Apparently “nationalism is bad” is an uncivil take. Unless there’s another reason someone would ban this comment… 🤔
Have you figured it out yet? Brainwashed China IS maga.
Stethoscope theory, but more like a horshoe shape.
I got banned for saying China and the DPRK are oppressive regimes and that Ukraine has a right to exist because I violated “rule 1”. The irony lmao
American nationalism is bad because it’s an empire. That take is allowed.
Chinese nationalism, however, is good because it’s also an empire.
Ahhh. The vague and often confusingly unexplainable “Rule 1” violation on .ml that all the minions residing there always seem to find a way to pretend doesn’t exist when their beloved shithole of an instance’s strapped down oppressive bias is under attack.
I got mine yesterday too!
I mentioned bending over for dictators and they claimed it’s implied homophobia. Before getting banned, I asked if we’re back to assuming everyone on the Internet is male and got replied “oh look, I’m not a bigot, it’s implied misogyny not implied homophobia”…
The expression isn’t about any specific gender or sexuality, it’s about the power dynamic… It’s about the fact that people will do anything to please their masters.
Yeah, I’ve heard “bent over a barrel” in movies made for kids.
Lmao
Try this:
Criticizing the US, Russia, Israel, and Hamas all in one go, gets banned anyways.
Edit: Btw, those Chinese students aren’t necessary “brainwashed”.
There’s a chinese idiom called: 隔墙有耳 (Literally meaning: There’s an ear on the other side of the wall)
They know everyone is watching and listening, so they don’t feel safe speaking what they actually believe, especially not in public.
People criticize the government all the time, behind close doors with people you know.
Getting banned from .ml is a badge of honor!
Don’t even feel bad
That EXE crash error was really coming from the mod lmao
You were supposed to only criticize the US and Russia, you homophobe!
Edit: Btw, those Chinese students aren’t necessary “brainwashed”.
Valid, and perhaps the “brainwashed” statement was an unfair one, though in at least a couple cases, the emotion behind the words felt very genuine. On the flip side, there was at least one standout conversation with a particular student where the opposite was true, so perhaps each case deserves more nuance than the blanket statement of “they’re brainwashed.”
EDIT: That ban is actually beautiful, btw. The hate the “regulars” perpetuate while going untouched versus bans on comments like this speaks far louder about the belief structure of the mods than any back and fourth with them could.
We really should defederate from this shit
Yes, until then we can each do small things like
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Crosspost actual decent content in a .ml comm to a non-.ml comm (a perfect opportunity to grow smaller comms)
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Call out their BS whenever you see it on other instances
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Screenshot their Tankie propaganda and post it here
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Advise newcomers
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Make memes about it
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Downvote any .ml community post you come across and then see 1st point
.world has already defed’d 2 of the 3 of the Tankie Triad, but I’ve been seeing a lot of “sticking heads in the sand”
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infosec.pub
defederates the big 3 (lemmygrad.ml, hexbear.net, lemmy.ml)
I have no idea why it’s taking so long.
You can always choose an instance that does, or block the instance in your settings.
I dated a Chinese student at university. She seemed alright until somehow the topic of Tibet came up, and then she went full tankie describing how the Tibetan people were nearly subhuman, living terrible lives with no ability to care for themselves.
I’ve heard people say similar shit about indigenous Americans and yeah I think it’s safe to say that you cannot understate the dangers of propaganda and nationalism.
Oh man, Asians hate so many other Asians so ferverently it’s impressive. I knew a Japanese girl whose mom threatened to disown her if she dated any “Chinese hell bastards” (which was in fact, every Chinese person.)
Ain’t no racism like Asian racism. I lived with a Chinese buddy of mine for almost 10 years. He said American racism has nothing on Asian racism. Some of the Chinese and Japanese people legitimately despise each other. Long history of atrocities between them.
Same with Korea and Japan…
Imperial Japan did some fucked up shit.
Can’t blame her. Without exposure to other cultures, its hard to have an open mind.
That’s horrifying honestly
I would’ve left the room
pretty much par for the course on lemmy, you can’t have any interesting discussions about anything because you just get banned before it starts to get exciting.
seems to be most of the internet these days though. Dead internet theory and what not, although im convinced it should be altered slightly into three groups rather than two.
- people who are genuine real people and act like them (10-20%)
- people functionally indistinguishable from a bash script running coded responses (i think this is like 40% of the internet)
- chatgpt (whatever the remaining percent is, who cares.)
Ah yes good ol Rule 1 “Bigotry” the classic .ml go-to
Whenever you bring up the bans though the more prominent .ml users will proclaim that people mostly get banned for “bigotry” on .ml and there’s definitely no problem with opposing viewpoints.
This is the “bigotry” they speak of
Edit:
The brainwashed ideologies in Chinese Students
sigh
During the first year of the Korean War, Edward Hunter, an American journalist who had worked in wartime intelligence, and post-war with the CIA, coined (or, more accurately, first popularised) the term brainwashing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Hunter_(journalist)#Journalism
In March 1958, Hunter testified before the US House of Representatives’ House Committee on Un-American Activities. He described the US and NATO as losing the Cold War because of the communists’ advantage in propaganda and psychological manipulation. He felt that the West lost the Korean War for being unwilling to use its advantage in atomic weapons
It’s a bit funny to hear people use the term without recognizing it’s tortured and sensationalist history. “We’ve been tricked into not kicking off a nuclear war” isn’t what most people think of when they hear “brainwashing”. But during the height of the Red Scare, that’s what Goldwater conservatives and John Bircher reactionaries were arguing for.
That’s very interesting, and I genuinely do appreciate the history lesson, but what exactly are you trying to communicate? That brainwashing is only possible in North America because that’s the population it was coined for? That the act only constitutes brainwashing if it’s coupled with calls for violence? That brainwashing is a strictly government term and using it colloquially has no meaning? That I should fully detail every term with a unique historical significant etymology?
There’s a lot of weird insinuations and half takes that don’t add up to a complete idea in this post.
The term is an invention of propaganda used to dismiss outside views. You’ll see it in the Christian community to describe why kids come out as gay or transgender as often as by state officials describing why foreigners stubbornly refuse to accept Western economic orthodoxy.
There’s a lot of weird insinuations and half takes that don’t add up
To understand why a CIA agent would describe people critical of the Korean War as unable to think for themselves, you do need to learn about the Red Scare first.
If things don’t add up, go out and fill in more of the variables.
It’s not that I needed more historical context to make sense of the information you’re providing. The history lesson makes sense. It’s that you never drew any conclusion, nor connected it to the original post. Your post was heavy on insinuation, but void of clear meaning, leaving readers to draw their own conclusions on your intent. The only methods to “fill in variables” here are to make assumptions, possibly with the extra context of your post history, or politely ask your intent. I chose the latter. Though I still have to derive your intent from your post to be that I used the word incorrectly, as you’ve again neglected to actually say what you mean.
“Brainwash” is used to refer to exactly the condition I was referencing: being led to believe falsehoods completely and wholly, through the control of information and repetition of said falsehoods. Its original popuparization in anti-Russian, American political discourse is completely irrelevent to the message the word effectively communicated to those who read my post.
Language changes, and it’s the current interpretation of it that gives it meaning. Hilariously, you used the word “propaganda” to refer to falsehoods used to dismiss outside views; the word propaganda simply means information with political intent and its relation to falsehoods was a result of the Third Reich. The Ministry of Propaganda and Public Enlightenment, founded by Joeseph Goebbels, became famous for its spread of intentionally misleading propaganda, and popularized the connection of the word to lies and falsehoods. So should I suggest then that your use of the word is incorrect, as you’ve removed it from its context and used it to convey negative connotations that it didn’t originally hold?
Again, I genuinely do appreciate the history lesson. The intersection between words and their historical context is exactly in my professional field and I find it to be a fascinating topic. But if the intent was to attack the quality or authenticity of my post through semantic analysis via historical meaning, I think there are better ways we can both spend our time.
“Brainwash” is used to refer to exactly the condition I was referencing: being led to believe falsehoods completely and wholly, through the control of information and repetition of said falsehoods.
It’s regularly abused to describe differences in opinion or deficits in trust. Case in point, evangelicals will fling it around regularly when arguing over the practice of teaching Evolution in high school. They’ll assert Biblical Infallibility and claim paleontology is a falsehood that children are indoctrinated into.
You get the same out of war time propaganda. Particularly out of the Korean War, when the Red Scare was particularly high pitched.
So should I suggest then that your use of the word is incorrect, as you’ve removed it from its context and used it to convey negative connotations that it didn’t originally hold?
Do as you please.
I found a certain irony in the poster using the term to describe what is functionally just a reflection on the author’s own dogmatic views. I thought the history of the term - itself deeply reflective of an entrenched adversarial worldview that brooked no rebuttal to the point of dropping thermonuclear devices on people who adhered to a different economic philosophy - helped illustrate that.
Apparently I was wrong. The dogged insistence that Chinese people are incapable of thinking for themselves in the aggregate, and only Taiwanese people are true free thinkers, is too deeply baked into the Lemmy zeitgeist.
sigh
Oh you POOR TAXED THING!!
🤣 taxed is getting worked into my shit talk ty ty ty
Yw.
Brainwashed is the appropriate term to describe nationalistic ideology, yes
No no, nationalism is freethinking because [checks notes] an American in the Cold War was a lunatic.
conflates two completely different points about propaganda and losing-because-not-using-nukes together
It was Hunter’s variation of the Chinese term “xinao”, meaning “cleaning the brain.”
social situations must be exhausting in your life huh
I’ve definitely upset a lot of people with a little bit of history.
What’s rule #1?
- Be civil and nice.
This is the specific rule as it is written in the sidebar.
Which is funny, because if you go back through my comments in that same thread, I had far more uncivil and mean comments elsewhere. But the one that got removed and banned is the one that speaks to lived experiences with Chinese (and American) nationalism in a fair and reasoned way? I was unsurprised when I discovered I had a ban. I was grinning like an idiot when I saw what post did it.
