Apparently data centers routinely burn through water at a rate of about 1.9 liters per KWh of energy spent computing. Yet I can 🎮 HARDCORE GAME 🎮 on my hundreds-of-watts GPU for several hours, without pouring any of my Mountain Dew into the computer? Even if the PC is water cooled, the water cooling water stays in the computer, except for exceptional circumstances.

Meanwhile, water comes out of my A/C unit and makes the ground around it all muddy.

How am I running circles around the water efficiency of a huge AI data center, with an overall negative water consumption?

  • exocortex@discuss.tchncs.de
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    2 months ago

    It’s used like sweating. We lose heat by havibg water evaporate off our skin. Right now get warm water and put it on your arm, then blow on it. It gets cold until it is fully evaporated. For water to change from the liquid to the gaseeous phase it needs energy. Think like water molecules are holding hands in a liquid. If one of them wants to come free and fly through the air it needs to somehow get the energy to break free from the grip of the others first. When water evaporates from your arm it tales this energy in the form of heat. It turns heat and uses it to get to the gaseous phase. As long as there is water on your arm it can be cooled that way.

    That’s what data centers do as well. They take water to cool their processors and the let part of it evaporate into the air. That way the parts of the water that remain are like your arm - the get cool quickly.

    It’s very effective. But if you live in a small town and next door there’s a massive datacenter that takes out all the groundwater and basically just boils it until it disappears, you might get angry after a while.

  • Fiery@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    2 months ago

    What I don’t get is how the water is “consumed”, it’s not like it’s gone right? It evaporates and then just comes back down as rain surely?

    Same with water consumption of a sweater or a steak.

    There probably is some good reason for measuring it like that but conceptually I don’t get it.

    • cRazi_man@europe.pub
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      2 months ago

      Even though there is loads and loads of water on the planet, the amount of fresh/drinkable/usable/accessible water is tiny. This water evaporates and rains back down, but this will most likely fall over the ocean, or on land and go into the ground, or into some other unusable area/form.

      Water suitable for human use is a scarce commodity and needs to be preserved. Of all the water lost to the atmosphere from server cooling systems, almost none of it can be recaptured again.

      • Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Hadley cells bring them inland does it not where it condenses and rains flowing back towards the ocean where it again evaporates and travels inland rains and goes back to the ocean.

        • 4am@lemmy.zip
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          2 months ago

          I mean eventually yeah, but not fast enough for you to keep using it that way.

          Especially now that air holds more moisture since rising temperatures keep the atmosphere warmer and rain is less frequent.

    • Ziggurat@jlai.lu
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      2 months ago

      This is the complicated part with water consumption, saving water in the Netherlands won’t make rain in Morroco.

      However, there is only so many rain water stored in the ground at a given time and brought by the rivers. This water need to be used mostly for agriculture, then human consumption, and finally industry. Once it’s back in the cloud we don’t fully know where it will fall again, let alone if it’s polluted.

      Sure it’s a renewable ressource, the problem start when you the water faster than the rate at which it renews, especially during summer. In Europe the problem will be even worse with the global warming. The alpine glacier are disappearing meaning that we’ll loose a major water reserve for summer

  • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    To add to what others said, it’s a tradeoff.

    Your gaming PC not only runs up your electric bill from the wall, but the AC as well. It has to work to get all that heat out.

    This is the equivalent of water cooling your PC, and piping it to a hot tub outside. It would heat it and evaporate water faster, but it’s basically free and uses basically no electricity.

    That’s the tradeoff. It’s water evaporation instead of heat pumps. It’s trading water usage for lots of electricity usage, which in some cases, is well worth it.

    And what if you live in a cold climate, you say? Well, evaporative cooling is most cost efficient in hot and (ironically) dry climates.

  • x4740N@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    Server farms use water to cool computers, it’s like water called computers but on a bigger scale

    Aircons condense water from the atmosphere the same way water on your shower mirror happens because the mirror is colder than the fog

    If you’re familiar with condensation and the rain cycle it should help you understand further

  • Thoath@leminal.space
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    2 months ago

    taps the fact that electricity is a steam reaction and even if you don’t see it, the electricity you’re using is made by decompressing water into vapor, whether by burning coal through turbines/boiled wind from water sources creating wind power/ even nuclear reactors are often a boiling water reaction going through turbines, creating a net loss of ‘water’ if we don’t have natural condensation utilities to convert ‘air’

    • lime!@feddit.nu
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      2 months ago

      that water usually goes through a heat exchanger in a closed loop. there’s a reason most power plants are built by lakes.

      also, explain “boiled wind”?

      • Thoath@leminal.space
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        2 months ago

        Water exchange above large bodies of water causes thermal dynamic exchanges deliberating speeds of wind currents

          • Thoath@leminal.space
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            2 months ago

            Yeah because you’ve measured the water intake and export of every large body of water I forgot you’re obviously an expert who knows how to read when a data center takes more water than a town, love your stern optimism, maybe like, wander off somewhere else so you feel important in your views, because it ain’t with me here bud

            • lime!@feddit.nu
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              2 months ago

              no, you obviously don’t want people to talk to you. that’s fair.

      • Thoath@leminal.space
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        2 months ago

        If it’s truly a closed loop, why do you need a lake, a true closed loop has zero need for local water sources, else there’s some sort of negative that they’re compensating for which, in case of local water sources, there’s not enough infrastructure if any of that water OR HEAT leaves the system faster than it enters

    • Thoath@leminal.space
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      2 months ago

      The water is for sure going up there with help, it won’t come back down without help in equal measure, it’s dynamics are completely spun out

  • rumschlumpel@feddit.org
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    2 months ago

    At this point, I wouldn’t be surprised if it turned out that they’re destroying the environment on purpose for some nefarious purpose. e.g. maybe they think it’s easier to rule the masses if natural ressources are very scarce.

    • Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      I think it’s more likely that yellow journalism is making an issue out of something that isn’t as big a deal as it is.

        • Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          When haven’t they?

          Fear and anger sell.

          This AI shit is the leftist version of “illegal immigrants are stealing yur jobs”

          • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            To be fair, the “infinite scaling” vision Altman and such are selling is quite a dystopia. And they are the ones pushing it.

            It’s not reality at all. But it’s kinda reasonable for people to hate that specifically.

              • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                No.

                The path I see forward for ML is small, task specific models running on your smartphone or PC, with some kind of bitnet architecture so it uses basically no power.

                That’s the hope, anyway, but all the pieces already exist. Bitnet works, extreme task specific training works with a paper that just came out, NPU frameworks are starting to come together.

                If that sounds incompatible with corporate AI, that’s because it is.