- cross-posted to:
- europe@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- europe@lemmy.ml
A controversial rule restricting speech about Israel was dropped after artists abandoned festival lineups in Germany’s techno mecca.
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No. Bad news for free speech, “good news” for antisemitism.
Anti-genocide and anti-apartheid ≠ antisemitism
Genocide is what Hamas wants to do.
And no i don’t think Israel did nothing wrong, its not apartheid however.
And no i don’t think Israel did nothing wrong, its not apartheid however.
“Broadly speaking, apartheid was delineated into petty apartheid, which entailed the segregation of public facilities and social events, and grand apartheid, which dictated housing and employment opportunities by race.”
How is it not apartheid?
Edit: wait a minute, why am I arguing with two cookie-based accounts that are pro-Israel and less than a week old on this thread…
Edit: wait a minute, why am I arguing with two cookie-based accounts that are pro-Israel and less than a week old on this thread…
Maybe stop arguing or something? Who doesn’t like Cookies? Like whats your problem?
Anyway, where is apartheid in Israel? Have you been there? Have you seen any? Or are you just against a two state solution? I don’t really see your point in just putting in the definition of apartheid and believing that proves your point?
Chomsky called it worse than apartheid and that was in 2014
https://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/8/noam_chomsky_what_israel_is_doing
There is a documentary called roadmap to apartheid that compares side by side what happened in south Africa and what continues to happen everyday to the Palestinians.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3psMGQE0iW4
I highly recommend it, it is hard to watch though.
As much as I agree, Chomsky is no trustworthy source on what is or isn’t a genocide
The man has bent himself in so many knots denying what happened in the yugoslav wars that I’m pretty sure Bosnia would actively refuse to prosecute if someone shot the bastard in broad daylight in the middle of Sarajevo.
genocide is what some people on both sides want to do and it’s sad that they are influential enough that no resolution of this conflict is in sight in my lifetime -.-
TIL criticizing a government is exactly the same as being racist towards its whole nation.
Thats not what the restriction was about.
“Free speech is when you’re not allowed to say mean things about Bibi, it hurts his feelings!”
There is a fine line, however, restricting the ability to criticize genocide is not a good thing— unless people consider Palestinians as subhuman, subanimal, which we acknowledge some do.
Yes, but there is no genocide.
40,000 confirmed civilian deaths in 3 months isnt genocide? Israeli’s are openly murdering anyone who looks even vaguely Palestinian in Gaza and the West Bank
Yes there is.
The only reason Gaza isn’t being called a concentration camp with a theoretical government at this point is because the west largely aren’t aware that Israel subjects holocaust survivor families to abject poverty and being called Soap People.
They were literally caught stealing the reparation payments intended for the victims and their families, so much so that a NGO is now the responsible party for distributing the remaining survivor payments.
They openly cooperate with neo nazi and neo nazi associated movements in the west because the more hostile westerners are to jews the more settlers they can claim need to he housed by evicting and killing Palestinians.
These guys sure are doing a fucking lot of nazi shit for how offensive everyone seems to think pointing out they’re doing stuff the Nazis did is.
How the turntable
Assholes. Its not criticism its terrorism support! Nobody cares about these “artists”
Even if you believe Israel to be completely justified in everything they do, there should never be a blanket ban on criticizing the methods of a country at war.
The ban wasn’t on criticism it was on their blunt antisemitism and terrorism support. There has been lost of criticism in Germany about Israels methods.
Sure, it was, at least according to the article. Emphasis mine:
which explicitly forbids any speech that “questions Israel’s right to exist” or criticizes the country’s occupation of Palestinian land.
And that is why Vice is a trash publication. Here is the correct text:
„Alle potenziellen Zuwendungsempfängerinnen und –empfänger bekennen sich damit zu einer vielfältigen Gesellschaft und gegen jede Form von Antisemitismus gemäß der Antisemitismus-Definition der International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA) und ihrer Erweiterung durch die Bundesregierung. Sie verpflichten sich dazu, alles Notwendige zu veranlassen, um sicherzustellen, dass die gewährten Fördergelder keinen Vereinigungen zugutekommen, die als terroristisch und/oder extremistisch eingestuft werden.“ “All potential grant recipients are thus committed to a diverse society and against all forms of antisemitism in accordance with the definition of antisemitism of the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA) and its extension by the German government. They undertake to take all necessary steps to ensure that the funding granted does not benefit associations that are classified as terrorist and/or extremist.”
And what is in the IHRA-definition?
“Anti-Semitism is a certain perception of Jews that can be expressed as hatred towards Jews. Anti-Semitism is directed in word or deed against Jewish or non-Jewish individuals and/or their property as well as against Jewish community institutions or religious institutions. In addition, the state of Israel, which is understood as a Jewish collective, can also be the target of such attacks.”
https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/de/aussenpolitik/kultur-und-gesellschaft/-/216610
There’s nothing in there about “criticising the countries occupation of Palestinian lands”. You just can’t fucking mask your antisemitism by raging against Israel.
That is some valuable context, thank you. Definitely seems like skewed reporting from Vice. The definition as you posted it definitely seems better than what Vice reported, though its last sentence is so vague that it could easily be used to silence criticism, whether it was meant to do that or not.
You can. because you referenced the IHRA “definition” of antisemitism adopted by themselves, the IHRA, in 2016
Aka
their own definition, criticized specifically for conflating antizionism with antisemitism
aka
the “definition” that led to 200 scholars making a new definition debunking it
aka a definition being used currently to silence free speech. If you’re using it to silence critisism of israel you are weaponizing it against one of the original drafter’s intentions.
So why not consider silence yourself? I’ve had quite enough of this ridiculous tantrum you call a point
That makes me even more confused. Are those artists now going to be allowed to play and spread antisemitism (as defined above)?
Yes “Palestinia” has claimed to own the entire land Israel. So in short, Antisemitism.
Wanting foreign invaders out of the land they stole almost a century ago is not antisemetic.
Criticizing zionism and israeli settler colonialism is not antisemetic either.
It is.
It is, its idiotic and they stole the land as well.
This is the same argument Russia has for Ukraine btw.
No they didn’t. Even the christian crusaders, who where happy to commit pogroms against jews in Europe as a sort of “motivational entertainment” had to note the peaceful coexistence of jews, christians and muslims under islamic rule.
The Palestinians of today are the descendants of the biblical abrahamic tribes. White european, often secular, jews, who now control Israel are killing the people whose lineage is closer to David and Abraham, than theirs could ever be.
It is, its idiotic and they stole the land as well.
I know you and your ilk don’t care about that, but no they didn’t. The Palestinians of today are the same Palestinians of 2000 years ago. Palestine wasn’t only Jews.
They did until Balfour decided to just take land from people already there and arbitrarily draw new lines on a map, probably with a sharpie.
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Israel are the terrorists in this case.
Maybe someone should take your free speech away, asshole
Please keep it civil here. After all we can still discuss and explain why some opinions are objectively bad.
Cookie respect agrees with cookie master? Do you have a cookie monster sock puppet as well?
What?
Yes
Ok i guess?
are you a bot?
Definitely. 100% and im paid for by the CIA with drug Cartel money.
