• Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
    28·
    5 months ago

    There’s a bunch of browser extensions as well to add a “show on my instance” link whenever it detects a Lemmy instance page which basically does the same thing automatically for you, pretty useful.

    • Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.worldEnglish
      19·
      5 months ago

      Then the technology behind that extention needs to be built into Lemmy itself.

      I get how this concept works now, but I keep saying that if Lemmy wants to grow it needs to be idiot inviting. The kind of place where you don’t need to think. The kind of place where you don’t need to learn.

      Because Lemmy growing means people who are not part of Lemmy, JOINING Lemmy. The thing is, I feel like techie linux users already know about Lemmy, and if they aren’t using it, it’s by choice. For whatever reason. But the type of people who choose to use Linux are a tiny tiny slice of society.

      But then you look to the rest of the world. And guess what. We’re all idiots out here. My dad who’s 80 years old still calls his Windows XP machine “that new fangled crap”. He USES Windows XP, but only because his Windows 3.1 machine died in 2005, and radioshack didn’t carry any new Windows 3.1 machines.

      So now every week I get a call to help him with tech support. That call usually lasts like 12 minutes. First me argueing with him to reboot, and him refusing to reboot. Him getting angrier and angrier that I’m treating him like a child, and then a few minutes later the reboot finishes. In the past 8 years his problem was always solved by a reboot. He never tries rebooting before calling me.

      He may be an extreme example, but these people are out there. Idiots are the bulk of society. If the idiots don’t know what is happening, they get frustrated and leave. That’s what this world is. Politics, religion, business, doesn’t matter who’s running what, it’s all supported by mass idiots.

      So the choice is, do you want a small platform full of people capable of tying their shoes, or do you want a much larger more active platform full of idiots?

      Thats the two ends of the spectrum.

      • Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
        6·
        5 months ago

        To be fair, Lemmy is super alpha software. It’ll take months and years before the platform is mature and more user friendly and has an ecosystem of really good apps.

        We’re like, emails just got invented era of fediverse. It’s having to explain that yes, if you have a Yahoo address you can still email Hotmail users 2 decades ago all over again.

        Now that the big ones like Threads and Bluesky are joining, users will be more familiar with the concepts and it’ll get less… confusing.

        • Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.worldEnglish
          5·
          5 months ago

          Well…not now, but thats only because ACP ran out of funding. Which only happened last month. Once he finds another free way to get internet he’ll be back. Just to browse foodnetwork.com everyday.

    • mark@programming.devEnglish
      11·
      5 months ago

      Was about to ask if there was a way to do this automatically. Does anyone know why this isn’t baked into the Lemmy codebase? I’m thinking this would be pretty easy with browser cookies. 🤔

      • Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
        11·
        5 months ago

        It would have to go through some sort of Lemmy link redirector service because a site can’t access another site’s cookies. And even then, with third-party cookie sandboxing, that still wouldn’t work.

        I don’t think this is solvable without a browser extension. The best the devs could do is let you enter your home instance URL on each instance such that eventually you’ve configured them all and it works. But the extensions are just plain better.

        • SorteKanin@feddit.dkEnglish
          2·
          5 months ago

          I think it is solvable. Your instance keeps track of the instances it is connected with. It could just do the search and find the post on your own instance if the domain is among the connected other instances.

          EDIT: Right, it doesn’t fix the problem of stumbling upon a link to a fediverse instance somewhere else. Not sure how you could deal with that one

          • Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
            3·
            5 months ago

            Because if you’re on say, lemmy.world because you clicked such a link, lemmy.world has no way of knowing what your home instance is. The cookies are all sandboxed for lemmy.world’s use. So even if you used a third-party site whose sole purpose is to know your home instance, it still wouldn’t work because now third-party cookies are sandboxes based on the domain of the site you’re visiting.

            That used to be possible with a third-party. That’s how the Facebook like buttons and Login with Google used to work, and those are also the reason it’s no longer possible. You used to be able to just embed some JS from a third-party on a site, and that JS can access cookies from the third-party site while also being directly callable from the site that embedded it. So in that case, we could agree on a third-party lemmy redirector service whose sole purpose is to store the user’s home instance in a cookie and then the script can be embedded everywhere and it would be able to spit out the URL from the cookie. But that hole’s been plugged. So even if you do that, it doesn’t work anymore because of stronger cookie sandboxes. But that’s why you’d need third-party cookies to pull it off.

            So the only fix left for this is, every lemmy instance you visit, you have to set your home instance on it, which would set a cookie that the site can actually see, then it could redirect you to your home instance to view the post. But that still kinda sucks, because you have to do it for every instance you run across.

            So, cookies are useless for this.

            • AwesomeLowlander@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
              6·
              5 months ago

              You’re missing the point. You should never leave your home instance. Lemmy could automatically remap links to whatever your home instance is before you ever click on them.

              • Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
                5·
                5 months ago

                Some UIs do, I have Tesseract on mine and it rewrites the links for me.

                That doesn’t solve sharing a link on Matrix/Discord/Google or wherever. I rarely have this issue on Lemmy itself, but whenever I get a link from elsewhere, that’s when I need to be able to open it on my home instance so I can interact with it.

                Same deal with Mastodon. You’re reading some news, it links so the dev’s Mastodon, you need a way to open it in your home instance.

                There’s no fixing that.

                EDIT: test self link to this comment https://lemmy.world/comment/10561034

                • Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
                  5·
                  5 months ago

                  This is what that looks like on a good Lemmy frontend:

                  I forgot the default UI didn’t do that. Both Tesseract and Boost handle those mostly just fine.

                • AwesomeLowlander@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
                  2·
                  5 months ago

                  Yeah, 3rd party links are a tougher nut to crack. You’d think they could at least fix the local links, though.

                  I can think of a few potential solutions, but they’d all require a lot of user opt in and centralisation, which makes it unlikely to ever happen.

              • ericjmorey@discuss.onlineEnglish
                2·
                5 months ago

                I generally agree with you.

                However, I want to encourge you to consider softening up your replies to people who you don’t have a strong prior social connection with. I’ve started making an effort to do that and I’ve found that I’m having more rewarding conversations now.

            • ericjmorey@discuss.onlineEnglish
              2·
              5 months ago

              That’s very different from what I think people generally want by default, which is that when you’re on lemmy.world, it’s because that’s your home instance and any links to other instances would be automatically converted to the lenmy.world version of the post or comment by default (as long as the two instances are federated).

              Anyone that wants more could find a browser plugin or script, but every new user with an account of any instance would have an initial experience that’s much less confusing and more consistent and pleasant.

              • Max-P@lemmy.max-p.meEnglish
                1·
                5 months ago

                I haven’t encountered that particular one in a while. Usually it’s Lemmy links from elsewhere like Matrix or Discord or whatever that are annoying to deal with and needs redirecting.

                Most apps seems to rewrite the links already just fine, at least Tesseract does. It’s not like the default UI is known to be good. It’s functional but the UX is terrible.

                • ericjmorey@discuss.onlineEnglish
                  1·
                  5 months ago

                  The default UI is how most new users will experience interacting with lemmy instances at first. So it’s helpful to create a better first impression. To the extent that this is built into the project itself makes it easier for other UIs to be created and maintained too.

                  I believe that the Lemmy devs are working on a better url scheme for posts and comments as well. This will also make it less annoying without any browser extension, script, or other third part service.

            • mark@programming.devEnglish
              1·
              5 months ago

              Sites can still have third-party cookies. The first party domain just needs to explicitly allow them.

        • spaduf@slrpnk.netEnglish
          1·
          5 months ago

          That’s how mastodon works now and i think it’s worthwhile as a basic feature.

        • mark@programming.devEnglish
          1·
          5 months ago

          A website can access another site’s cookies if the first party domain explicitly allows them, which would need to happen in this case. Sure, admins would have to allow which sites can access the cookie. But at least that burden is placed on admins vs the users.

          Browser extensions arent secure and many mobile browsers dont support them, so that wouldnt be a proper solution. A lot of users use Lemmy on their mobile phones.

      • ericjmorey@discuss.onlineEnglish
        8·
        5 months ago

        It’s not implimented because the developers of lemmy have been prioritizing other issues and features. They say they’re open to code contributions, so someone would have to volunteer to do it.

  • pentagrammar@programming.devEnglish
    13·
    5 months ago

    I would love to have domain agnostic URL for lemmy posts. It’s not easy to copy and paste from mobile and having multiple redundant URLs like instance.tld/post/12345 and another.tld/post/98765 leads to a discoverability problem.

  • gedaliyah@lemmy.worldEnglish
    7·
    5 months ago

    I feel like linking is one of the things that is still pretty broken in the fediverse. I’m not sure it’s fixable. Ideally, any link would open in a chosen app, on my home instance. And I don’t use the same instance for Lemmy, Masto, etc.

    • kevincox@lemmy.mlEnglish
      1·
      5 months ago

      I wonder if it could be something like adding a Link: </post/1234>; rel="activitypub" header or <link rel=activitypub href=/post/1234>. Then a browser (or browser extension) could detect this canonical ActivityPub URL and offer to open it in your configured instance or app. This is basically how RSS feeds work.

  • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
    3·
    5 months ago

    Hey so check out what I just learned:

    To post a link to a post, just search for the URL of the fediverse-icon version of it on your instance, then link directly to that search, chopping off the https://{your instance} from the front

    And likewise for links to comments

    You’re still making the user do 2 clicks instead of 1, but it’s still quite a lot more convenient than the other thing. It could be made even nicer (arguably “good enough”) if the backend could transparently redirect to the first search result along the lines of “I’m feeling lucky,” but it doesn’t look like right now it can do that.

    • OpenStars@discuss.onlineEnglish
      3·
      5 months ago

      No I don’t think comments works that way. For one, your search returns no results when accessed from on my instance, or from lemmy.world, etc. And for another, I have seen comments have different numerical tags after the instance name - e.g. mousing over the chain link icon vs. the colored fediverse graph sign icon shows the different values there.

      • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
        3·
        5 months ago

        Hm. So I understand the different comment IDs on different servers – the point is that searching for https://discuss.online/comment/9004867 on lemmy.world should then return a link to that same comment, with the right ID number for lemmy.world, on lemmy.world. Because through its federation backend it’s able to fetch the comment in question from discuss.online and then determine what is the local ID number on lemmy.world. Exactly the same as how it works for posts.

        I just mucked around with it, and it works sometimes but not other times. I suspect that it’s because of backed up federation queues or too-short timeouts or something, but it definitely works some of the time. If it’s unreliable it may not be that good an idea to put into practice, though, of course.

        • OpenStars@discuss.onlineEnglish
          2·
          5 months ago

          Here is an excellent comment from 3 days ago, so it should be federated everywhere by now? I just shared that link with someone else in fact, in an unrelated reply. I then went to Lemmy.World and searched for that link, but it does not find the original, although it does find my recent sharing of it. I also searched on reddthat.com, and saw the same behavior. And lemm.ee as well. So the “sometimes it works” effect may have some additional not-entirely-characterized triggers for that behavior, but it definitely does not work all the time as a “find this comment” feature as we are discussing.

          So as it now stands there is a way to use this search feature to find posts, but not reliably to find comments. Though that is still more than I knew a week ago before Blaze shared this trick with me then:-).