This whole meme is based on a lie; people on a keto diet get harassed all the time.
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That’s it. Had a buddy do it. Would order Burger, no bun. Obviously, we made a joke out of it. And that’s it. Nobody cares.
Guilty conscience meat eaters use concern trolling to salvage their own self-esteem. In my experience, those expressions of worry are back handed compliments at best. They never come from people who are in better shape than I am and they don’t come from people with better nutrition either.
Wow you really nailed it.
I lost 58kg and the only things I ever heard was concern trolling from my friends that resented me for doing what they could not.
Never heard word one about my body while I was unhealthy and unhappy, and the shitty remarks started as soon as the weight reduction became noticeable.
“Woah slow down, don’t want you to disappear!” “You’ve proven your point! You can eat a donut!” “Why do you want to be miserable and only eat seeds?” “Fuck dude you’re vanishing! Eat a hamburger!” “You think you’re better than everyone now!” “It’s actually really unhealthy to be as lean as you’ve become.” “Don’t like hanging out anymore, you make me think about every molecule I put in my damned mouth!” “You look like a skeleton now.”
And so forth.
Wow those are shitty people. Good on you for losing that weight, as a hefty fellow it’s fucking haaaaard work and you should be proud of the effort you put in!
Thanks for the support!
I made so many changes in my journey. I taught myself to cook and made every meal from scratch ingredients… for 6 months. I’m reminiscing now thinking about how many tortillas I’ve pressed, sauces I’ve made, things I’ve fermented, and hundreds of hours on the cutting board. How many times I ordered a “kid size” pizza or sundae on my “cheat” days lol
I ran (poorly), swam, rode, lifted and burned so many calories. I meditated every day and did monthly therapy to help with the mental stress of the physical and lifestyle changes. That is all time, effort, pain, money, and sacrifice.
Every day without wavering I made a hundred difficult little choices that prioritized my goals vs my desires/old patterns. Food everywhere and people genuinely insulted when I wouldn’t partake with them or in their way. Watching my friends literally not enjoy their meal from their own shame, just because my serving was conspicuously smaller. Dealing with my biology compelling me to eat one way while I was consciously reprogramming myself to eat another way. Massive social pressures from all sides.
I never really even told anybody of my goals or changes. I didn’t make it my personality or a thing. Never spoke of it once or advocated anything to my friends. Only spoke about being slimmer when specifically asked.
That’s why it was so hurtful to undertake such tremendous responsibility for my own personal transformation, and then have people internalize it, make my journey about how them and how they feel shitty when they look at me, then make a snide or sinister comment. Only my best friend of 30 years gave me any positive feedback.
The whole thing was kind of a rough ride. Worth it in the end, but wow it was so much more than just eating less.
Thanks for listening. I really appreciate your comment a lot!
Such and interesting read and I hope you found it worth it in the end…! You’ve verbalised a lot of my experiences with quitting alcohol. It was the hardest thing I’ve done and lost a lot of ‘friends’ along the way. But ended up happier, healthier, and genuinely enjoying life again.
Good for you my friend! Yes it was the same thing when I quit alcohol 8 years ago! Quickly find out that people are happy for you to quit drinking until you actually do it, then it’s like … what you think you’re better than me? Come on have a drink!
Wow this is the truth of the post. Not just that it ia demeaning that vegans get harassed but why it’s counter to the reality of the effort being made.
Good on you, yeah you can’t downplay the fortitude required to make such life altering changes. It’s so easy to slip back into the status quo. That being said for anyone else reading, if you’ve tried, and failed, remember that you got further along than if you never tried at all. Keep at it, don’t beat yourself up, you can do it!
Congrats on the weight loss.
I had to stop at 40Kg because my heart meds went out of balance… and have pretty quickly gained 12Kg since.
Ah that’s interesting and something I hadn’t considered. I wasn’t really on any meds except Nexium at the time. Is your heart medication dose dependent on weight? I genuinely don’t know anything about the conditions or treatment.
What do you credit for the 12kg regaining? Just wondering, my weight still swings about 8kg this way and that but I seem to have generally stabilized in a range.
Is your heart medication dose dependent on weight?
It’s somewhat interesting, because the main heart meds are metabolic blockers (ramipril and bisoprolol, respectively an angiotensin-converting enzime inhibitor, and a beta1-selective blocker that inhibits cAMP phosphorylation), so they can only block certain metabolic paths and once that’s done, they can’t have more effect no matter the dose (they’re basically non-overdoseable).
But… at the same time, I had a diuretic added on (dapagliflozin) as part of a combined diabetes treatment, that used to work fine at the top weight, but at the bottom weight turned out to both reduce blood volume, impacting blood pressure, and lower blood sugar by too much, so that one had to go.
What do you credit for the 12kg regaining?
Reduction in stress (an extreme stress peak is what made me lose most of the weight), along with depression, and general despair due to a double back hernia that left me barely able to walk. I’m slightly better now after some physiotherapy, but still moving way less than before, so it’s anyone’s guess how it will go. It also made me switch to a worse diet, since I can’t stay up long enough to prepare healthier stuff.
Thanks for sharing, I don’t know why you are being downvoted or who is in this thread being a dick.
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Animals are there to be food.
You think animals are there for a fated reason? Like all animals have a destiny? Because your comment relies on this notion.
Sure if you’re both Stretch Armstrong lol. They’re both silly appeals to extreme.
Could you find a situation where something is there to be or do something without it being decided beforehand?
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Now apply that to something you disagree with and see how you go.
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elscallr
You don’t need to use swear words.
virtually nobody
The ones who felt guilty about it in this context have stopped doing it. You must have felt so smart though!
Virtually nobody who eats meat feels guilty about it
I felt guilty about it and became a vegetarian and, once I leaned about how milk and eggs lead to death and suffering, a vegan. I have been so for 10 years plus now.
Animals are there to be food.
Yes, but only in the same sense that woman are there for the plesure and serving of men. It’s a social construction and is, as it thankfully has with the perception of woman, changing.
If there was a life form that could eat me it would, and I’d have to accept that.
I don’t think so. I think you’d ramble in about how unethical it is to eat a sentient beeing and how cruel this hypothetical lifeform is. Because that’s how we are build. It’s easiest for us to feel empathie towards our own sorry asses.
You can learn to expand your empathie tough. Start here. Watch it completely. No skipping. Then we can talk:
We bred them to be like that tho there were wild versions of chickens. Ever seen a wild turkey? Fuuuuck. Talk about risk if you miss that things taking an eye out. Bovines were easier prey but in the wild would have been protected by bulls, I think?
We bred plants to be more appealing to
ever see a native tomatoe. the entire world thought they were fucking poisonous for ages
Every single food item vegans eat has been Genetically Modified
thats how they are able to hold onto a failing diet. because we super charged the few items they do eat. society and science saved vegans from themselves and they still are ungrateful ignorant animals who think they dont have to eat other animals for food.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/soil-depletion-aND-NUTRITION-LOSS/
Our fruits and vegetables are being bred to be less nutritious and more visually appealing.
and the profits go up!
If there was a life form that could eat me it would, and I’d have to accept that.
Ever heard of cannibalism?.. or E. Coli, just get a bit in your blood and it will eat you in no time (aka: sepsis).
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Okay, let someone murder you and eat you if they are hungry then. Plenty of people go hungry each year, why don’t we eat each other? Or why won’t you capture and eat my dog?
You have to be truly deranged to compare the rights of lower lifeforms to those of humans.
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“I dont have a conscience so I assume no one else does either.”
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If there was a life form that could eat me it would, and I’d have to accept that.
So you don’t eat medicines?
I’m gonna be honest, I wanted to argue against this, but I can’t deny it. I’m part of a relatively overweight family (actually mostly because of immune system problems that thankfully I didn’t inherit) and all I get from my parents are “You’re looking skinny” or “You’re worrying too much about weight” just because I want to exercise and eat well. Even then, I’m ~20lbs over weight. To be devil’s advocate, I think part of it is that overweight people have struggled with problems of being too hard on themselves before, and so don’t want to you fall into that, but go too far the other way. The conversation of overweight/vegans doesn’t exactly overlap perfectly, but it made me think of it.
guilty conscience meat eaters. “I’m sorry Cow, but…you are tasty” 🤣
le epic funny 🤣🤣🤣
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Maybe it has become worse since all those vegan or vegetarian fast food options became available in stores and restaurants.
When I hear non-vegs talk about living meat-free, the conversation always revolves around these meat substitutes, how unhealthy they are.
It does not come to their mind one can prepare a meal from fresh produce. Yes of course, fast food is unhealthy. On the other hand, I like it.
Are the meat substitutes actually bad, though? Certainly can’t be worse than normal fast food.
Assuming you’re asking about things like impossible and beyond meat. They are generally not “healthy” but one stark difference is they don’t have cholesterol.
Whether something is healthy or not is very contentious in the first place, especially with how much misinformation there is out there.
I just try to read the labels on the replacements I buy, and most of them just have many random vegetables and stuff, with a seemingly good balance in nutrients and so on. Maybe there is stuff I’m missing, but I don’t see much bad that can be in there.
I think the most important thing is to just have a relatively balanced diet.
I’d say that they are as healthy as the burger king meat they are substituting. I wouldn’t eat either but if you are there, picking either is equally bad so whatever.
The unhealthiest part about them is just gonna be that they’re salty, fried and greasy, just like other fast food. It’s just a lump of plant fibres (usually peas or wheat these days, I find) thrown in a frier.
Yeah they are better than fast food, even the fast food is healthier if you sub the meat. But that is a terrible benchmark to use.
Compare these meat substitutes to the humble bean and it’s no contest.
I assure you these people are not eating healthy meals lol, it’s all bad faith because the idea of them not eating meat makes them feel threatened about the size of their peepee.
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you managed to write a wall of text, but still use ‘u’ instead of ‘you’ 🤨
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U
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making sure u get a well-rounded diet
This is the only important part.
Vegan is fine if you’re replacing the stuff you take out, not just skip it. It’s easier now, but when vegan was just gaining traction, the alternatives weren’t as plentyful as they are now.
But just make sure your diet is well balanced.
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bad for u if u
literally
This is where you lost all cred. Not before the lack of carnatine.
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You have a lot of bad information about keto. It certainly doesn’t make you lethargic or miserable, and definitely doesn’t starve your brain. Quite the opposite… it’s being used therapeutically for Parkinson’s disease One of the studies referenced in that article, found here is summarized this way
“More specifically, the symptoms that improved most after keto dieting were urinary problems, pain and other unpleasant sensations, fatigue, daytime sleepiness, and cognitive impairment. These findings are particularly profound because nonmotor symptoms ultimately represent the most disabling aspect of Parkinson’s disease.”
Regarding energy levels most people report having much more energy, and I suspect your friends issue while in the army doing PT was related to electrolytes. People going on any kind of whole food diet, which keto tends to be, often find they get very little salt in their new diet since they’re not eating processed food. People who work out or are otherwise very active often find they have to be intentional about adding salt to their diet or they will in fact find themselves tired and fatigued. Easy to remedy, and again a typical problem for anyone transitioning from a diet with lots of processed foods to one without.
There’s been a lot more un-biased study of keto diets in recent years and a lot better science. It’s not for everybody, but it’s not intrinsically unhealthy and way better than the traditional high-carb, high-sugar, high-processed food diet.
Also, a keto diet does not specifically include or exclude red meat. That’s an individuals choice, just like with virtually any other diet that includes animal protein.
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Vegan, on the other hand, excludes plenty of foods that are common sources of essential nutrients and especially protein.
Like what??? Seriously, except for B12 theres nothing a vegan diet doesnt have.
Pistachios are a full protein. Lentils Peas and Veggies make full proteins. What are you on about?I think they mean if you were just to take your usual diet and remove certain items so as to make your diet keto friendly, you might be fine. But if you took a usual meat/dairy/egg diet and just stopped eating those fortified foods (without finding a substitution for those nutrients), you would be worse off.
Okay, i see what you mean. But i also see that that’s a dumb way to think about it? Who changes their diet by just not eating certain foods anymore without incorporating something else.
Some of the most nutritionally complete foods we can eat like spinach and other such veggies are limited (though not excluded) on a keto diet, meanwhile there is no limit to how much of these you can eat as a vegan. But also food isn’t just medicine or energy, it can also be poison, and other than refined junk it’s going to be the animal foods that are some of the deadliest.
I’ll agree with you that foods like wheat and rice are not very nutritious, but also they aren’t likely to be the foods that kill you, and you can easily not eat them. Meanwhile keto is very hard to do without animal foods, for many people it’s very hard to do even with animal foods. Keto doesn’t just require you to exclude a list of foods like you sell it, it has very strict macro requirements which requires monitoring your intake of many of the allowed foods.
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You can literally just read the comments from people who eat meat and see that they are more insufferable than vegans right here in this very thread
Always reassuring when carnists come on here to justify themselves on a vegan community. Honestly wouldn’t be a vegan space without those comments
Right? They love coming over here to reassure themselves they’re not murderers.
It’s easier for them to shit on vegans than to admit to themselves that they are causing mass suffering
Anyone who eats meat is a murderer. I eat meat but only what’s hunted myself so I can be sure that animal wasn’t raised to die or all the other animal rights violations that come with the farming industry. I wouldn’t mind being hunted by a human or a bear aslong as I had a decent life and was able to experience things like freedom and they didn’t use any tools that I consider to be unfair like guns (knives and bows are okay but I prefer handmaking them on site) so the argument of “but what if u were the animal” doesn’t work for me because that’s how I got to this position.
I’m writing this mainly cause I’m curious abt your thoughts on my position. Do u think I’m as bad as farm industry users because I don’t mind eating meat, do u think I’m just a bit depressed and/or psychopathic because I wouldnt mind dying and killing or do u think my position is actually reasonable but its just not how u personally view the issue.
Anyone who eats meat is a murderer. I eat meat
That’s all you needed to say
It front paged. Nobody “came here” to defend themselves.
Scrolling down half i the comments has give me a true headache. Why do you guys feel the need to explain your consumption to vegans? Not like we have not heard your “arguments” a thousand times before.
Oh wait, you arent trying to justify your actions to us but to yourself?
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that’s the neat part, You are malnourished on a vegan diet.
As someone who regularly works with registered dietitians in clinical settings, some of which hold PhDs, please stop spreading misinformation from a place of hate and prejudice.
he said, spreading misinformation.
They posted peer-reviewed papers from medical nutrition research groups, what exactly would be these researchers incentive for pushing misinformation about diets?
It’s all big eggplant man
I keep trying to plant eggs and they never grow. It’s a conspiracy.
Big Eggplant Man, the lesser known brother of Doctor Eggman
they posted that can indeed suck a black mans cock. but are you going to do that?
what exactly would these researchers incentive for pushing misinformation?
well…lets see, a failed degree and life choices coupled with the fact that if they don’t change tact they will be as rich as a mary K agent.
No sources and racism…
racism where point it out, go ahead without all the autistic …s
Post your peer reviewed contrary article about dicks so we can discuss instead
Dude, just do us all a favour and go back to twitter. You’re like the drunk homeless guy at the bar that brings the mood down for everyone else. And I get that you’re the kind of person that enjoys ruining things for other people, but can you just not? Just go outside or do something productive with your life instead?
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What too much meat does to a racist mf.
misinformation is what I don’t like
m8 just cause you Work with them. doesn’t make you a dietician and registered dieticians are jokes. there is no PHD for telling people how to diet and if there is, holy christ. i spent all my time and money on a computer science masters and legal bachelors for no fucking reason then…get out.
Legal bachelors is not the same as medical science you absolute dunce. So you just don’t believe people can do research on medicine?
have you considered eating meat? its kinda good
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Telling people how to diet? You clearly have absolutely no idea what a registered dietitian. I’m not going to waste any more time on an obvious troll.
What specific nutrient can vegans not get on a plant based diet?
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meaningful protein.
In B4 u say lentils for the 419292947372th time in your life, probably. likely, usual…
Bro there are dozens of species of mammals that get large amounts of protein from sources other than meat.
Yes, but they’re capable of ruminating and/or other tricks. (I think vegan and vegetarian diets are fine, just want to be accurate.)
Yeah that is true, I wish I had the stomach enzymes of a goat…
hmmm humans dont. so i guess …meats back on the menu boys
Humans are capable of eating an extremely broad variety of plants. Vegetarian diet is perfectly healthy for people. Vegan diet has only a few problems, which have already been solved. You can be vegan and live a very healthy life, but you have to supplement a few necessary nutrients. Meat has never been off the menu. It is possible to chose not to eat it, if you prefer that.
bro eat meat. instead of wasting your precious lentil energy typing. it might give you more oxygenated blood to your brain :D
are we those animals though?
@Colorcodedresistor @wafflez What do you mean by meaningful? I almost feel like it’s intentionally vague so as to be difficult to rebuke.
Do you just mean quantity or amount of protein? Or something else entirely.
It’s my understanding that authorities on diet and nutrition all disagree with you. https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/eat-well/how-to-eat-a-balanced-diet/the-vegan-diet/
bro, eat meat. i promise you aren’t going to get canceled by cattle
It’s not about getting cancelled or politics, it’s about living up to the ideal that humans are actually better than that, that we can feel empathy and sadness for other creatures suffering, and it’s in our power to do something about it.
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Vitamin B-12 deficiency is more prevalent in vegans.
That doesn’t mean that vitamin diets always give you a deficiency. You can still get B12 as a vegan.
Never said you couldn’t. It’s just that a vegan diet is highly correlated with vitamin B12 deficiency.
Might aswell pop in supplements all day and call it a vegan diet if you want.
@SchizoDenji @BluesF in my mind, it’s common knowledge among vegans that you should be taking a B12 supplement if you are vegan.
You can get B12 from a bunch of stuff and not have to. I’ve been vegan for long stretches (vegetarian most of the time) and had no issues.
You’re right, it is. My wife takes B-12 supplements because she’s vegan and has a deficiency.
Yeah and heart disease is more prevalent in meat eaters. So what’s your point here?
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no U?
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Lol says you who is probably malnourished because you eat McDonald’s 3 meals a day.
Man the chuds in this thread really proving the OP right
why are there so many triggered omnis in this thread lmao
They don’t like feeling bad for the terrible things they do.
The post is on the front page
Seriously, I’m not used to seeing this many comments with so many votes going either way. The post is so harmless.
I’ve done both vegan and keto for over a year at some point during my life and what I will say is that I naturally cover my nutrition bases through preferences and desires, while vegan though I had to hunt down (forgive the pun) b12 and complete proteins combinations a little more diligently to cover my nutrition needs.
Or put differently, I think it’s easier to mess up a vegan diet than a keto one.
I’ve never understood full veganism. Is it not morally okay to consume animal products (such as milk or eggs) from actual free roaming and happy animals? And not the BS marketed “free range” products in the US.
Say I have 10 acres and keep a dozen or so chickens to roam around and eat all the ticks on my property, is it morally wrong to eat their eggs?
Society doesn’t work on edge cases. But for the sake of argument:
If that’s all the animal products you eat, these chickens are not selected through the common practice of grinding male chicks, the hens are going to die of old age, etc etc etc - for what I’m concerned you’re vegan.
Veganism is about ethics, not diet. Diet is a mere consequence. Lab grown meat is more vegan than coconut gathered by enslaved monkeys (yes it’s a thing).
So if you fine one such farm where animals are never killed or otherwise exploited then by all means, eat those eggs and call yourself a vegan. But something tells me you won’t find it.
Adding to this - I really want to emphasize how much of an edge case this is.
Around 60% of the world’s population lives in urban environments, and only ~10-15% of the population works in agriculture where one might expect to encounter a scenario like this.
Living on 10 acres and raising chickens who you hug every night before bed and treat with the utmost respect is a nice ideal to strive for, but it is not achievable for most people, and there is no scenario where we maintain global meat & dairy consumption levels ethically/sustainably. Treating it as a viable solution is disingenuous because it’s only a solution for a limited few.
There’s a lot of those places in my area, at least for chickens. Not so much for dairy cows.
A lot of places where all chickens die of old age and males don’t get killed as chicks. Really. Go to one of those places then, check the hen/rooster ratio (should be 50/50) and ask them what happens when hens no longer lay down eggs. Do let me know please.
I’m not Vegan, so I can’t speak for them, but here’s my understanding
if you live in an urban environment, it’s basically impossible to get what you’re referring to. Maybe if you were willing to have it shipped to you at great cost and not insignificant effort, but the only thing available at stores in the US is the BS marketed “free range” stuff. And even if you find a place that claims to be the real deal, how do you verify? Basically, it’s easier for most people to just go Vegan then to seriously vet every source of animal products
Additionally, many vegans believe it to be a genuinely healthier diet than an omnivore diet. And please don’t respond with " we evolved to be meat eaters" or something like that, because we didn’t “evolve” to do practically any of the things modern life entails, including a lot of what we eat. Beyond that one BS counterargument though, I make no claims as to whether they’re right. Anecdotally, my sister in law suffered from IBS her whole life until she went Vegan, when the problem went away entirely. So it certainly has benefit for some people
Finally, for a lot of vegans it’s an issue of consent - some might say that you shouldn’t eat those eggs in your example for the simple reason that they don’t belong to you, and you can’t morally take them, because theres no way to ask consent, and so you shouldn’t. Again, you don’t have to agree with the outlook, but that’s the way several vegans have explained it to me.
If any actual vegans come along and think I’m misrepresenting something, feel free to correct it
more or less sums it up. Source: vegan AF
Wanted to add a few arguments I saw about eggs, first that we selectively bred chickens to produce eggs at an extremely high rate (unsure what this does to their well-being, but apparently the laying itself is painless). Second, the chicken’s eggs could be seen as the “work” they do in exchange for keeping them healthy and happy.
The eggshell requires calcium. At the rates at which modern egg laying hens ovulate, their bones become far more fragile to siphon it. That is to say that their ability to self sustain and survive for the total lifespan of a chicken is greatly reduced.
Thanks for the info, that makes a lot of sense.
Thats only if you arent feeding them a regular source of calcium.
Which would happen to literally any animal not properly fed.
Supplements and well managed diets do help, but of the available data, it looks like 12-35% are still deficient depending on area of the world. I checked for studies in USA and Europe. And of course, once that’s determined for particular chicken who end up producing thin shell eggs - they get killed.
And ultimately, they’ve been bred to rely on said diet and supplementing. Vegans are against breeding as it is, let alone breeding them to be dependent.
Almost all domestic animals are dependant, thats how mutualistic symbiotic partnerships work. Humans are only recently arguably capable of abandoning that dependance, none of our symbiotic partners can match that. Im really creeped out by what youre implying here, we shouldnt kill off our evolutionary partners just because we dont need them any longer.
And… “Bred to rely on said diet” is a crazy thing to say, no? All animals rely on their diet. Some breeds of chicken have a higher calcium intake requirement, but so do some breeds of human. Not an excuse nor reason to drive either extinct.
Homie the problem with breeding them like this is selecting them to ovulate 300 times a year so we can steal their excretions.
Symbiotic relationships don’t involve human breeding intervention. Least of all when it’s for selecting traits that come to the animal’s detriment. I’m not opposed to rescuing animals or providing accomodations for animals facing extinction so as to safetly raise young with minimimal human interaction.
You know what else isn’t a partnership? Slitting their throats. Which happens to these chickens. Thats creepy. Assuming you aren’t Vegan, which I don’t think you identify as much, idk why you care if they go extinct - because you want to keep eating them? I just don’t see good faith framing in your interpretation of what I said at all.
When they are kept happy and healthy I personally don’t disagree yeah, but frankly how many of us here actually get our eggs from sources like that?
If I were ever to go Vegan, I probably wouldn’t mind eating eggs laid up in environments like that, but I also don’t blame vegans who’d rather just simplify things by cutting it out entirely than having to morally evaluate every egg they eat
@bitsplease @Poem_for_your_sprog Pretty much. Just also want to add that if we want to make eggs or dairy a staple of our diet (especially dairy), it requires essentially treating other living beings as factories to be abused until they die. Like, cows don’t continuously produce milk all the time, right? They have to give birth and *then* they start producing milk (like literally every mammal). So if we want milk on demand, we need to keep cows continuously pregnant, clearly abuse.
Yeah definitely impossible for a lot of people. I live somewhere that I can do this and even get eggs from those people. Mmmm tick eggs.
I think there’s some information you don’t know about milk and eggs: milk is produced by forcing a cow to be pregnant (they call the rack they tie them to for breeding the rape rack), and then forcibly removing her calves from her and stealing her milk. It’s terrible. And eggs are forced to be produced by grinding up male chicks so that females produce more. It’s honestly terrible.
You are intentionally ignoring what they said about hens on their own property.
How do you think the cow would get pregnant or where you’d get the eggs from?
I get eggs from our own chickens. Six chickens and a rooster. Hatched them myself, originally had two roosters. The other rooster went to a local petting zoo which had some hens, but their rooster had died.
By the way, six chickens lay a lot of eggs, more than a family of four eats.
But where did your chickens come from? They were sorted by sex and the males thrown in a grinder.
They just told you they hatched them themselves.
The chickens they hatched from did not appear out of thin air.
Do I need to promote my chicken’s lineage back to before they were domesticated?
I’m referring more to small farm chickens or chickens that are basically pets (they still plop out tons of eggs). All of the factory farmed products are definitely terrible.
And to clarify I’m not against veganism at all, just curious where/why lines are drawn.
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They are selectively bred to overproduce eggs which shortens their lifespan significantly. Also they cannot consent to you taking their eggs away, in the same way it is wrong to steal from someone else.
People are vegetarian and vegan for a variety of reasons. There is also no reason people need to live their life confined to a label. The labels are helpful for quick understanding, such as ordering meals and discussing these topics, but people are more varried than labels.
I’ve been a full vegetarian for over 22 years but before that I only ate meat that I hunted or fished myself. I didn’t call myself a vegetarian then, but ordered vegetarian when eating out. I probably had similar ethos to some including a dislike of the commercial meat industry, while others would still abhor that I was harvesting my own meat from the forest.
So what I would say to your question is why do you worry about attaining the label of vegan? If you or someone else is sourcing animals in a way that you feel is ethical, then simply be a conscientious consumer who orders vegan when eating out. As a bonus, you sidestep all the confusion around the label and the different reasons people have for using it.
A cousin of mine literally owns chickens and won’t eat their eggs. I don’t get it.
What a weirdo. I know someone who’s dog died at a prime age and they didn’t even eat it.
Idk man eating eggs kinda weird ? You eat spider eggs?
Eating plants is kinda weird too. I mean, do you eat hard wood?
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I’m not a vegan but this is a bad argument. You don’t need back to get omega3s. Omnivore means you CAN eat meat, not that you NEED to eat meat. That would make you a carnivore.
Nobody cares about if you like eating those things, by the way. Not sure why you bothered to tell everyone about your food preferences with such detail except to get a rise out of Vegans, jeez. It’s also pretty hilarious that you brought up your “concern” for them given the text in the screenshot lol
B12 would be a much better argument tbh. That said, modern vegan diets can have enough B12 if theyre fortified. IF being the key word.
they inject animals with b12 supplements. So yo may as well take the supplement yourself
Grain fed cattle are fed a Cobalt mineral supplement because grains do not have significant amounts of Cobalt. Grass fed cattle,fish and other animals typically do obtain enough B12 or Cobalt from their diet to not require supplementation i.e free range/organic farms/ranches.
So basically, the fact that factory farms need to supplement their cattle with Cobalt is something vegans should be talking more about because it is arguably another example of cruelty that vegans wish to avoid participating in.
Doesn’t really matter what it is. There’s healthy people and unhealthy people and the dividing line isn’t vegan/non-vegan. The post is about veganism being a target of “concern” by on-lookers when other diets have equally real health concerns
Right, you can get plenty of fats from a vegan diet if you are smart about it. The tough part seems to be getting enough healthy fats and proteins. In both keto and vegan diets you can follow the diet and absolutely destroy your body if you don’t also pay attention to essential fats, vitamins, etc.
Should be noted that you can actually do keto vegetarian but boy will it be hard. The more restrictive the diet, the more you need to pay attention to in terms of your nutrition.
you can get plenty of fats from a vegan diet if you are smart about it
You don’t even need to be smart about it. French fries are vegan. As are Oreos, and probably a billion other things that can get you plenty of fats without trying.
People seem to have the misconception that vegans just eat raw fruits and veggies all day (as evidenced by the fact that the “vegan option” at my work Halloween party was just a Costco fruit bowl). Most of the cooked veggies I eat are tossed in olive or avocado oil, a great source of fats.
Sure, some of the vegans I know supplement D3 and B12 because plant based foods, unless fortified, are lacking in these nutrients, but guess what, those are super easy things to pick up at the grocery store vitamin aisle - a small price to pay for all of the other benefits of going vegan.
All of that said, I’ve never met a vegan who had any difficulty getting enough fat in their diet.
More people should be taking care of their vitamin D levels. It’s a really common deficiency.
Getting enough fat is easy, but my vegan recipes are the only ones that I intentionally add extra oil to fix the macros. It’s just easier to eat a reasonable amount of fat on a vegan diet compared to a constant excess in a non vegan diet.
You shouldnt be using vitamin pills for any dietary supplement. You uptake ~10-30% if youre lucky. The pill goes right through you. It needs to be in a food item with some mass, so it stays within the digestive tract.
…but you still get the 10-30%?
Yeah, it has worse uptake, just eat it with food.
Eating it with food doesnt change the uptake. It doesnt magically undissolve because there is food sitting beside it.
If youre only getting 10-30% of a supplemental nutrient, youre going to still be deficient. Youre just now spending money to be deficient, when before you got to keep the money.
…you do realize that if your body takes up too little, you just eat more, right?
I’ve taken blood tests. Nutrients in pill form work just fine.
@wildginger @RvTV95XBeo Right, so you can just take it after a meal and uptake should be okay…
Not really, because the pill just dissolves and flushes out with your piss all the same.
Its not in the food. If you really are dedicated to using a pill form, you need to crush it and directly add it in with meal prep.
@wildginger Have there been actual tests on this? I’m sure there have, but I haven’t looked into it too much.
Many medicines have low uptake efficiency. It just means you need to take 3-10 times the dose you need. Like if your body needs 10mg, you might need to take a 30 to 100mg pill.
These arent meds.
Yeah but that’s what the screenshot is talking about. People are so quick to express “concern” to vegans but not keto eaters
I think people are just addicted to meat, most people are convinced we need it in almost every meal. So they feel threatened, like threatening to take your last beer away threatened. Veganism aside, if the general population went to a much lower quantity of meat eating (like a couple times a week instead of a day) we would all be so much better off.
I stopped cooking meat at home and my consumption of it plummeted. For now, I will still eat it at restaurants or when my friends and family cook it…but I don’t feel like I “need” it like I used to.
This was a big game changer for me - just learning how to cook delicious veggies/plant-based foods at home dropped my meat consumption dramatically. From there I started noticing which restaurants actually had good vegan/vegetarian options, and as my pallette shifted, so did my list of favorite restaurants.
That’s how I picture it going going for me, too. Some people might say to just rip the band-aid off but I know myself too well - if I jump in fully, I’ll eventually crack and feel so bad about it I’ll give up the idea entirely. So I’m going slow and letting it happen naturally. I’m a few years in and I barely eat red meat but bacon and chicken are still obstacles to overcome
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I feel like you didn’t even read what I wrote. Humans are CAPABLE of receiving energy through meat, they do not require it. I never claimed you thought humans were carnivores. Teeth aren’t what makes it possible so I’m not sure why you brought it up. If you chop up a steak really tiny and feed it to a pure herbivore, they’re gonna get sick or die. So quit citing “science” when you clearly don’t understand it.
I’m dismissive of your unnecessary inclusion of your personal food preferences because it’s completely unnecessary to the conversation. Yet you went into vivid details about meat on a VEGAN community. If you didn’t write that specifically to bother people here then it’s you who needs to work on their communication skills.
Do you go to the StopDrinking community and start talking about the things you like about alcohol, too? Get off your high horse, you’re not fooling anyone.
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Omnivores do not NEED energy from meat. Full stop. Teeth are just an indicator, not the definer.
No dude, I’m not dismissive of your food preferences. I am a meat eater as I pointed out in my first reply and it’s pretty clear I was being dismissive of you describing eating meat in detail to get a rise out of people. Now I’ll be truly rude: Learn to fuckin read.
Leave the last word if it will make you feel better but this is the end of my replies
Your post started off weak and got weaker and weaker until you finally succumbed to your true thoughts: “eating animals feels good.”
Omega 3 in bacon is virtually non-existent. It’s a 1:10 ratio omega 3 to omega 6, versus 1:1 in fish. It’s the ratio that matters, not the absolute amount.
The best source of Omega acids is plant oils such as as Olive, Rapeseed, Walnut or Linenseed oil.
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So you just mansplained exactly what this meme is about? Feel better about yourself?
LMAO who asked???
K
most primal and satisfying of gustatory pleasures.
The way I see it, eating meat is an act of desperation akin to the Soviets eating human beings during the battle of Stalingrad. There used to be agricultural reasons for it but the way we practice it now is laced with corruption and suffering.
experts are now saying you SHOULD eat some bacon in your diet no matter what
stfu
nigella lawson stop pronouncing microwave wrong
Bacon isn’t very good
“Rot” is kind of a loaded term. Our gut flora are an important part of digestion and essential to human health.
Even 100% grass fed (extremely rare) livestock products really don’t have high quantities of omega 3s. Seeds are one of the best sources, and if you are concerned about ALA conversion then then algae is probably the best source, that’s where the fish get it from.
Everything that’s not a refined food has protein pretty much. And save a few categories like grains and fruits most have a good portion of protein relative to their macros and a good distribution of aminos. It would be difficult to not get enough protein eating WFPB, but even if you do include refined foods and more grains in your diet you likely just need to eat beans and veg to balance it out. Basically don’t eat an exclusively bananas and rice diet and you’ll probably be fine.
This dude wants to be a predator and eat meat from the bone cause it’s natural!
This dude also shits inside, enjoys indoor temperature control, goes to the doctor for meds and drives an ICE vehicle… LIKE A REAL CAVEMAN!
