Both variants are pretty wtf to me. Not necessarily showing the pictures but explicitly pointing out their genitals.
Showing pictures too.
I would argue the top picture is also a big no no.
I thought that is the point
Dark Arc is saying that it is generally considered a bad thing, contrary to the comic which is implying that it is generally considered good or neutral when it should be considered bad.
you guys missed the point. neither should be bad. it’s only bad because of how we sexualize eveything. it’s the sexualization that’s bad, and honestly, that wouldn’t even be that bad if it weren’t for the patriarchal exploitation of sex.
Shouldn’t both be bad? Stop sharing naked photos of people who can’t give you consent to do so.
there is nothing inherently wrong with our naked bodies. society has conditioned us to have shame. once upon a time, being naked was normal.
Yeah I’d still rather people not show off photos of me without them asking. Its okay to have privacy.
This has now gone to: sharing baby pictures is a privacy violation because the baby can’t give consent.
Lot of very special people in this thread on Lemmy today.
Yeah, i mean in today’s world, i value privacy too, but don’t you wish you lived in a world where we were more in tune with the natural world and our natural selves?
STOP SHARING NAKED IMAGES OF PEOPLE WHO CANNOT CONSENT
IT IS THEIR BODY, NOT THEIR PARENTS AND NOT YOURS
WHY IS CONSENT SO HARD FOR YOU TO UNDERSTAND
wow. you are triggered. you must still be young enough that this hits home for you.
Lay off the caps lock bud.
Stop sharing any photos of people who don’t give consent, whether they can or not.
In an alternate timeline where we never had the stigma around nudity, I’d be just as embarrassed of my nose in a photo than I would of my penis.
Or maybe 10 years after I cut ties with you because you became a massive douche sandwich, I don’t want my picture on the same Facebook wall as your white pride rally.
Not you, personally, but any body really.
Still shouldn’t be sharing naked pictures of people without consent and of people who cannot consent
Hmm, that’s a good point, I was just clarifying what Dark Arc said as far as I can tell. You’re right neither should be sexualized, but in the world we live in neither should be shared IMO.
neither should be bad.
Yes, they both should be bad. Don’t show people photos of naked children.
I think krippix’ point (as well as the comic’s point) is that the first is socially acceptable while the second is not. And that then suggests that the first scenario should also not be socially acceptable.
And that then suggests that the first scenario should also not be socially acceptable.
Last part depends on interpretation. But most likely yes.
I don’t think it really takes a side … just kind of points out that it’s super weird that it’s more socially acceptable in one direction than the other.
I do hope the author intended for what I said to be the point though.
You’d think so, but a disturbing number of people think the problem is there is a difference, not the nude photos.
Definitely, there’s nothing “cute” about nude photos of children.
Yeah that’s kinda the point.
My mom has a picture of me when I was a baby taking a bath. My grandma made her censor my genitals with masking tape. I miss my grandma.
Dude, my mom covered our genitals with a washcloth. The only pic of me naked shows my bum. I had no idea nude baby pics were so popular.
Actually, it’s mostly just one guy, who’s probably made over a hundred comments defending his collection of naked photos of his child.
Is one photo a collection? Huh. I guess I also have a collection of refrigerators.
Eh. I have plenty of pictures of my daughter naked as a baby. The weird part of this is showing off the naked picture to a stranger on the bus and making mention of the genitals in specific.
Anyway, everyone knows that naked baby pictures are used to torture children in front of their serious romantic partners brought home for the first time. This has not happened in my 14-year-old daughter’s life yet, but I hope to one day have this privilege that comes with parenting.
My response, when my mom showed my first partner naked baby pictures was to nudge my partner and say "don’t worry, I’ll send you some more recent ones.
My mom super didn’t appreciate the joke, but she never pulled out baby pictures for future partners.
This is hilarious. Good comeback.
Removed by mod
Gonna show your new step dad all the naked pics of your mom you have?
That second paragraph is pretty creepy actually, I think you’ve missed the point of the comic.
I’d say it’s okay to show someone your child’s genitalia when they’ve already seen it anyway.
Yep, my wife has seen my little baby wiener. The awkward teenage pictures were far more embarrassing though. Hers are buried in a hoarder house so I might never get to see her embarrassing school band photos.
I wouldn’t want to see naked photos of a significant other as a minor, but maybe that’s just me.
It’s everyone who isn’t a weirdo
This thread is giving me the ick
Yeah, definitely. At best they’re arguing tooth and nail for embarrassing their child in front of their partner, if not outright CP.
Major ick.
Normal people don’t view children as sexual beings, so their junk just isn’t any different than their foot. Parents especially. I see my daughter’s vagina several times a day, frequently covered in poop. It doesn’t register any differently than any other part of her that needs cleaning.
You’re still weird if you make a point of showing photos of it to someone though.
Right? All you’re doing is saying, “when I saw it last, it was a lot smaller than when you saw it.”
Seeing someone naked as an adult isn’t the same thing as seeing them naked as a minor.
You do see that, right?
Dude, this has been a traditional way for parents to embarrass their adult children in front of their partner for decades. My wife has seen my naked baby pictures without my parents even showing them to her. And I’ve seen hers. What’s the big deal? It’s not like either of us found them sexy.
Chopping part of your child’s dick off has also been traditional for decades, that’s a very poor justification for that behaviour.
Are you really comparing showing your child’s long-term partner their naked baby pictures with circumcision?
My point is “we’ve always done it like that” isn’t really a justification.
They are challenging the logic, is this really a confusing idea to you?
I agree
it’s still weird (source, i have parents), at least ask your daughter for consent first.
I’d consider it to be a breach of my privacy otherwise.
They’re baby pictures. We’re not talking about something erotic here. Naked babies are not some sort of scandalous thing. In most cultures, they’re normal.
i didn’t take them and i didn’t consent to them existing either. Neither did i consent to them being shown to anybody.
Naked humans are also normal, yet we still wear clothes. babies included, weirdly enough.
At what point does “naked baby photos” turn to “naked children photos” is my question.
how about this. You can have your naked baby photos, you just also have to be in the photo and naked as well.
You’re really digging your heels in on showing people photos of naked children, aren’t you?
Taking photos of naked children isn’t, and shouldn’t, be normal in any culture I’m familiar with, and you definitely shouldn’t be showing them to anyone.
DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT CONSENT IS
YOU LEARN IT AT SCHOOL, ITS VERY IMPORTANT
Today I learned flying squid is okay with this kind of thing and that’s fucked up
It’s a violation of privacy & consent
How do you get a baby’s consent exactly?
You can’t, that’s why you don’t take photos of them naked.
You do understand that to cultures where this isnt the norm, it sounds ridiculous to show naked pictures of your child when they were an infant to, well anyone?
It being a tradition has no bearing on it being awful or not. Circumcision is a tradition.
I’m sure you can find a more modern way to embarrass your child without resorting to CP?
Which cultures? And why do they get to decide what is right and what is wrong?
Also, naked photos of children are not child porn. Do you think they come out of the womb with clothes on?
I had to clean shit out of my daughter’s vagina regularly when I changed her diapers. Was that, similarly, sexual assault?
I personally have no use for pictures of baby genitals, but you really do huh? It even makes you upset we want to take away your baby genital pictures huh?
Is this some perverse form of individualism?
Edit: if you took a picture of you cleaning your daughters vagina out, and showed someone, yes that would be child porn and child abuse.
NO IT IS NOT
Always get the consent of the now adult that was in the picture as a child or don’t take the picture if they are still a child
Dude, do you think I would intentionally cause my child actual pain? My god.
It’s all fucking weird. I never took photos of my child naked. I don’t get the idea at all.
I’m glad someone else sees it.
That’s weird
Torture? Why people have such trouble with their romantic interest seeing pictures of you naked when you looked totally different?
It’s not actual torture. It’s just embarrassing your kid over something that most people would consider trivial as a form of ribbing them.
Nah it’s basically waterboarding…
You’d sure think so from some of these responses.
But I do enjoy the person who thinks you need to get consent from a baby to ethically take its picture.
We’re talking about in the nuddy here, in which case you really should have a good case for taking that photo.
The good case is that the child was just born and didn’t come out clothed. Something many of you don’t seem to understand.
To ethically take nude pictures. Ftfy
So many of you think babies come out clothed.
You also have this absolutely ludicrous idea in your heads that having a naked photo of your baby is child pornography. And yet none of you have an example of a parent facing legal repercussions for it. And somehow that doesn’t clue you in that it is, in fact, not child pornography.
And then there’s the Finnish guy who is telling you all what prudes you are. One of the few sane takes.
Seems like these people are sexualizing babies and then making you seem like the crazy one. It’s kind of insane.
Thanks, please carry on telling me what kind of ideas I have. Forgive me for thinking babies have some rights.
No one said it’s child porn. It’s just that when parents show off your naked baby pictures it gets uncomfortable for everyone, as many here have expressed.
Naked photos of children is pretty much the definition of CP, yes.
A parent is unlikely to face prosecution unless they share the photos, but that doesn’t mean it’s legal.
CHILD PORN IS ILLEGAL FOR A REASON, CHILDREN CANNOT CONSENT AND YOU ARE BASICALLY CREATING IT WHEN YOU TAKE PICTURES OF YOUR BABY NAKED
If it’s child porn, you show me one single parent who has gotten in trouble for just taking a picture of their baby when it’s naked and showing that picture to their adult child’s partner.
One single parent.
freak out some more, kid
Wrong, it is a form of mental torture and a violation of your privacy and consent
I keep asking for evidence that anyone, anywhere has had lasting mental health damage from this and congratulations, you’re the latest to just assume it happens without evidence.
You’ve shown in your replies to numerous comments that you are ignoring the personal accounts of others sharing their experiences they don’t like it and for some reason want peer reviewed sources
If you where to compile the data of these responses into data that would form the basis of a paper
Why is it so important to defend this for you that you ignore anything that doesn’t conform to your own biases and views on it flying squid
Your wanting of peer reviewed evidence or psychological evidence seems to stem from the ignorance of anything that doesn’t conform to your views and biases on this
And your responses to people ignoring their accounts of not liking it comes of as rude, distasteful and ignorant
What personal account? I have not seen a single personal account. Please link to one.
All I have seen is people who have claimed it would traumatize them if it happened to them, which they cannot know.
Are you really asking for impartial evidence of basic human decency?
No I am really not.
Downvoted because taking pictures of your child is still weird even though you don’t show them to anyone
Sorry… taking pictures of a child is weird?
Do you think cameras steal the soul or something?
Oh ew that’s some borderline pedo shit. “Here’s the person you’re fucking as a baby. Hahaha you’re sexually attracted to a baby. I created child pornography just to make you uncomfortable because you’re a normal, non-pedophilic person”
Sorry, you think taking a photo of a baby when they’re born is done with the express purpose of doing something decades later?
You guys want to consider gender in vacuum but it is never a good idea.
Look at the sexualisation and brainwashing of the girls and patriarchy and men having this big power gap and sometimes using it in the worst of the ways. This is why the second image is big wtf while the first is small wtf.
That’s because in the first no one would immediately think that they sexualise the boy while in the second we arrive at this conclusion immediately and without hesitation thanks to all the hard work of men thorought history.
I know having this original sin of your fathers on your shoulders is not a cool feeling but this is the reality we are in.
No one in the picture or the audience is sexualizing little girls (or boys). Instead, the outrage is caused by harmful expectations of purity that are imposed on girls and women, but not boys. As well as the current moral panic about pedophilia, which again is unhelpful in actuality protecting children.
Want to protect help children from predators? Help them remove the stigma around their bodies and sex, and empower them to speak and be heard when something they don’t like happens. Failing to do so reinforces the feelings of shame that all too often enable predators to get away with what they do.
And maybe also don’t share potentially embarrassing photos without consent but that’s small potatoes compared to the above issues.
Help them remove the stigma around their bodies and sex, and empower them to speak and be heard when something they don’t like happens.
This. So much this. If auntie wants to give them a kiss and they don’t want to get slobbered then tough fucking luck auntie, I’ll back the little shits up when they bite you. Predators are, by and large, able to do what they do because people don’t teach kids that they do, in fact, have bodily autonomy.
And while I’m at it bodily autonomy of kids also implies that parents don’t parade photos around like some fucking trophy or something. Have some basic fucking regard for your own kids and what they want. How would you feel when they’re showing nude pictures of you to their classmates yeah I thought so.
How would you feel when they’re showing nude pictures of you to their classmates yeah I thought so.
Depends, does your mom have an onlyfans?
I like this take. If you get to show photos of your kids naked to your friends, they should have the same privilege.
How about nobody does it unless the subject is consenting?
Explaining consent to certain members of the comments section is like explaining music to a rock, I think this approach might get the message across.
Secrets die in the light
“Knowledge is the light in the darkness of ignorance”.
I like this additional take with pure facts and discussion, It’s mostly uncharacteristically civil and starts to be interesting or at least has potential to be.
However I am mostly focused on why one picture is big wtf and why one is smaller wtf.
tl;dr “Misandry is perfectly fine because men are evil and nothing a woman has ever done is wrong.”
The problem isn’t that the bottom scenario isn’t accepted, it’s that the top scenario is. No one should be showing off nudes of children in public, or anywhere really, regardless of gender. It’s weird, it’s sick, and it has no place in this world.
There’s nothing wrong about nude children or any other human old or young. Just go to a beach in Europe…
Yes Americans are weird about this thanks to years of well… catholic brain rot
If you’re taking photos on a nude beach in Europe you’re getting decked. Kid, adult, doesn’t matter.
There’s a massive fucking difference between sitting naked in a sauna with other naked people and sitting on public transit, fully dressed, gossiping about non-consensual nudes of children. How is that even a question. How are you capable of equating those things.
Nude adult humans = Nothing wrong Nude children = “Hi, I’m Chris Hansen with dateline NBC”
Children do not belong on a nude beach
Well you have no idea then. Here no one cares. It’s normal and nothing sexual about it
And not even on the nude beach either on a normal beach too there’s hordes of nude children running about. I am waiting for your head to explode now
Such a weird thing to say … when I was little ('70s) it was not uncommon for kids to swim nude, we didn’t care… Any adults who are ogling kids aren’t going to stop just because of one layer of clothing.
It’s weird, it’s sick, and it has no place in this world.
Only if you think a naked body = sex, which is a weird assumption to make if you think about it.
Except the comic doesn’t show them discussing or showing a naked body, it’s a weirdo pointing out the genitals to another person in a very public place. If it was toes, it’d be fine. If it was just a naked body it’d be whatever, mostly. But they’re specifically pointing out genitals, that implies sexual focus. It’s only “cute” and “funny” for the old women here because eventually it’ll be an organ used for sex…
Because the only time it’s appropiate for two people to be naked together is when dey fucking?
Nah, it should never be acceptable to show photos of people naked to your friends without their express permission. Outside of medical professionals of course.
You misinterpreted OP, otherwise I also do think the top scenario is weird.
The hot tl;dr of this that is going to get you a lot of angry boys sending you incoherent diatribes is that we haven’t decided as a species that we will stop sexualizing youth.
Yes there are biological imperatives for the sexually aggressive sex to seek out mates that are young, healthy and capable of producing offspring before they become too old to reproduce. That’s all a thing that’s real, but it’s as far distant in our past as most other ancient instincts that we’ve put to rest. We just keep this one alive because we want it to continue broadly. The whole notion of older men predating and sexualizing children is absolutely something that if we all decided together was no longer acceptable, it would end tomorrow. (Or realistically in one generation.)
The reason I say this is because there are a lot of men who will secretly or overtly hold the position that since we have biological urges, then it must be natural and acceptable. Meanwhile, ya’ll fuckers completely ignore the thousand other biological drives and standards that we’ve abolished because they’re unproductive, hurt people or just have gone out of style.
For example: body odor. Do you really think we were using soap and perfume when we were packed together in huts and caves for the last thousand millennia? You are genetically identical to the people who used to bury their faces in each other’s armpits to identify each other in the dark, but the thought makes you gag now because you were socialized to feel repulsion at this. (Fetishes aside.) We can socialize ourselves to believe and internalize almost anything, we are far, far beyond the forces of natural selection and are now choosing our evolutionary path. Wouldn’t it be nice if we chose good paths that respected others and protected children.
(Fetishes aside.)
damn, you got me on that one.
You’re right, but I feel showing people photos of your child’s genitals should never be OK, outside of medical professionals etc.
Thanks for the lecture, professor.
My god damn pleasure sub
It will take another 100 years of intense education and raising new generations to have the society that isn’t obviously fucked up and deeply hurt.
I don’t share in your positivity.
sexualisation and brainwashing of the girls and patriarchy and men having this big power gap
Women can do what men can’t = sexualisation and brainwashing of the girls and patriarchy. Ok. “Men having this big power gap” indeed.
and sometimes using it in the most monstrous of the ways
incels will downvote this
we arrive at this conclusion immediately and without hesitation thanks to all the hard work of men thorought history.
you say this like women have ever had rights to the point that being ogled at “would be bad” the one argument here would be the “daughter is her fathers property” and that’s not really a gender thing, that’s a social custom about gender more than anything.
Maybe we should encourage suicides in boys starting in schools, would that work for you?
username checks out.
His issue was phrasing. The woman used a euphemism which significantly shifted her perceived intentions. “Look at his little wee-wee” is far removed from “look at his little penis.” Synonyms are not created equal, so simply substituting without considering connotation will only cause confusion. He should have said “get an eyeful of her little vagina.”
Look at her little vajayjay, nope still weird.
Gawk at her crack, mate!
Nope.
Gander her bandersnatch
Hmm
Behold the axe wound
Huh
Peek at her meatflaps
Nah
Now I want Arby’s.
I don’t get it.
Behold! Her cave of wonders!
🤷
And his nephrite rod!
???
Crack, cocaine.
Even worse.
I mean, penises are just inherently funny. Look at them, they’re ridiculous.
I feel personally attacked.
I just remember the Simpsons movie where Bart Simpsons penis is portrayed for a few seconds, I’m really sure that they don’t have the balls to portray a child vagina
Because penises are funny and vaginas are a line.
Lines are funny too. I mean, look at butts.
Poop comes out of em.
True. Imagine comparing the humour between a meatsicle vs just a hole.
My mom was one of those top ladies. 😬
It’s OK kolanaki, I find your wee wee very cute too
I’m gonna go ahead and say that it’s weird all the way around. Any gender combo for kid/parent/audience.
Having had four kids, if you are showing people pictures of any baby in the bath naked, they’re gonna be upset no matter the gender. I don’t think his is true at all.
I wish I could burn half my mother’s photo albums.
You can. Just not yet
Given there are people in this thread defending this tooth and nail, that’s quite reassuring to know actually.
Nowadays, girls can have a wee wee. 😬
No, they are babies, they don’t even know how to speak, how are they going to be able to know what “gender” even means?
Calling a baby with wee wee a girl is the same as calling your 18 year old trans daughter a boy, you are just trying to brainwash them.
Yeah, exactly. Babies are too young for gender. It’s child abuse to call any baby a boy or a girl. Gender starts developing in the brain at 2-3 years of age.
Are the genders with you right now?
Is it also child abuse to give your kid a name? My evil parents brainwashed me into believing I was a James.
A gendered name, yes.
Should have been Number 327 /s
Well I’m going to name my son Samantha, and there’s nothing you can do about it.
Oh, hee hee hee.
“Nowadays, boys can have a vagina.”
What the fuck!?
the child cant talk yet and has no sense of wtf a “gender” is, its fine lol
They waited 6 months to drop this knowledge bomb.
… and?
Yes, but if she’s a baby nobody knows she’s a girl yet, including her.
This is worst response. Others at least said “No, they are babies, they don’t even know how to speak, how are they going to be able to know what “gender” even means?”, but your “nobody knows she’s a girl yet” is so wierd.
Why? A trans person isn’t born not trans, they’re born, as you said, not even knowing what gender is. A trans woman was always a girl, but only someone who knows the future would know that when she’s a baby.
Situation also matters. This appears to be on a bus and between acquaintances. Do this same thing at home toward the adult child’s significant other and it becomes a funny thing parents do to embarrass their kids.
funny thing parents do to embarrass their kids
And what is funny about that?
That’s parents’ favorite move! “Ha! You used to be smaller! And naked!” ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Le small pp
Funny for the parents
I just wouldn’t bring my significant other around if my parents were like that. That’s absolutely gross behaviour.
Yes.
And why do we think that might be different? Anyone?
The assumed innocence of women and the assumed guilt of men.
Yes. And why was that?
Misandry and the belief that anything with a penis is evil, even if the individual in question doesn’t even want to have a penis
No, but that is a compelling narrative.
It’s because men sexually assault women a lot. Like, an awful amount. Children, relatives, the whole thing: 1 out of 3 women have been sexually assaulted. That’s why it’s different.
It’s a leftist thing. I am liberal but I do not have any dillusions on how I am viewed by my ‘fellow’ liberals.
¿Que?
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I don’t know how you mean, but okay.
Because the overwheling majority of sexual assault convictions are of men. It’s true.
Laughing at a child’s penis still sucks though.
Because nobody cares when double standards negatively impact boys or men.
No, but very men’s rights there.
No, just equality. Isn’t that what feminism is about?
Dead right.
So close
Because they are sitting in a pink colored train, and not in the blue colored one.
Also no, but interesting point
So labia, then? Or vulva, maybe. Unless that camera is an internal one, they’re likely not seeing any vaginas.
I too took middle school health class
I get a chuckle about Ultra sound images as well. It’s fine if a woman wants to post those photos of her insides on the Internet. But I’m the bad guy if I say “Jessica pop that pussy open let’s see it in person.”
deleted by creator
Anytime pal. lol wait till you learn mens nipples and womans are 100 identical.
Uhh. Nah.
But they arent tho. I am a trans woman who has been on estrogen for 4 months. In that time i have absolutely noticed my nipples changing, both growing and getting hard more regularly than before.
Yawn your missing the point.
I hope this isn’t a long wait
Mine are hairier. Like the jet.
You should have seen some of the woman I been with. I needed a good damn machete to get to the temple of suck.
You can’t see the baby without the ultrasound. It’s not like you could grab a speculum and get a good look in person.
You’ve obviously never been in one of those flashlight enthusiasts groups. They’ll gladly tell you how you can see anything if you light it enough.
Ultrasound is just really slow light
Is it a baby or is it just cells? Am I viewing cunt cells or nah?
I wish I was still dumb enough to be conservative. I was happier than. I hate myself now everyday I wish I had the courage to kill myself
Wtf?
“I wish I didn’t know about societal and existential problems of humanity. I was happier when I didn’t. I hate myself now everyday, I wish I had the courage to stop my suffering.”
I was. I was still angry all the time, but at least it was not at myself
Conservatives live in an endless cycle of outrage and fear, the fuck you talking about happy
But it’s not at themselves
At its core it usually is, but they often push it outward. My experience with a conservative religion was mostly just self hatred at not being good enough too honestly, but my personality was never much on the conservative axis. Or rather, when I did stuff on that level I never felt good about them.
Maybe comfortable is the better word.
That is, anger, outrage, paranoia, and ignorance are their comfort zone. It’s what they know. And in my little corner of the world, the more vociferously conservative they are, the less self-aware they are about it.
It’s really pervasive in ways I never truly realized until way too far into adulthood when I was working to get that shit out of my own head.
Sounds like a really strong need for therapy.
In the meantime would you be willing to elaborate on whats making you depressed?
