men are especially discriminatory towards other groups, which isn’t crazy, although I disagree. But are you so naive to think that if we replaced the powerful white men with powerful hispanic women (or any other combination of race and gender), racial and gender-based discrimination would suddenly end? I’m just pointing out the inconvenient truth that the system would still be biased and unfair, just with different winners and losers.

                In my view, the fact that some white men are biased for or against certain groups is completely insignificant and irrelevant to solving the problems that society faces today. It’s the fundamental structure of the economic and political system that naturally results in the few individuals at the top of the hierarchy expressing a large degree of control and domination over the rest of the society.

                • Stoneykins [any]@mander.xyzEnglish
                  4·
                  vor 8 Monaten

                  The idea that humans are inherently predisposed to subjugate those different from themselves is a fascist belief that fascists say to justify fascism. So… Not a fan of that line of thought, thanks

            • F04118F@feddit.nlEnglish
              5·
              vor 8 Monaten

              Normally, I only comment when i have something to add, but I just want to commend you for your high quality contribution to this sensitive topic.

              Really learning a lot from this. Your arguments are solid and your phrasing is respectful. Thank you!

        • OftenWrong@startrek.websiteEnglish
          2·
          vor 8 Monaten

          Privilege is writing off your own privilege as inherent in nature and then pointing at other groups of people going “but they’re allowed it’s not fair!!!”

      • psud@aussie.zoneEnglish
        3·
        vor 8 Monaten

        By calling out dominant race they imply that those silent on race are talking about a minority

      • Melllvar@startrek.websiteEnglish
        2·
        vor 8 Monaten

        When a given demographic is a dominant presence in a given area (not necessarily work, it can be anything), there is a tendency for they demographic to start making assumptions about other demographics.

        Isn’t she the one making assumptions, though? Specifically, the “prejudice and stupidity of the person indirectly insulting her” part? I mean, is that really the only possible explanation?

        • OftenWrong@startrek.websiteEnglish
          1·
          vor 8 Monaten

          What other reason would you suggest as to why he would assume that he knows more than her or that she couldn’t be the person that he’s referring to? Clearly he didn’t even know her name yet so what did he have to go by to draw those conclusions? It obviously wasn’t her lack of knowledge on the subject that they were discussing now was it?

    • jol@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
      78·
      vor 8 Monaten

      It’s a reminder than people that have always been in a privileged position often don’t realize they do.

    • blindsight@beehaw.orgEnglish
      52·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Did you drop a /s? This is a funny meme, so I’m assuming I just missed a joke.

      Right?

      (Speaking as a white male, white male entitlement, and privilege for that matter, are incredibly relevant to white men being sexist/racist.)

      (You can trust me on this because I’m a white male. Also, I’m used to my opinion being listened to, so I expect you to as well. Just FYI.)

      • stoy@lemmy.zipEnglish
        19·
        vor 8 Monaten

        Nope, I wasn’t sarcastic, I was slightly annoyed, annoyed enough to make rhe comment but not to maje a huge deal about it.

      • cosmicrookie@lemmy.worldEnglish
        10·
        vor 8 Monaten

        Wow! This is like saying that if someone owns an axe, they are more likely to be a serial killer. If they also have rolls of black garbage bags, then its even more likely …

        • maryjayjay@lemmy.worldEnglish
          10·
          vor 8 Monaten

          That’s such a straw man. You would have no trouble saying that if someone doesn’t have an axe they are less likely to be an axe murderer

          • cosmicrookie@lemmy.worldEnglish
            6·
            vor 8 Monaten

            Sorry - what do you mean?

            The fact that someone owns an axe and garbage bags, does nothing to their likelihood of them being a murder, just like being white and/or a male has nothing to do with the “risk of unearned confidence”.

    • cosmicrookie@lemmy.worldEnglish
      21·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Or even the gender?

      Edit: so… based on the downvotes this gets, its not OK for a male to interrupt but if it had been a female or other gender, then it would have been ok?

      • Specal@lemmy.worldEnglish
        13·
        vor 8 Monaten

        Male and Female aren’t genders, they’re Sex, Words used to describe biological makeup of a living creature, for example XX Chromosomes are Female, XY Chromosomes are Male, but there are also instances where XXY Chromosomes can happen, and things get a little tricky.

        Gender is what we use to tell children how to behave based on their genetalia and cause dysphoria in them when they don’t want to do something but will get ostracized for doing what people with the other genetalia do.

        • cosmicrookie@lemmy.worldEnglish
          13·
          vor 8 Monaten

          Thanks. Its a bit confusing to me especially as a none English user. But your description of gender sounds negative. I assume a gender can be a neutral description of oneself? I am not sure.

          My point here though is, that OP mentioning it was a male, is as irrelevant as their skin color. I dont see why it needs to be there when they dont add other irrelevant characteristics such as nationality, age, hair color etc.

        • madcaesar@lemmy.worldEnglish
          8·
          vor 8 Monaten

          You know when the right looks at the left and calls us batshit? Your comment is shit they point to…

          • Specal@lemmy.worldEnglish
            10·
            vor 8 Monaten

            What’s batshit about it? As a society we do exactly that, we tell boys to like blue and girls to like pink.

        • captainlezbian@lemmy.worldEnglish
          6·
          vor 8 Monaten

          There’s a lot more to sex than chromosomes. It’s probably better to say it’s clustering of positions on bimodal curves of traits. And even then you wind up with weird shit because biology really doesn’t like simple classifications. Like seriously there are so fucking many ways to be intersex and intersex people are downright common.

          But also grammatically male and female when used to refer to humans are generally just the adjectives for man and woman.

    • thorbot@lemmy.worldEnglish
      4·
      vor 7 Monaten

      You can’t be racist against white, duh

      Edit: nobody realized this was sarcasm

    • NotJustForMe@lemmy.mlEnglish
      2·
      vor 8 Monaten

      It is just mentioned. Just a description of what happened. What’s wrong about saying it was a white male when it was a white male? Why jump to the opinion that mentioning the gender or complexion has any other purpose than being descriptive?

      • stoy@lemmy.zipEnglish
        2·
        vor 8 Monaten

        What’s wrong about just mentioning it was a post doc asking the question?

  • HollowNaught@lemmy.worldEnglish
    129·
    vor 8 Monaten

    I always roll my eyes whenever I see a “you can’t do that because you’re a woman” character in a show, and then I’m always reminded that these people actually exist

    • booly@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
      32·
      vor 8 Monaten

      these people actually exist

      The way it’s been explained to me is that so much of the negative interactions in life come from a tiny, tiny number of offenders who manage to be shitty to dozens and dozens of people. So anyone who has to interact with many different people will inevitably encounter that shitty interaction, while most of us normies would never actually behave in that way.

      Of the literally thousands of times I’ve interacted with a server or cashier, I’ve never yelled at one. But talk to any server or cashier, and they’ll all have stories of the customer who yelled at them. In other words, it can be simultaneously true that:

      • Almost all servers and cashiers get yelled at by customers.
      • Very, very, few customers actually yell at servers or cashiers.

      In other words, our lived experiences are very different, depending on which side of that interaction we might possibly be on.

      When I talk to women in male dominated fields, basically every single one of them has shitty stories about sexist mistreatment. It’s basically inevitable, because they are a woman who interacts with literally hundreds or thousands in their field. And even if I interact with hundreds or thousands of women in that same field, just because I don’t mistreat any of them doesn’t mean that my experienced sample is representative.

      • Socsa@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        11·
        vor 8 Monaten

        I wouldn’t say very few. I’d say a solid 10% of people are routinely rude, impatient or entitled in a retail or restaurant setting. Even higher in some places.

        • stoly@lemmy.worldEnglish
          6·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I think you’re right. People want to believe that humans are good but in reality a huge number are deeply broken.

          Fixed an autocorrect in edit.

          • Wandering_Uncertainty@lemmy.worldEnglish
            8·
            vor 8 Monaten

            It really is a matter of perspective.

            You’re saying that 10% of the population being awful means that a “huge number” are deeply broken.

            So then 90% are being good! Mind, it doesn’t take too many assholes to wreck things for everyone, but it is nice that the majority of folks really are trying to do their best. A sizeable majority, even!

            • stoly@lemmy.worldEnglish
              5·
              vor 8 Monaten

              10% of 8 billion is still many hundreds of millions. That’s a huge number. More: it’s a number we have to stop pretending is not a big deal and get to work to fix ourselves as a species.

              • Wandering_Uncertainty@lemmy.worldEnglish
                4·
                vor 8 Monaten

                Oh, no denying that at all. It is a problem, especially in aggregate.

                When looking at the big picture, those rotten apples really do spoil the bunch and it can be depressing.

                But also people can take that big picture awareness of problems and hate on people a little universally. Saying things like humanity is awful and a plague on the earth and maybe shouldn’t exist. There’s absolutely reason to see things that way.

                But we are also a species that dolphins can approach for help when they’re injured. Or that will fight tooth and nail to help a wild creature. Or who will sacrifice their own well-being, not just for friends and family, but for strangers. Who will take other creatures, like dogs, into our homes and hearts and love them with all we have.

                We can suck as a species, absolutely. We need to fix it. But it’s important to remember the joys of humanity, and not just the failures. Both are extreme, for we are a rather extreme species!

        • Acamon@lemmy.worldEnglish
          3·
          vor 8 Monaten

          Maybe in some places. But when I go out to a restaurant, I’m often surrounded by a few dozen other diners, and no one is acting up or shouting at waiting staff. I have seen customers be obviously rude to staff but it’s very rare compared to the number of “normal” interactions. Sure not everyone is friendly and totally polite, but entitled, shouting or just being an ass is an absolute exception, like less than 0.1%. I also worked as a waiter in a couple of different restaurants over a two year period, and don’t remember any incidents either to me or my colleagues.

          When I read comments like this it makes me wonder if I’ve been lucky enough to live and work in decent places, and the USA is just an nightmare hellscape, or if the reality there is much more normal and we just hear an unrepresentative sample of it.

          • BluesF@lemmy.worldEnglish
            1·
            vor 8 Monaten

            If you are visiting a restaurant you really only get a sense of what’s happening at your table. Same when you reach a cashier - you might overhear what happens straight ahead, but not much more than that. People can be very rude without being very loud - if you work in customer service you have to deal with these people all the time, and you can’t escalate things either. It’s not something other customers are aware of.

            • Acamon@lemmy.worldEnglish
              1·
              vor 8 Monaten

              Totally agree that eating at a restaurant doesn’t mean you see all the subtle ways people are douches. But the comment above was about people shouting, so I assumed that the “10% of people are rude” was meaning obviously and noticeably rude. If it’s just 10% of people are impatient / distracted / not very friendly / kinda annoying. Then sure, but I don’t think anyone would be surprised with such a mild claim.

              And as I said, I was a waiter in a busy restaurant for over two years. And the staff spent a lot of time complaining about the job to each other (as you do) and while many customers were annoying, kept changing their orders, or were a bit drunk and laughing loudly the whole time, blah blah, I don’t remember anyone ever complaining about a customer being as rude as I regularly read / see on the Internet. I never encounter a “Karen”.

              I’ve always assumed it is just that Internet focusses on the tiny number of extreme behaviours and makes it sound more normal. But then I hear people say things like 10% of people are awful to staff and it makes me think that maybe there’s a real cultural difference.

              • BluesF@lemmy.worldEnglish
                2·
                vor 8 Monaten

                Sorry, somehow totally skipped over the part of your comment where you said you worked as a waiter! I didn’t intend to explain your own job to you at all haha. There are definitely demographic differences I’ve noticed, and specific workplaces… I’ve worked a relatively small number of customer service jobs. Cafe was broadly as the previous commenter described, maybe 5-10% of people were… not great. Although, no shouting or anything when I worked there. Just rude, entitled people. Pubs are not so bad, in my limited experience, drunk people are annoying but in a different way. The worst was a job where I had to take customer calls (not quite a call centre)… There I had to deal with the closest thing to a “Karen”.

                • Acamon@lemmy.worldEnglish
                  2·
                  vor 8 Monaten

                  Oh god, yes. I worked in a call centre for six months and it was dreadful. The combination of dealing with sometimes frustrating situations + the anonymity of a voice only call… People were regularly dreadful. Definitely at least 10% very rude people.

                  I also took it to be a sign of the ‘banality of evil’, that people having a nice time with their friends, eating some nice food, are generally pleasant. But put them in the privacy of their own home, speaking to a faceless stranger, and suddenly they can be awful. But I tried not to judge them to harshly. The design of call centres, with long hold times and staff with no real power to do anything helpful, is pretty much guaranteed to frustrate the most saintly of people.

      • AnarchistArtificer@slrpnk.netEnglish
        2·
        vor 8 Monaten

        I think you’re right that only a tiny minority are directly responsible for the negative interactions, but as someone within academic science, there’s also a much larger chunk of people who don’t challenge the assholes or the systemic fuckery when they see it.

        Minorities who face oppression are much more likely to be ignored if they report inappropriate or offensive behaviour; I directly know people who have been made to feel like they are the problem for highlighting a problem. This is especially common if it’s an established and respected academic who makes the iffy comments, because there’s a tendency to them like a senile grandparent at Christmas. If they’re a professor emeritus, there’s a sense of them not really being relevant anymore, even if they’re still respected, but it can feel tremendously isolating to see no-one step in to challenge the comments, either at an individual or institutional level.

        It’s understandable to not want to rock the boat, but abstaining is easier for some than others.

        • booly@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          1·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I agree.

          I point out that pretty much everyone in that group experiences it, so even those who aren’t in that disadvantaged group should show some empathy towards the experiences of others, that we may never directly encounter ourselves. Part of that empathy, of course, is to provide support and structures for reducing the likelihood that these things happen, and mitigating them when they do happen.

    • Omega_Haxors@lemmy.mlEnglish
      3·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Not only that they exist but also that they’re disturbingly common and disproportionately in positions of power.

    • bloom_of_rakes@lemm.eeEnglish
      2·
      vor 8 Monaten

      We poke fun at your infatuation for these infantile cartoons. You reply, “misogyny!!”

      The only reason your cries are taken seriously here is that so many of these people are on the same dumb wavelength.

  • 1ostA5tro6yneEnglish
    90·
    vor 8 Monaten

    ITT people baww at the mere mention of race and gender, and proceed to behave as if the problem is other people being too sensitive about race and gender.

  • player2@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
    84·
    vor 8 Monaten

    And then everyone applauded..

    But seriously if I witnessed this, I might actually applaud because that is a pretty badass bit of trivia to get to whip out.

    • cmbabul@lemmy.worldEnglish
      31·
      vor 8 Monaten

      I think I would rather this happen to me than just about anything professionally, the withdrawal from that high might actually kill me

  • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.netEnglish
    77·
    vor 8 Monaten

    Hilarious. I actually witnessed this online when someone tried to “well actually” another user and it turned out that user was the author of the paper they cited.

    • wizardbeard@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
      22·
      vor 8 Monaten

      I see it happen a lot online with people “looking for help with”, but really just looking to vent about, open source software.

      And I encounter it a lot at work with policies, reference docs, and little PowerShell scripts I’ve written.

      “Hello I am tech support. Sysadmin, please help with strange situation A”

      Sure thing, you’ll need to do X.

      “But that doesn’t match our documentation, it says to do Y and that’s not working”

      My man, look at the changelog on the first page. I wrote it and made most of the updates for the first year we had it. This is an exception, and adding it to the doc would have bloated it outrageously for how infrequently this comes up. Especially to explain the why. I’d also need to try to cover all the other rare exceptions, which would turn the doc into an absolutely useless shitshow. Anyway, I should have a PowerShell script to handle it, give me a bit to find it.

      “Ahckstually, Numpty #3 says our team has a PowerShell script to handle it already, no worries! Thanks!”

      Motherfu- My brother in christ who do you think wrote that? You know I used to be on your team, and I just said- My name is in the first line of the scri- I mean cool, glad I could help you get it sorted.

      Similar story, talking with a vendor. Again, I’m the one not in quotes.

      I need you to connect me with a technical resource on your side for assistance with attempting an alternate solution Y for the issue we are facing, which Important Muckety Muck #7 in my company said you were able to do for them. I understand that I previously suggested that we could do X on our side as a solution for our problem. As we’ve moved forward in other places on this project, we have found that X will not work for us as a solution for reasons A, B, and C.

      (He’s breathing loudly through his mouth, hanging agape between words like some great panting missing-link-between-man-and-ape who has somehow found his way into a sales position. Somewhere in the dark recesses of his mind, the sounds of the wind through jungle trees, the calls of ancient and exotic birds and animals, the quiet noises of strange insects alien to this modern time and place, all combine into a beautiful primal music lost to the modern world. It flits through his subconcious, never quite fully able to be grasped.)

      “I am the technical resource. According to my notes, X was identified as a solution to your problem.”

      (This was not some poor third world guy stuck in a call center having to follow a basic help desk script. Same first language, a few states away, he’d been involved with this project the whole way)

      AS STATED IN MY PREVIOUS EMAIL

  • magnetosphere@fedia.io
    61·
    vor 8 Monaten

    Any kind of interruption seems rude AF, and that’s without even considering the sexism and insinuation that she’s incompetent.

    What’s the norm for the audience in situations like this? Raising your hand? Holding any questions/comments until the end?

    • RecluseRamble@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
      44·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Even then you don’t go “you don’t understand x!”. You make an actual point about something in the presentation, usually with enough self-doubt to state it as a question.

      If the whole presentation is trash in your opinion, just leave.

      • Tar_Alcaran@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        6·
        vor 8 Monaten

        Also, if someone just says “you’re wrong about X” that’s way easier to deal with than “considering this other paper says these things, can you explain your motivation for X?”.

        Those questions are the worst.

        • Nonagon ∞ Orc@lemmy.worldEnglish
          10·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I find that to be the other way around. I would much rather have people ask the second kind of question, whereas the first kind will give me nothing to work with. In the worst case you can answer that you havent read thtose papers and you will after the presentation. At best they can actually teach you something you haven’t considered yet. But often you can respond with your motivation which you generally thought about for much longer than they did.

            • candybrie@lemmy.worldEnglish
              4·
              vor 8 Monaten

              Most researchers I know welcome difficult questions. Like that’s the whole game. Finding the difficult questions about your work and answering them.

              A lot of the time, it sucks of you only get bad questions or no questions. It usually means your work was uninteresting or so poorly presented no one grasped enough to even ask about something relevant.

            • fidodo@lemmy.worldEnglish
              1·
              vor 8 Monaten

              If a subject is a scientific passion of yours, you don’t dismiss good questions, you welcome them.

      • fidodo@lemmy.worldEnglish
        2·
        vor 8 Monaten

        You start by asking questions. If you’re wrong you’ll find out, if you’re right you’ll expose something.

    • baseless_discourse@mander.xyzEnglish
      15·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Depends on the size of the meeting and the length of the meeting.

      For an hour-long lecture/seminar with less than 20 people, probably raising your question directly is fine.

      For a 25 mins talk at a conference with 200 people, you will probably need to save your question to the end.

      But it is always safer to ask beforehand.

    • stoly@lemmy.worldEnglish
      3·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Some people develop extreme skills while never learning how to interact with others.

  • niktemadur@lemmy.worldEnglish
    31·
    vor 8 Monaten

    …later that evening, that’s when this poor wounded white male post doc subscribed to the Ben Shapiro podcast.

  • Dra@lemmy.zipEnglish
    29·
    vor 8 Monaten

    Why is ‘race’ relevant here? What the fuck is wrong with Americans and how did they become so astonishingly self flagellating.

    That said… this sounds like one of those fantasy scenarios where “then everyone clapped”.

    Just on the insecure posture of this tweet, I’m prepared to bet cold hard cash that he asked her for clarity or something with a informational challenge “but does x not come from y?” Or whatever and she manufactured his reasoning and the rest to feel good. She doesn’t seem to know what et al means either.

    • 1ostA5tro6yneEnglish
      21·
      vor 8 Monaten

      Why is ‘race’ relevant here?

      Because it’s extremely relevant in American culture. Every culture really, we’re just somewhat ahead on not lying to ourselves about it.

      What the fuck is wrong with Americans and how did they become so astonishingly self flagellating.

      Nothing and we’re not, you’re an irate ignoramus with a chip on your shoulder having an imaginary dick measuring contest because you’re super duper sensitive about race.

      Just on the insecure posture of this tweet, I’m prepared to bet cold hard cash that he asked her for clarity or something with a informational challenge “but does x not come from y?” Or whatever and she manufactured his reasoning and the rest to feel good. She doesn’t seem to know what et al means either.

      He was literally telling her to go read her own work. The “et al” part is very fucking clearly taking the piss, do they not have humor over there in Stuckupistan? Or are your panties always in too much of a twist about basic ass descriptors to have any kind of humor about literally anything?

      E: guy’s post history is chock full of dogshit-tier takes with a thin veneer of leftism and a big heap of good ol’ fashioned xenophobia.

      • Allero@lemmy.todayEnglish
        4·
        vor 8 Monaten

        “Because of the sheer scale of the issue and long history of institutionalized racism with lingering consequences, we, Americans, developed more vigilance on the issue, and I think this experience and this point of view should be considered across the globe. I do not appreciate the way you speak of it, and I’d rather have you respect, even if not immediately understand, this position.”

        -Your comment, with personal attacks taken out.

        I ask you to consider the way users express themselves around Lemmy, and keep this place nice and tidy. Personal attacks and flaming are better left to Reddit. What makes the Lemmyverse so amazing is the cooperation of kind strangers, and in the spirit of it, it would be amazing for you not to provoke flaming and aggression.

        I’m no admin and no mod, but a kind patriot of the Lemmy space, and I sincerely hope you could listen up to this and be kinder next time, even to the people who aren’t perfectly keeping to the good conduct themselves.

    • Ephera@lemmy.mlEnglish
      17·
      vor 8 Monaten

      They’re mentioning the race and gender basically to say “a privileged person”. Having privileges obviously influences your character. And race+gender correlate with privileges.

      So, while there’s no direct causation, and us white males who aren’t chumps don’t need to be offended, it’s often good enough of an explanation why a particular white male might be a chump.

    • vallode@lemmy.worldEnglish
      13·
      vor 8 Monaten

      I agree that the usage of “white” is irrelevant here. That being said, are you in academics? It is not an unusual situation for people to not be aware of the “face behind the maths” so to speak. Granted, this is not entirely unique to women in science but it is exhaustingly common for women to be questioned more than their peers.

      I think questioning this is fine as many people lie but I wouldn’t take this to mean this type of situation didn’t happen/couldn’t happen.

      • Dra@lemmy.zipEnglish
        2·
        vor 8 Monaten

        I recognise that, I think it’s important to make very clear distinctions with no sweeping statements when prescribing value to demographic groups.

    • Allero@lemmy.todayEnglish
      3·
      vor 8 Monaten

      While I perfectly agree with your position on that the “privilege” talk has become a weapon in and of itself, and that a lot of bullshit stories come out of it, I’d love it if you could change the tone of conversation.

      Americans are different, and they may have cultural reasons to behaving this way. That’s not to say they’re right - but seeding anger this way is not gonna magically change their minds.

        • Allero@lemmy.todayEnglish
          3·
          vor 8 Monaten

          I’m glad we have a common ground here

          Hope it didn’t turn out mean on my part - I just want to keep this place nice :)

  • Lowlee Kun@feddit.deEnglish
    28·
    vor 8 Monaten

    I find it interesting how writing “a male” instead of man is a good way of pointing out “sexist mansplaining” and writing “a female” is dehumanizing (which i actually agree on). I will not deny that there are many sexists out there who are mansplaining or see women as less knowledgable. Without knowing the person (“offending”) however, i think we would be wise to use occam’s razor which would lead us to the conclusion that this is a prime case of the dunning kruger effect (which would also apply if sexism is involved).

    Mycomment however has to be seen as mansplaining because i sadly have a dick between my legs. Sorry for that.

    • StrawberryEnglish
      22·
      vor 8 Monaten

      im this case she uses male as an adjective, which would be fine for female too (“a female post doc”)