• Sibbo@sopuli.xyz
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          Translation:

          Allowing the private sector to take a larger role in society with government oversight

          Privatise profits, socialise losses

          Simplifying the tax code to close loopholes in cooperation with the provinces and territories

          Lower overall taxes, austerity

          Ending corporate subsidies and supply management where a return on investment cannot be delivered

          End climate-protecting subsidies

          • SGforce@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            Point #3 also includes closing government owned entities like the post office.

            • Sibbo@sopuli.xyz
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              Right, and I also forgot privatising things like water and then let them shut off water for poor people who cannot pay like in Chile.

        • nifty@lemmy.world
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          Their platform made me roll my eyes a bit, the only fiscal conservative that makes sense is when you tax billionaires out of existence. Fiscal conservatism that taxes the poor and doesn’t give them benefits is more neocon bullshit

  • TheObviousSolution@lemm.ee
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    Woke basically applies to the bigots just realizing and getting worked up by things that had existed for decades. Either they’ve been dozing off for decades or have been “woken” up to it by propaganda with political undertones, and neither speaks highly of their mental faculties.

    Although the thing about The Elder Scrolls in general is that it doesn’t hand hold you, so you are free to be a racist bigot and not realize it. They don’t force realization onto the player, you can happily adopt and become a tool of the point they are trying to criticize, you can willfully remain as ignorant as you would be in real life. In contrast to Starfield, where all companions are like the borg, of one mind telling you or nudging you into what you should have actually done.

    • Surp@lemmy.world
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      I think what the image is trying to say is no one gives a shit that plays elder scrolls about this sorta thing because it’s a Fantasy game. No one needs to boot up a video game to be reminded how unfair and shitty our world is. We go to the game and escape that ( hopefully).

      • Shapillon@lemmy.world
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        It’s not like fiction (including Fantasy) is often used as a means to do social commentary. ^^`

      • TheObviousSolution@lemm.ee
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        No, you go to the game to play a power fantasy regardless of how unfair and shitty that fantasy world clearly is because of how your status or your skills help you surpass it. The Elder Scrolls goes that extra step to give you the choice to contribute or fight that unfair and shitty to such an extent that people mod it in when the choice is not given, and the player does not even have to be aware of it.

        People play videogames for the control, replayability, and often the narrative (which honestly was never The Elder Scroll’s strength), not necessarily to escape the world’s problems, problems which some games embrace. At a more basic level, games just need to provide gameplay and a player just needs to explore it.

        There’s no shortage of games where you play as a jackass in a shitty unfair world. GTA comes to mind.

    • Asafum@feddit.nl
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      Unfortunately what I really think is happening/happened with “woke hate” is manipulation for political gain as you mentioned with propaganda.

      These people couldn’t care less before, other than the religious zealots that would crusade against anything “gay.” The political right (I really believe this started in earnest in the US) found a pressure point to use that puts them in direct opposition to what their political adversary aims to achieve (acceptance of all people for who they are). As it stands in the US the right operates almost entirely based off of “whatever the left aims for, make it appear evil. Always oppose all that they do.” as opposed to having specific goals of their own other than “shower the wealthy with benefits, remove all barriers to retaining the entirety of profits.”

      Steve Bannon recently aimed their manipulation at what he described as “rootless white men” through the lense of gaming and societys affect on games/movies. Ever since that started there’s been an “explosion” of “this game woke?” discussions in Steam discussion fourms and in regard to movies. Before this manipulation these people just wouldn’t care and if anything you’d just see the odd person here or there complain about 2 guys kissing in a specific scene or something. They are made to be even more angry now because they’re made to believe it’s an affront to them and an attempt to manipulate them and society… Which is “funny” because they are being manipulated, just not by gaming/movie media.

      • Omniraptor@lemm.ee
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        Yeah the real reason they’re doing this cultural stuff is that they need a distraction from the fact that their material/economic platform is becoming more and more unpopular every year. So the anti woke/anti immigration frenzy must continue

        Dem politicians should point this out more, but their economic program isn’t very popular either. I miss Bernie :(

  • omega_x3@lemmy.world
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    What about a politician who sexually harasses an employee and making that employee read their erotic interspecies fan fiction.

  • Annoyed_🦀 @monyet.cc
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    Isn’t all Daedric Prince genderless? They just assume the form they like, some are just a pile of tentacle.

    • Dae@pawb.social
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      In a literal sense, yes. But they present themselves as male or female usually. So it’s still appropriate to refer to Boethia as “genderfluid” because they send to switch it up.

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        I guess that makes most of them gendered but sexless? I mean, sexless in a biological sense, particularly given that they’re not biological beings, but it’s also funny to imply that Vaermina simply never gets laid

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          They’re literally all-powerful gods that reign over their own worlds that are quite possibly the same size as, if not bigger than Nirn. They don’t play by our rules. I don’t think we can apply our conventions of sex and biology to them lol.

          As I said: they can be whatever the fuck they want.

          • BlackDragon@slrpnk.net
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            They’re literally all-powerful gods that reign over their own worlds

            Kind of but not really. Their “worlds” are just their true bodies. They are all-powerful in the sense that you are all-powerful compared to the bacteria living in your gut, which is to say that they’re not really. They have entirely finite power even within and over their own domains.

            See: the Champion of Cyrodiil (in addition to teams of entirely normal people) invading Dagon’s Oblivion gates and shutting them down. An all-powerful god would simply vaporize you the moment you tried to oppose him in his domain. Or forcibly convert you into a warrior of his armies. Or instantly transform all your bones into breadsticks and laugh as you cronched into a pile on the floor–but don’t worry, he decided not to give you permission to die. Enjoy being a breadcrumb puddle.

            that are quite possibly the same size as, if not bigger than Nirn.

            Kind of a misunderstanding of the cosmology. Nirn is a finite round planet floating in (something equivalent to) space. The planes of Oblivion are infinite planes forced into the rough appearance of round planets by mortals whose minds can’t comprehend infinity. They’re not comparable to Nirn because they aren’t even a similar type of cosmic structure, they only appear similar through the very limited eyes of mortals.

            I don’t think we can apply our conventions of sex and biology to them lol.

            This is definitely true though. I’m personally in the school of thought that Daedric Princes aren’t really people the way that, for example, the Tribunal’s components are, or for a real world example the way the Greek gods are. The Daedric Princes are concepts personified, or maybe even concepts forced into an anthropomorphic shape by uncomprehending mortal eyes, the same way the Planes of Oblivion will appear like finite round planets from afar.

            Mehrunes Dagon isn’t, I would argue, a guy who likes to destroy things. Mehrunes Dagon is destruction. He’s not a bad guy because he’s not a guy at all. Mehrunes Dagon enacts destruction and change the same way a hurricane does–not purposefully, not with malice, not even consciously in the same way a human can. Mehrunes Dagon simply, the same way you or I breathe, destroys.

            That isn’t to say that they are all the concept of their spheres. Hypothetically destroying Mehrunes Dagon wouldn’t remove the concept of destruction from the universe. But Mehrunes Dagon is the being representing–made of, perhaps–that concept as it exists in the foundation of the universe.

            The universe which I might add is a song, dreamt by the unimaginable and inconceivable higher-dimensional godhead. But that’s a topic for nerds nerdier than I.

            • Dae@pawb.social
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              Fair points! I was being somewhat hyperbolic. Compared to us, they are all-powerful, but, they are not in the grand scheme.

              I couldn’t remember if the planes were infinite or not. But I knew they were at least their own worlds under the Daedra’s dominion.

              One thing I do remember though is that Mehruns Dagon was actually created in Nirn by some of the Magna Ge before they peaced out. They created him because the Kalpa Nirn was in was being ruled over by an incredibly cruel and tyrannical race with no hope of change, so theh created the very embodiment of change, but realized too late they didn’t “install any brakes” so to speak.

              And his name is John Cena Mahruns Dagon. So you’re right, he isn’t evil, it’s just in his nature to make things change. I don’t remember how he finally ended up banished from Nirn, but that’s why he believes Nirn is his by right, cause he was created there.

              • BlackDragon@slrpnk.net
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                2 months ago

                No I’m just a nerd who reads a lot

                I actually can’t stand fudgemuppet, dude takes 40 mins to say what could (and should) be said in 5

                • Firestorm Druid@lemmy.zip
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                  As an ES lore noob, I quite enjoyed their videos a few years back. I guess they could have shortened their videos a lot but explaining all the interconnectedness between characters and events and stuff I liked a lot.

                  Do you just read wikis or are there actually books to read about TES lore?

          • redhorsejacket@lemmy.world
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            Hey, that’s funny, that’s verbatim what I say about trans folks too!

            Well, at least the last bit, although I’m not ruling out the former on a case by case basis.

        • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
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          It is assumed that a daedric prince can become a female with fully functional female anatomy, should they choose.

        • ✺roguetrick✺@lemmy.world
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          Vivec, anticipated by Mephala, actually both birthed and sired things. For the daedra specifically, Molag Bhaal impregnated vivec to birth monsters.

  • andros_rex@lemmy.world
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    Morrowind is a basically the thesis of Things Fall Apart in video game form, with a good deal of Dune. It’s an examination of colonialism. Every detail of that game is dripping with politics. The Dunmer are racist and engage in horrific chattel slavery - but does that mean it is right for the Empire to colonize them and take their resources? There’s substantial evidence that your character is a spook sent to “fulfill” an indigenous prophecy to tighten the Empire’s control - is that morally right?

    There’s also a hermaphrodite male presenting god who has had hundreds of children with something quite close to the Devil.

    • brognak@lemm.ee
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      This is literally the first time I have seen Things Fall Apart mentioned since high school, 20yrs ago.

      Good book, kinda got ruined by the typical over analysation of a HS English class though.

  • Snot Flickerman
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    Let’s hear it for badly written caricatures of racists that are so over-the-top that they allow real racists to say to themselves “I’m not actually a racist, because I’m not extreme as this flimsy caricature of a racist, which is what racists are really like.”

    I hate the idea that we have to write more well-developed racists just to get racists to recognize that they’re, you know, fucking racist, but god damn it, it needs to happen. Skryim is just one of many offenders, video games alone are just one of many offenders as well. Really its the whole US media landscape that has nothing but flimsy, weak caricatures of racists. I personally think these weak caricatures are part and parcel to why it’s hard to get racists to have self-reflection because we’re not actually doing the hard work of writing realistic racist characters who don’t start so extreme. Becoming a virulently violent racist takes time and doesn’t happen overnight, and those events that lead to it fall under the umbrella of what’s often called “character development.”

    /end unrelated rant

    • SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world
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      Write a well rounded racist character and you get racists rooting for that character. Racists will never self reflect when they see a well written racist character. It’s like how there are men who don’t see that the characters in Fight Club and Joker are bad people, and rather see themselves in them.

    • Zoidsberg@lemmy.ca
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      Worth noting that whenever the subject comes up, people will defend the Stormcloaks, praising Ulfric’s fight for the province’s right to self-govern and-

      Wait.

        • Mossy Feathers (She/They)@pawb.social
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          Dude, you gotta check out elder scrolls lore, it’s fucking wild. The world runs on clockwork, vivec gave molag bal sloppy toppy while his toppy was sloppy (he was headless), the lizards lick trees to become argonians which are wifi-enabled (the Hist trees can remotely control argonians, which meant shit got real during the Oblivion Crisis and Mehrunes Dagon, a fucking daedric prince pissed himself in fear when he tried to invade the Black Marsh), there are like, 72 1/2 forms of khajiit, it’s heavily suggested that the elder scrolls is a post-apocalyptic fantasy game…

          Also, every race in the elder scrolls has had a space program. The khajiit space program was literally just them standing on each other’s shoulders to reach space.

          Oh yeah. And the dragon breaks. When time and space just kinda fuck up and every possible outcome happens at the same time before settling onto a single thread (in-universe explanation for why there’s one canon ending to each game despite players being able to get other endings; each game takes place during a dragon break).

          • Philharmonic3@lemmy.world
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            Sloppy toppy while his toppy was sloppy is an inspired use of the English language. You deserve an honorary degree

          • Skua@kbin.earth
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            it’s heavily suggested that the elder scrolls is a post-apocalyptic fantasy game

            I distinctly recall a conversation I had on reddit in which I irritated several Fallout fans by insisting that the Elder Scrolls is simply Europe in the world of Fallout and that the Chinese stealth suits were 100% chameleon enchanted gear from TES IV

          • Default_Defect@midwest.social
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            The mental image I have of the Argonians all turnt on hist sap, invading Oblivion, making Daedra Lords piss themselves, and closing their own gates, makes me happy.

            • Mossy Feathers (She/They)@pawb.social
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              That’s almost literally how it went down, except the Argonians weren’t tripping, the Hist trees are literally psychic and recalled all the Hist-born Argonians to the Black Marsh. They somehow knew the Oblivion Crisis was about to occur, and recalled every single Hist-born Argonian in Tamriel so that they’d be waiting at the gates the moment they appeared.

              The Hist trees are also speculated to be the oldest living beings on Tamriel, if not Nirn entirely.

              The Hist trees recognize Sithis as the OG creator. (If I understand correctly) To put it another way, while other races worship Aedra and/or Daedra, the Hist trees basically worship the void itself.

              The Hist-born Argonians are able to use a wholly unique form of magic called Hist-magic which operates under its own, separate rules. This scares the elves.

          • MirthfulAlembic@lemmy.world
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            Also, every race in the elder scrolls has had a space program. The khajiit space program was literally just them standing on each other’s shoulders to reach space.

            Are there any pictures of this? I can’t stop laughing at the image in my head. This is phenomenal world building.

            • Skua@kbin.earth
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              There might be fan art, but I doubt there’s anything official. Besides how little attention anything Elsweyr generally gets (even the first ESO expansion into Elsweyr mostly had the khajiit as secondary characters), it originated in an unofficial source. Michael Kirkbride (a lead writer for Morrowind and several other important bits of Elder Scrolls stuff) wrote The Pocket Guide to the Empire, 2nd Edition with the input of community members. The Pocket Guide 1st edition came with the manual of Redguard, and the 3rd edition came with Oblivion. The 3rd edition contains a few references to the 2nd edition, which at the time had not actually been written, so Kirkbride decided to fill the gap. The relevant section, with explanatory notes from me that you can ignore if you know that stuff already, is:

              So Mane ^1 saw that Khajiit was fighting itself more than usual and donned the hairs of his many littermates and his clan and his guards until he could bear no more and then palanquin-raced throughout the lands to repeat these words: “Woah-ho now, mad cat. You fight and fight but if you will give Mane just one moment, he will show something far better, for the Mane has had many hours and fine sugar to think this over. Come now, Palatiit ^2 ; come now, Ne Quiniit ^3 . Together, just this once, Khajiit will stand tall as Alkosh ^4 , cat upon cat upon cat. And in doing so, it will climb to the moon as it has been told so many times.”

              Khajiit saw reason in these words and so it climbed and climbed, cat upon cat, for a hundred days. Much sugar ^5 was brought there to support the climbers and in the end Khajiit climbed high, so very high that it was in fact closer to Jo’Segunda ^6 than to Nirni ^7 below. At that moment, little Alfiq ^8 fell upwards and from there on Khajiit helped Khajiit up, which was down, until all were gathered there. This is where Khajiit intends to stay from now on, for who could know strife when walking sugar and not sand?

              1 - The Mane is the religious leader of the khajiit 2 - Pa’alatiin, or Pellitine, is the southern half of Elsweyr. Elsweyr is the region that the khajiit are from, and had only recently been united when the 2nd edition was written in-universe 3 - Ne Quin’al or Anequine is the northern half of Elsweyr 4 - Alkosh is the khajiiti interpretation or version of the god of time and top god of most pantheons, generally known as Akatosh to the empire and therefore in most game material 5 - Moon sugar is a narcotic with great religious significance in khajiiti society. If you’ve come across skooma in the games, it is the heroin to moon sugar’s opium 6 - Jo’Segunda, or Secunda, is one of the two moons 7 - Nirni, or Nirn, is the planet that Tamriel and the games are set on 8 - An alfiq is a type of khajiit that physically resembles a housecat but which is every bit as sapient as any other khajiit. You can actually meet several in ESO, but sadly cannot play as one. The Legends card “Frazzled Alfiq” is probably my all time favourite piece of official Elder Scrolls art

              Anyway Kirkbride’s unofficial stuff is not “canon”, for whatever that’s worth, but due to his significance to the setting and the fact that his writing is usually interesting, people often accept it as such. The story does not end there, though! The developers of ESO have a series called Loremaster’s Archive, which is an in-character lore Q&A series. In “Moon Bishop Hunal Answers Your Questions”, someone asked about the “cat upon cat” story.

              “Our scribes are currently working on the transcription of the ‘Ri’datta-ssabavezi.’ In this story, your people are climbing ‘cat upon cat’ and finally reach Jone, where they founded something called ‘Lleswer.’ But we failed to understand the meaning of this. Some at the Guild suggest it has to be taken literally, but it seems impossible. Am I right?” – Iszara the Restless, Singer of the Scenarist Guild

              Moon Bishop Hunal says, “It is the nature of myth to be true and yet at the same time mere allegory. Are you ‘right’? In this context, the question is without meaning. But do not be offended, hairless one. Many stories are puzzles with more than one solution.”

              So, canon? Maybe, maybe not. But it got a nod, and people like it.

            • Mossy Feathers (She/They)@pawb.social
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              Sadly, afaik, there are no official images of it. As Skua noted, it’s not exactly canon, but to my knowledge there isn’t actually anything that contradicts it. As such, I think most lore nerds take it as fact. Also because, as Skua said, it’s way more interesting for the Khajiit to have had a space program where they stood on each other’s shoulders than not.

              Also, Bethesda has severely neglected the Argonians and Khajiit, so people take whatever Argonian or Khajiit lore they can get. I think they’re “too furry” for Bethesda or something.

              Admittedly, a Black Marsh TES would be difficult to do without it being an Argonian-only spin-off because, iirc, Argonians violently eject anyone trying to enter the marsh.

              Meanwhile, a game set in Elsweyr would require a lot of effort due to all the different skeletons and character models they’d have to create. They’d probably double or triple the number of character models simply due to all the different forms of Khajiit (there are 17 forms, ranging from having the appearance of a basic house cat to being almost identical to Mer (elves) or Men (Redguard, imperial, etc)), with significantly more work if they tried to make them all playable with full armor sets.

      • Mossy Feathers (She/They)@pawb.social
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        I remember there being jokes that seemed like they were drawing parallels between TES racism and IRL racism (like how the Dunmer like calling non-dunmer “N’wah”, which sounds suspiciously like “n-word” if you slur the words as you say them) or making fun of racism in the series. I don’t remember TrueSTL using jokes to actually make fun of IRL minorities though.

        I could be wrong, it’s been a while, but I don’t remember seeing anything that came off as being intentionally malicious. I will also concede, however, that there were definitely things that might come off that way to a passerby with no TES lore knowledge.

        • explodicle@sh.itjust.works
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          That’s true, I just interpret “huh yuk I can mean the N word with this one weird trick” as racism. When the orcs are loud and boorish, that’s fine. When they love fried chicken and watermelon, it’s clearly a proxy.

          • Mossy Feathers (She/They)@pawb.social
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            Yeah, yanno I think that’s a fair interpretation. I don’t fully agree with it, but I can see your logic. I will say that, now that you mention the orc thing, I think I seeing something like that once and I think I remember the OP getting a warning for it being too real (I have a vague memory of seeing something like that and thinking, “okay, that’s too far, that’s not funny anymore” and then seeing a mod warning in the comments). It seemed like most of the users knew where the line was and tried to avoid stepping over it, but again, it’s been a while since I last bothered to look at Reddit (at least a year I think, maybe two), so I could be misremembering or things could have changed, etc.