Hot take: none. Let information flow free. Take it with the good and the bad. Don’t lock yourself in an echo chamber.
i never understood this take. echo chambers aren’t inherently bad; forced debates are never good. communities are supposed to be places you go to feel comfortable not where you’d forced to debate or turn anything into an argument.
Exposure to other viewpoints is good. No need to debate. And if you’re on a large instance, you’ll see that. Not everyone thinks alike, there are shades of gray. Discussion is allowed to happen but intolerance isn’t tolerated.
The tankie instances ban anyone for even asking questions politely that they don’t agree with. It’s a total monoculture and I assume they’re mostly still kids, because everything is black and white and can be solved without any nuance at all.
Exposure to other viewpoints is good yes, but is it good when that exposure only ever gets you insults hurled your way from the people you’re trying to have a discussion with?
exactly. everywhere irl all i see is people debating my existence. i just want one place where i don’t have to think about that. x.x
Nope, definitely not - which is why I’m not a free speech absolutist. Let those instances sit on an island by themselves.
Is exposure to other viewpoints good when those viewpoints are half-baked straw man hot-takes that the users are just parroting because they heard their favorite YouTuber say it?
I don’t need to be exposed to yet another dipshit who insists the holodomor never happened. That’s not me avoiding other viewpoints, that’s me avoiding fucking morons.
This is very close to the Nazi point of “just asking questions” or when they say it’s just free speech. Not saying you’re arguing it, but it is a very thin line.
What’s the line then? Why do people ban Nazis and not tankies? Tankies are authoritarian, they defend the massacre of Ukrainians, the Uyghur genocide, and other historic “socialist” atrocities. Why do we give them leeway? Are they skirting the line just enough? Are they intentionally using the optics of socialism to do so? Etc.
Keep in mind, just because someone blocks someone or an instance it doesn’t necessarily make the space an echo chamber. We don’t know if they live in a state or work in a place that is blasting Fox News 24/7. They may be very active on Twitter exposed to that sewage. Heck, the liberal point of view is quite a lot as is with the way they are defending Israel.
I think I’m arguing the exact opposite. We should ban/defederate nazis and tankies. But we shouldn’t ban people with different views that aren’t beyond the pale.
You can have a nuanced opinion of Israel/Palestine without being labeled as a genocide denier since it’s still in the fog of war.
It’s much harder to have a nuanced opinion about Rohingya, the Holocaust, Uyghur, Darfur.
I like your response. I don’t have much else to add.
I assume they’re mostly still kids, because everything is black and white and can be solved without any nuance at all.
This is SO important. Remember that the “Dirtbag Left” a la Chapo et al. was created when the Alt Right was running rampant in high schools. Their goal was to attract young people to the left. Which is great! There’s a place for cringe edgy teens to feel like they can fight for a better world. But I’m really not looking to hang out with arrogant teenagers right now, and definitely not with their emotionally immature adult chaperones.
The fact that they are mostly kids is a big part of the reason why I feel the need to add context to their bad political science.
Sometimes questions have answers.
Exposure over and over won’t be novel, or helpful, just grating. We do not need to endlessly rehash every possible argument, over and over and over and over and over.
Even if the other viewpoint is that trans people should get shot or locked up and are members of a secret child sex ring? I don’t think I want that on my feed. I don’t want people that want to kill me on my screen while I shit
Nope, not at all. All that falls into the intolerant and intolerable category.
Defending capitalism or Israel - or even suggesting that both sides might have agendas - will get you banned in quite a lot of subs here.
Nope, not at all. All that falls into the intolerant and intolerable category.
Defending capitalism or Israel - or even suggesting that both sides might have agendas - will get you banned in quite a lot of subs here.
Okay, but this is more about blocking instances that are very extreme. Those can most of the time not be discussed with
90% of the time it’s bigots who are upset that they’re getting deplatformed. The other 10% of the time it’s the incredibly idealistic or naive. Either way it’s a crap argument. You are under no obligation to endure verbal diarrhea, nor is it your responsibility to change the minds of the people spewing it. They shit the bed, they can lie in it.
Normal interactions with normal communities will be plenty of diversity, there’s absolutely no reason to engage with or listen to nazis. Right wing politics has mastered brainwashing, it’s dangerous to read that shit too often.
They’ve mastered brainwashing to conservative religious nutjobs and incels. Maybe young and naive teenage boys, on top of that. If you aren’t an idiot or a teen, you should be immune for the most part.
Not that I’m saying you should go out of your way to interact with Nazis. Unless the interaction involves punching.
If you aren’t an idiot or a teen you should be immune for the most part.
Yes but the problem is between idiots and teens you’ve covered about 70% of the population.
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Not a good analogy because then blocking the instance is like killing the dog.
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What? No it’s not. If I block an instance it’s still up and running, I just don’t see any of it. It’s like if I put on a selective blindfold.
Also a valid solution to the poop on the carpet problem.
Just saying
Yeah i get it. But Just seems like an overkill.
yes I need to see the fascists masquerading as leftists otherwise I would be living in an echo chamber…
They’ll certainly bring up an actual good point from time to time, unlike actual fascists.
Mostly though you can negate the majority of their most obnoxious shit takes by blocking users.
But my instance isn’t federated with Lemmygrad and Hexbear as is so I can get away with that, and I don’t see “Genocide is okay if” takes in my feed.
They’ll certainly bring up an actual good point from time to time, unlike actual fascists.
and a broken clock shows the correct time twice a day doesn’t mean it’s useful to have it taking up space on the wall.
also they are actual fascists. in the chapo trap house community I literally got the reply “ukraine should be destroyed at all costs”
Well, as long as we judge entire communities by the actions of individuals.
Thanks for the nuance. While I agree that tankies can be annoying, I think it’s stupid to compare them to fascists with the whole “red fash” thing. Just because they have some terrible takes of their own, it doesn’t make them fascist.
The worst of them do deny genocides, which is terrible, but they do it out of a habit of denying anything western powers claim actually happened. I imagine many of their members are trolls and contrarians, as well. Despite this, like you said, some of them have decent takes and not all of them are off the deep end, yet
People who say this are generally fine being a part of every other instance that is full of liberals who repeat fascist propaganda verbatim. Seen rather clearly in response to the recent escalations in Gaza.
Not so hot take: My time is finite, why force myself to see shitty facebook memes, dog pictures, crusty “battlestations”, etc.?
Hexbear kind of pissed me off for a week. But I kind of like how nakedly transparent they are. Now, whenever I come across one of those threads, I see where its coming from and I relax. They’re just pro-russia regardless of if it makes sense. I don’t know what the Murica equivalent of Russia is, but they’re that
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They’re anti US, not necessarily pro Russia. They support Russia in the Russia-Ukraine war because they think Ukraine is a US puppet state because the country wants to align with Western nations, and of course no nation on earth has its own agency and everything is the US’s fault. They’re pro anything that challenges the US and other liberal countries.
They remind me of a bunch of teenagers trying to be edgy.
They are campists. It’s been the bane of leftist parties forever. That’s why socialism really got a foothold in Europe via third-way social democracy, because it doesn’t feel the need to make tyrants into folk heroes in order to relitigate the cold war
Do they support Russia or Putin? If they support one, they hate another.
Would you say the same when someone is harassing you? Or how about if they were Nazis? Because keep in mind OP is just blocking them and not removing them from all of lemmy.
OP is asking which ones to block because he currently is not being harassed. If he was being harassed, he would know which ones to block.
I can’t read German or french
You are missing out on all the sturgeon jokes!
Is this a positive or negative?
Same here, but every now and then an English source comes through so I keep them available.
Oh mein Gott er kann kein Deutsch lesen grundgütiger wie kann man das nicht können c’est incroyable, non c’est impossible je voudrait penser mais non
I like getting exposed to languages that I’m not fluent in. Sometimes I pick something up or get curious and learn something new from translation. A multilingual internet is a colorful and beautiful place.
That’d be fine if the tankie takes had any value to them. The only value they’ve added to me is showing me why real world communism has always ended up the way it has. And now I’ve learned that lesson, so theres no further value
I have no need for those weird anime fan clubs. Like that chainsaw shit. Or holo-whatever
I disagree, I would love to block NSFW instances, and I’m grateful to the users that voluntarily post in there. For me Lemmy is too searchable for me to get into those luxuries.
My hot take is: Depending on the individual, this may be a healthy and responsible thing to do. The outrage cycle that was established in commercial social media to “drive engagement” is very bad for our meat computers (shown in multiple studies). It is much healthier and more productive, at times, to block users, communities, and potentially instances (removing this ability, and forcing me to use their algorithm for sorting, is why I left Reddit, in addition to the harm caused to disabled communities).
Your instance is one of the most oppressive regarding that…
This was the attitude I admired on reddit, until it got overrun by Nazis.
I was wrong.
Fuckin’ hilarious how quick tankies become obsessed with avoiding echo chambers when on their own communities they have a ban policy of "anything to the right of unironically calling Stalin Daddy."
To actually answer the question, lemmygrad.ml and hexbear will remove most of the redfash content, but you’ll still need to be vigilant for individual users to block. Also, blocking users doesn’t prevent them from posting on your shit, just stops you from being notified or being able to see it, AFAIK Boost doesn’t have defederation for individual users so you’d need to do that over browser.
This comment brought to you by the absolute right to curate who is in your social orbit, same as in real life ya platform obsessed whingers.
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I’m downvoting you for not knowing the difference between communists and tankies.
And I’m neither.
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Bullshit. You’re just falling for one of them parroting phrases from the other, while taking the polar opposite actions.
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Also, blocking users doesn’t prevent them from posting on your shit,
Good… On a forum based platform it’s better to not restrict people’s ability to respond to things, as it can help combat people’s ability to block those arguing with them right after making easily counterable points to prevent decent comebacks
It’s a nightmare for harassment though, treating all blocking as a sissy snowflake shield renders it essentially useless for circumstances where the other user is really malicious.
In that case having a system like Mastodon’s that locks them out of Replying is better than simply covering them up. We can’t really rely on Instance admins to block all malicious users or defederate from all malicious platforms so there needs to be a certain level of protection from the user’s side.
I do think that Blocking and Restricting (preventing a user from interacting) should be different functions, you block communities and users because you don’t want to see them, but you restrict users because they are hostile, malicious, or make bad-faith arguments.
Nah, your right to keep debating ends when someone else decide’s they’re not a platform for further discussion.
No longer being able to reply to the blocker, and ideally not even being able to see the blocker is the ideal, and both the blocker and the blockee should need to agree to reopen contact for the block to go down.
Like a restraining order, stops the original blocker from raising and lowering it at will as a harassment tactic.
Remember blocking on Reddit? It made it so you couldn’t reply to anything in the chain. So if someone different replied to you you wouldn’t be able to reply to them even though they aren’t who blocked you.
That was a recent change, and one for the worse. Part of the reason I’m using lemmy as well now that boost is functioning for it
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Theyre run and populated by the exact same people, bud
They are a little bit more mask on than mask off, but they are just as hardcore tankie because its literally the same people
NO??? ml was the first general purpose instance and so had the most amount of users at the beginning, meaning a lot of normal communities developed there
Don’t confuse the newbie who just got out of his Reddit bubble, he’s scared and alone
Right, keep pretending the admins arent the same. Blame reddit for your confusion over 2 servers being owned by the same people.
Surely you will look clever, and smart. No one will find you out
Oh good! Let’s trot out the condescension!
Your sense of entitled elitism does not redound to the quality of your character.
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there’s a lot of paranoia about some of the least threatening people I’ve ever encountered
Okay, liberal.
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Genuine question, is that like supposed to be a legit insult or more ironic?
They definitely see it as an insult. Check the comment history and you’ll see there is no attempt at irony. Just an angry poster who’s fallen too deep into it.
If you go to very leftist areas of the internet (socialist or communist areas, anywhere from anarchistic (bottom left) to authoritarian (top left)) you’ll see people using liberalism by its political science definition, rather than the definition its taken on within American culture. It stems from the idea of capital moving freely (that is, liberally) without restrictions. You’ll also see it referred to as neoliberalism in the same spaces.
Full disclosure, I myself am pretty extremely socially libertarian (arguably borderline anarchistic), and have used liberal derogatively myself.
wdym by
They took over the domain a couple of months ago. ?
wasn’t ml started by Dessalines/nutomic??
THAT makes sense why ani.social defederated from Lemmy.ml (I only subscribed to the anime instance since it had the largest user base)
Edit: the “.ml” anime instance is still the largest compared to everyone else. What a shame that we can’t move away from it
This was Ani’s side of the story: https://ani.social/comment/2199318
Lemmy.ml defederated from ani.social, pretty sure cuz the borderline pedo bait
Yep. Explicitly because of CSAM
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Good point. Lemmy.ml admins said CSAM was the reason so just passing that along.
I don’t visit ani.social, a quick glimpse just now shows me a few Images that seem like borderline, but not straight-up “drawn sexualized child characters”. No idea how they usually are.
But from following the story, it seems pretty typical that even the lemmy.ml admins - who develop Lemmy as a whole - would do a defederation without a public transparent process or even a notification to the deferated instance. That’s straight up unpolite.
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the modlogs are public, anyone can just go on hexbear, plug in your name and see why you got banned:
here’s one of your removed comments:
mod Removed Comment Actually Palestinians started the violence. They fought a war, they lost. That doesn’t excuse anything Israel has done, but credit where credit is due. Hamas are not freedom fighters, that isn’t their goal. Their goal is to eradicate anyone that doesn’t share their beliefs. Freedom for the people of Palestine and peace in the region, but the likes of Hamas and Netanyahu can suck a bag of each others’ virgin dicks. by TWeaK@lemm.ee
the reason you were site banned was because you were having a meltdown over getting a comm ban for your genocide apologia (lmao)
mod Banned TWeaK@lemm.ee reason: convicted on purgery (malding over a comm ban :farquaad-point:)
People finding out that their history of being an asshole is public information will never not be funny
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This, nonchalantly being a prick
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I don’t care about your justification for both siding an ongoing genocide
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And attempt to engage in secondary unused communities? A lot of the most active communities are on it, you are just asking for your home page to be either way too filtered or a wasteland.
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I don’t think !pokemon@lemmy.ml is that toxic, or !linux_gaming@lemmy.ml, or !patientgamers@lemmy.ml
I always have my home to “Subscribed”, I see nothing really bothering me
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!patientgamers@sh.itjust.works is just as active
then subbing to ml as well will give you twice the activity
I’m sorry, I’m confused. You said Lemmy.ml is run by the same people as Lemmygrad.ml but if you click either of those links, you can see the admin list. Not one user is the same. Do they have different accounts, or what? Do you have some kind of citation for this?
“ml” in both of these cases is supposed to mean “marxist-leninist”, always has been.
the difference is lemmy.ml is not a politics-focused instance
Lemmygrad and Lemmyml are run by the same insane people…
Yes indeed but despite their more extreme beliefs compared to the average lemmings, they are quite lenient and accepting with lemmy.ml. I wouldn’t call the devs insane, solely for the fact that they gladly welcomed all the Reddit immigrants despite that they get numerous hate posts about their ideology.
Just to clarify, I’m just a normal libcenter guy, not an extremist.
My multiple bans would suggest otherwise, you either get downvoted or banned. They really don’t like it when people actually agree with you.
That wouldn’t have anything to do with you being an obnoxious dink, would it?
They don’t like it when people actually agree with you
Can you tell me an example? I find no reason hating someone if they agree with you.
I mean, if you make a comment arguing against their weird commie POV and it actually gets traction, they don’t like it one bit.
Huh, didn’t know that. Lemmyml seemed totally fine though?
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Well, I’ve never come across anything that made me notice, which is certainly a good thing.
As of a few months ago, lemmygrad is run by them as well. I don’t remember the specifics, but there was talk of some form of taking over every other Lemmy instance as well (I know there were calls for it from at least one of the tankie communities, either lemmygrad or hexbear), and the general hostility of both lemmygrad and hexbear users was why many instances defederated from them at that time.
If you want to see the face of a instance, look in the modlog.
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They’re all radioactive shitholes. There is no “lesser evil”, it’s all hypocrisy and willful ignorance in those circles.
Lemmy.ml has several solid communities, including the largest AskLemmy community. Their top 20 largest communities are all pretty mainstream and don’t really see the kind of posts/comments that make people wary of Lemmygrad or Hexbear.
I’ve had multiple bans from Lemmy.ml, they are anything but neutral. The best way to cop a ban is to make a comment arguing with their point of view that people actually agree with, they hate that.
They’re also some of the most insufferable people on the Internet.
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I’ve had both an account suspended, and a ban from presumably the whole instance. I didn’t care enough to investigate further.
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That is actually quite funny. I should go and wind up Lemmygrad then, I thought I was banned from the instance.
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Not even remotely close to 2/3, and it’s the whiney and annoying chunk anyway. I don’t want to “not engage”, I want them out of my feed.
Same, its just garbage and a shit load of snowflakes that break with the smallest difference in opinion or jokes that don’t fit with their political opinion.
seconded. lemmy.ml has afaik the biggest interesing communities for FOSS, privacy, Memes, etc.
FOSS, privacy, Memes, etc.
Aka whining about YouTube ads, paranoia, and communist whingeing thinly veiled as humour.
No big loss.
You could have stayed on reddit, but here we are.
Lol they always out themselves
Seems like you outted yourself as cringe.
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Jesse what the fuck are you talking about dot jpeg
You really love the bomb, do you?
It’s not, but even if it was that would mean 2/3ds of lemmy is full of licking authoritarian boots and genocide denial, so I’m fine with not seeing that.
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I don’t block instances. I block communities and users. An instance is too large a group of people. They’re not a monolith. Some people on hexbear are garbage and some are not. Some topics encourage jerks, some do not.
At a point the garbage to quality ratio gets too high to do that. Yeah, I’m sure some decent folks get blocked when you block a whole instance, but there’s plenty of other people in non shithole instances to more than make up for it. I just use whichever method is most efficient at cleaning up my feed at the time.
True. The good/bad ratio matters and is very subjective. I guess I have a larger tolerance than most.
Hexbear say what?
unpopular opinion time: hexbear isn’t that bad. I’ve had to block a few communities, but I do that with any instance. I’ve had to block more on hexbear, but it’s not a ton. I’ve had to block more people on hexbear than other instances, but it’s not that bad. I appreciate their different viewpoints. I don’t like echo chambers and I learn a lot.
You had them respond with LIB and big poop pictures again and again?
Yes, lol. I block every ppb I see whether they’re talking to me or not.
you’re blocking the some of the best posters if you do that though
If someone posts literal shit, they’re not worth my attention.
It’s generally posted in response to the literal shit right wingers put into words though, is it having the depiction which is so upsetting?
I have a similar experience. However, I feel that they have been getting a bit more argumentative in the last months (or maybe the argumentative voices are getting louder). I really appreciate how aggressively they defend our trans brothers, sisters, and enbies but, there seems to be a lot more focus on “dunking” than community building or discussions. Also, they’re at times quick to pull out the torches, rather than clarify and not always successful at preventing leftist sectarianism.
That said, by blocking problematic or unhealthily rage-inducing communities and users, I tend to get on alright in about 90% of interactions and learn a bit, from time to time, even if it’s not what’s intentionally taught (the commonality of historical revisionist takes in sectarian topics, for example).
Thats what a hexbear would say…
The most correct answer possible.
I might switch front ends just for this feature.I’ll never block hexbear tho <3 luv my spicey leftie friendos
(Even though they more often than not seem to hate my guts XD)
Why do you block lemmygrad but not hexbear??
hexbear users aren’t as repugnant. simple as.
lemmygrad is proudly ignorant and not even interested in honest discourse.
Hexbear, meanwhile, will actually engage in a discussion, make concessions, provide actual evidence for their claims.
I can actually learn shit, useful shit, from Hexbear. Lemmygrad is a vacuous hole where information goes to die.
Hexbear users are also, generally, more fun to talk to, have a better sense of humor.
Lemmygrad users, meanwhile, have demonstrated to me a pattern of being joyless hate-geysers.
If you have to ask which ones, it’s obviously not enough of an issue for you to notice.
Say NO to echochambers.
All the tankies came out of the woodwork butthurt about this.
Fuck fascists, including tankies.
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All of them :)
Isreal Palestine threads are also great for finding users to block. Reeeaaallly petty and vain way to use a decades long humanitarian tragedy, but I personally dont want to listen to the opinions of anyone who’d celebrate violence and horror of that level
You should block FauxBait@lemmynsfw.com among other child fetish communities.
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“You deserve Trump because you blocked me on Lemmy!!”
I swear sometimes this platforms unites Twitter and Reddit behaviour in an unholy mix
No one asked you to scream loudly “I am a tankie piece of shit” but you did it anyway
Have I perhaps hit a nerve with you?
Not being a tankie doesn’t make you a lib.
According to tankies, Donald Trump is a liberal. They are prepared to die on that hill.
A tankie ready to take being wrong and angry forever to their grave? Shock.
Aren’t you honestly doing the same?
They think they’re on some vanguard of a revolution posting memes. It’s pretty funny
Shhh. That doesn’t play into their angry narrative.
This is literally the tankie way.
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Nazi Bar Lemmy World… oof hot take. We were the first to defederate with exploding-heads.com (when they were still online). But we’re not keen on tankies either, which made you very mad and you got banned :(
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Not really. You know a modlog is public right?
Go be white somewhere else
Yes I am, because unlike your genocidal ideology, the “tankies” are actually on the right side of history. Anticommunism is indistinguishable from profascism.
Yes it me again, and I’m going to continue calling out problematic shit when I see it. Silencing tactics don’t work on me because i’m morally in the right and know it. This combined with your reaction to my other post proves that your siding with nazism goes more than passive and i’m not going to just sit around and watch as you influence the culture of Lemmy towards fascism.
Put a little nazi armband on the Ukrainian then add NATO pouring gasoline all over the meme and it sums up the situation right now.
And then more recent ones, first page of your comments - calls for violence:
God I can’t wait until these sacks of shit fry.
Typical tankie behavior I’d say
Hahahaha that’s incredible. What an absolute spanner.
TBF, that is a pretty insane statement. I wouldn’t ban you for that alone, but eventually I would probably tire of your intellectually and morally bankrupt insistence on dividing the world into communist vs fascist.
It’s absolute tripe. No one can be blamed for not wishing to waste their time in reading such drivel. The world is not black and white. There are no real binaries in reality, only in theory.
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As a tankie, who should you vote for in the 2025 election?
let’s see
- stans russia
- believes the state should be politicized and use force to suppress opposition
- protectionist
- anti-globalist
- authoritarian
- likes strongmen leaders
*looks at candidate field*
Favourite colour is orange?
I tend to avoid blocking communities and people on social media as I don’t want to create myself an echo chamber. On other social media, such as x/twitter, I only block folk who are directly abusive to myself.
There is nothing wrong with protecting your sanity. Why would you want to be exposed to vile nonsense, you’re not going to read breitbart forums in your spare time are you? Like… You’re the only one looking out for you online. The platforms are just trying to turn your participation into profit.
Because otherwise I’ll be under the illusion that they don’t exist.
Nonsense, if you have to block them, you confirm they exist.
It is not like they get automatically blocked by some form of algorithm.
That is not a good approach. The info shit is flowing and never ending, it’s designed to to fuck with you.
While I generally STRONGLY agree with this sentiment there are some things that I either find too repulsive or offensive to want to see on my feed. People calling for the death of politicians, or insisting that everyone other than them is intellectually inferior, or just the general usage of derogatory terms… yeah I don’t need to be angry :D
ETA: it also felt like there was way too much Russian and Chinese propaganda on a lot of those. As an American that gave me the ick
How cringe can they be if you have to ask for an instance instead of just noticing it yourself?
Wow, the comments are really turning into a dumpster fire.
My hot take is not to block instances because you can’t report what you can’t see
Yeah, I wasn’t expecting this to blow up as much as it did lmao
