This is the propaganda I can get behind.
And with trolleybuses powered on a renewable grid, it’s zero gallons!
Or maybe tell bosses that if your job can be done remotely it should be done remotely. Then there’s more room on the bus for people who need to be in meatspace to do their jobs.
If only bosses were open to persuasion.
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They kinda forgot that unions and strikes are already the better alternative for them.
As much as I enjoy wanton violence for the ruling elite, a good start would be threatening the politicians with this unless they implement laws that make it unprofitable to force people into offices.
It should be codified that if a job can be performed remotely, it ought be, with the voluntary option to have people go to offices and such.
Yeah, tell it my boss. I had this conversation today with her.
I wish I didn’t need hands for my job, 90% of it is brain work with a tinker here and there. I see so many videos of robotic hands being used for things and can’t wait for the day I can just send one of these out to a site equipped with some tools and just remotely tap into the video stream. It’s coming and I don’t think it will be too long. Hell, I’m just a layman and if you gave me a dedicated year and some funding I could get something viable up to par so I’m sure it’s possible, guess it just won’t profit anyone enough to sell it yet.
We used to have trolleybuses when I was a kid in the 70’s, they were so insanely much more nice to ride than a diesel. No bad smell, and they were smooth and quiet.
I guess we will get back to something similar soon, but with batteries.
It’s still a shame because the batteries are less environmentally friendly than the old trolley busses.
Yes in some aspects, it’s like we are moving backwards. Funny since the talk about environment is more serious now than back then, still we often use unnecessarily polluting solutions, where the older “too expensive” solutions were viable when we had way less money as a country than we have now?
One would have thought the oil crisis had made us keep the trolley busses?
While I agree with the comparison in the post, the trolleybus powered by renewable energy shouldn’t be compared to gas cars.
It should be compared to electric cars powered by renewable energy.
I disagree, the bus is still replacing the purpose of the gas cars. The bus should just be compared to both gas and electric cars.
It is easier and cheaper to make one larger electric vehicle than 68 smaller ones, and they would damage the road less too. Of course this kind of comparison between two different things is inherently very difficult to do fairly
Trolleybuses are much lighter, cheaper and reliable than regular electric bus or car. Also: a car is still a car.
Ik that ttolleybuses are better than electric cars in carbon footprint, traffic, etc. I’m just proposing that we compare things with the same power source together. It makes more impact to say that an electric trolley is x% better on y metric compared to electric cars, than to say they are x% better than gas cars.
Imagine a situation where you say electric trolleybuses are superior to gas cars for reasons x, y, and z on xcretion or speddit. Then some elon musk bootlicker or big oil bootlicker replies to you saying “what about electric cars” or “what about gas buses”? You craft a meticulous reply about why gas buses are better than electric cars. But it’s too late. Thousands of lurkers saw the bootlicker’s reply to you but will never see your rebuttal. Many of them are now more against public transportation.
Nope, a car electric or not creates multiple issues like urbanism, pollution (i.e: noise, visual, microplastics), hotspots, hostiles environment like parking lots, increase deaths rates, consequences on flooding, etc.
A lot of them can be solved with public transportation.
How are buses still not better? The ratio of individual people being moved to total mass being moved is better. The maintenance and insurance fees are collective. The driver of the bus is a trained professional vs some rando commuter.
Trolleybuses are great. Fuck Sobyanin.
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Until in 5-10 years when the batteries are fucked.
That’s the beautiful thing about trolley buses - they do not need a (substantial) battery. They are basically trains on wheels.
There are some places where battery powered buses make sense - for example, where I live, lucerne Switzerland, there is one bus line that just goes up and down a rather steep hill. By using recuperative braking, the battery powered bus is super efficient. For other, normal ‘high traffic’ lines, trolley makes so much more sense
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Lucerne has a few trolley lines. They are ONLY trolley buses. The long, 3 Segment ones. Then, some 1 Segment hybrid buses that have pantagraphs. At the end of those lines, there is a longer stop where the trolley lines end, the pantagraph gets pulled down and the bus trucks along the last few stations with diesel.
Then theres just normal hybrid buses for more rural lines, and a battery operated bus that goes up and down a hill.
There’s a solution for every line - you just need the proper infrastructure. The reason that we have this great pantagraph-compatible infrastructure is that, while there are a lot of trains in Switzerland, there is no metro. So in lucerne, the trolley buses work almost as a metro, with the main lines having buses every 7 minutes.
… why not have as many cables as possible so you can simply minimize battery size? Trolleybuses are just more efficient battery buses.
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Batteries are also expensive, and how are cables dangerous? We use them for trams without issue.
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VPN uses 0 gallons.
Acktually, to use a VPN, you would need to turn on your PC or phone, which uses a small but existent amount of petrol -🤓
Solar power. Checkmate, atheists.
and EV car. also fuck petrol. and gallons while I’m here.
EVs solve about 2 of the 20 problems cars create.
While that’s true, they “solve”* the two issues that are most pressing with ICE cars, air polution and fossil fuel use. I’d rather have EVs over ICEs, and I’d rather have walkable cities and robust public transit than either of the car options.
* are better, not perfect
perfect is the enemy of good.
With climate change, we have a multiplication of flooding and heat wave. Cars increase the effect of both of them. EVs or ICEs, it doesn’t matter.
EVs are not and will never ever be the answer. It’s a myth like many created by the car industry.
no one said they were, calm down.
It’s nighttime doe
Pumped storage hydropower works all the time.
- it won’t be in a few hours 2. if only we had some way of storing electricity for later use
Never give up
Collect moon and starlight
The real waste is in converting solar to electricity. Use fiber optics, powered by light! Simplify! 🥴
Hydroelectricity, nuclear, wind and solar BABEEYYYYYY!!!
Hydro destroys environments, uses enormous amounts of concrete and the related disasters have killed orders of magnitude more people than nuclear.
Orders of magnitude more than nuclear is a low bar, nuclear is quite safe. How does it compare to coal or oil?
Yeah if three gorges broke then it would be the biggest mass death event in human history. Hydro dams are at the bottom of my list
perfectly valid point to bring up on a community dedicated to hating on polluters even if it was originally just a joke. Pretty serious matters
Very hard to deliver milk over VPN
When was the last time you saw a milkman on a bus?
That was, of course, just a random example of a job that cannot be done from home. A lot of jobs do require physical presence of people, that’s all I was trying to say.
Of course, a milkman would also require to travel to and fro their place of work, dunno why they cannot be on a bus for that.
You do not actually see many milkmen these days. A milkman’s business was ran a bit like McDonalds’s with the milkman buying the as an individual and then selling it door to door. Every single milkman that I have known has worked from home.
So kind of a bad example but I get your point. No not all people can work from home, but those who can should surely be given that option. I have a wife who is a civil servant. She is required to travel to work for 40% of her hours worked. This is for no other reason than going into work by direction of the Tory party. This was not really an issue until they moved the place of work 8 miles away. She literally has to pay for a bus, sit on a bus for an hour each way, while carrying all her PC equipment with her, just so she can do exactly the same job while sitting in an office. All her meetings are done online, even while in the office. So there is a lot to be said regarding this Tory agenda of forcing people to work from the office just to appease their Donors.
68 men plus the driver makes 69, amirite?
But the driver is already at work
That made me laugh out loud in the literal sense of the phrase
But how does the bus driver get to work?
- Dormitory day before morning shift
- Example: Moscow metro, national railway
- Night shift
- Example: major city, national railway
- PMV
- Example: a city
- Car
- Example: shithole without public transit
To be fair 1 person using car is not 450 people that could use a car. To be fair at most 20% of people have a car in heavily car-centric cities. In good cities it hangs in single-digit.
At some point, public transport had housing nearby the depots. Employees could walk or bicycle to the workplace.
Then some douchebag neoliberal thinking @&€#!?/((+ thought it was privilege and that it has to be cut…
And it takes them all at the same time?? 😳
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Ah, you should see buses in my city. Dirty, thirty years old, overpopulated graves on wheels with no air conditioners.
Never again.
That one bus company in the nearby city that absolutely refuses to replace their miserable old buses 🥴🤡 while the others run modern air conditioned hybrids, and some fully electric
You have multiple bus companies in one city?
Privatisation ☹️
Recently the fares were combined so we no longer need to get separate tickets for each
Having to buy different tickets for bus lines sounds miserable. Wtf.
Multiple bus companies can be a good thing if done well. The busses in Taiwan are also privatized and the service is quite good. In Japan even the metro and rail networks compete in a private market.
When you privatize a company and make it a monopoly though you get the worst of both worlds.
with no air conditioners.
Dear Faust. Are they using Soviet minibuses?
Ha! I have nothing but good memories about PAZ-3205. Fast, comfortable, with working AC.
LIAZ-677, on the other hand… now that’s a proper torture machine
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cb/LiAZ-677_bus_in_Bor.jpg
LIAZ-677, on the other hand… now that’s a proper torture machine
Whoa! Bus from 60-ies!
Thirty years old is a perfectly reasonable age for a big chunk of a city’s fleet. You’re still talking kneeling busses.
Then start campaigning for better public infrastructure.
Despite having the tube and double-decker busses, London is the most traffic congested city in the world.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-01-10/these-are-the-world-s-most-congested-cities
Imagine how bad it would be without the tube and busses! All these people trying to drive in London? Just thinking about it I shudder and I’ve never even seen London.
Good job they have them, in that case!
I was in London for a few days last year and it was pretty fine
At least in my experience most of the traffic is people trying to go into London from commuter towns, and they’ll take the motorways not the streets
Recently visited York (UK) and they have a fantastic bus system - and they’re electric.
Busses in my city are also going electric. So far only the local routes. The longer distance routes are still diesel
I could take 68 men. That’s a normal Saturday night for me.
…in a fight right?
Uuuhhhh…
Can’t take any more, because at 69 you’ll blow a rod.
And not in a good way either…
But that’ll take away people’s freedom to pay a subscription for heated seats 😔
But everybody loves cars! Just look at how many cars people buy all the time!
/s
Gallons? Shouldn’t it be liters?
Shamelessly stolen from I can’t remember.
The only issue I have with this is there’s a British gallon (that is DIFFERENT from the American gallon) that is used to measure milk. :D. That was the only place I saw gallon being used.
Oh no, so we have metric, imperial units, and now colonial units?!
Still british units :D. In 1826 Britain decided to redefine gallon to mean “10 pounds of water”. The earlier standard was 231 cublic inches (potentially meant to be 8 pounds of water). The US never adopted the new gallon.
Brits use tons and tonnes as separate units? Not confusing at all
When I think tonne, I think 1000kg. When I think ton, I just think of the vernacular “tons of stuff” type expression.
I mean there is have metric ton, british ton and american ton. Or tonne. Idk, its all the same in our language.
Actually, as much as I dislike imperial units, when it comes to body temperature I do think in Fahrenheit. Mostly because that’s how my mum would tell if we were too sick to go to school. 99 - just a little ill, but you can have the day off. 100 - pretty ill, probably at least 3 days off. 101+ - super mega ill, off all week.
I believe England, GB maybe, is very much a mixed bag when it comes to measurement standards.
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in miles per gallon
The thing is gallons are different.
For some reason I think, driving distance is kilometers, while driving speed is miles per hour. Is that right?
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At least when I was there circa 2006, distances were miles as well.
It’s Bri’ish, innit
No, litres.
It’s not a modern poster
It’s not a modern idea either
Reminds me article name from USSR newspaper about plane crash: “Gallons let down”/“Подвели галлоны”.
It would be nowadays, but this is an old old advert.
This was a lot more appealing before COVID.
Now consider an electric bus
Now consider a trolley.
Are there multiple tracks?
Well, there’s two. Only problem is the often obstructions and questionable breaking system
but this isn’t new technology where you can write a 100 bullshit news article about and prais it as the next big thing because it actually works and is efficient
And six times as long as best.
Exactly!
70mins of walking/train/walking… Or 25mins door to door in the comfort of my car.
In civilized places, buses take about as long as a car, as they’re prioritized in infrastructure. The added benefit is that you don’t even need to own a 2 ton death machine.
Not the case where I live. What is a ten minute drive quite literally takes the bus 50 to 80 minutes.
I can’t justify that much wasted time both ways. That’s about two hours of my day I could be spending doing anything but riding the bus.
That’s not an argument against mass transit as much as it’s an argument against building car-centric infrastructure.
Fair, but it is the reality a lot of people live with. I would love for us to have a Netherlands approach to biking, but we don’t. And we have brutally cold winters, where waiting for a bus is made even more undesirable, and biking less of an option because of how treacherous the snow makes everything (including driving).
To me it seems more like a pleasant fantasy than a realistic expectation. For other places I’m sure it is an attainable reality.
It’s all about location.
I don’t think you’ll meet a transit/urbanism advocate who will tell you to ride transit that doesn’t exist where you are or that is wildly impractical for you. I certainly won’t. For me, it’s more about doing what makes the most sense for you, while also pushing to change the infrastructure where you are to make transit and urbanism better and more feasible for more people.
I have written my council pushing for changes to existing biking laws to make it safer in my city. So you’re rightz we have to push for what we need. Nothing changes if we don’t voice our concerns.
Local climate really isn’t a reason to avoid public transportation infrastructure, as you have VERY hot and humid places (São Paulo, Brazil during summer) and very cold places (Netherlands during winter) with perfectly functional services. It’s all about HOW said infrastructure is deployed and cared for.
Netherlands is quite warm from my perspective and a poor comparison to the extremely harsh winters we experience.
Thier average winter temperature is our late fall and early spring temp (November and March). The months of December, January and March are more comparable to Siberia.
Fuck off with your condensed bullshit, not everyone lives in cities, not everyone wants to live in cities.
Yes, the people who don’t want to live in cities are called “clinically insane”.
Where do you think your food comes from?
Where do you think all of your tech gets made?
Where do you think all the resources those factories consume come from?
Cut the crap and stop acting like city life is the only way to live.
In London?
With the added bonus of storage space for all sorts of things!
Let me guess, you’re a 'murican?
Nice assumption you wrongly made.
What do I do when there’s no bus route anywhere near my work? I cycle when it’s weather appropriate but I ain’t cycling to work in 20°C heatwave.
20 c is a heatwave? Isn’t that like 68 F? I’d think 30+ is heatwave territory.
20 is enough to he generally uncomfortable all day.
I think you’ve become confused?
Nope.
And here my air conditioner settings are set to 24C°…
Fair enough. I start to get grumpy at 24 but I grew up in the desert SW USA but have acclimated to our temperate PacNW weather. I’d say similar to Manchester and Liverpool but summers definitely get hotter.
Nah, 30° is hot, heatwave territory is 35+
20° heatwave? It’s 33° tomorrow and I’ll be cycling.
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Campaign for better bus routes?
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Lmao exactly. I’m all for better public transportation but these comments seem like they’re from kids who don’t have people depending on them for a roof and food.
Let me lose my job so I can go yell into the void for better bus routes
Except you’re the two being childish.
If you don’t have a bus route, no one is here telling you to hitch hike or cycle in heat stroke weather for long commute or not go to work. Can you please point out where I or anyone here said so?
But “what can I do” was the question.
You can recognize the benefits of a good urban infrastructure and public transportation, highlight the lacking infrastructure in your areas, and support the goals of building that up by contacting your local officials or participating with groups who do organize.
This “child” lives within walking distance of his work office (for the few times I even have to to in) and on a bus route that can get me there as well (a bus system that is highly lacking in its own ways, to which I make note of to my local council).
I guess I should act like an “adult” and go “oh your work isn’t near a bus route. What can I do? Guess nothing.”
That is how we solve problems.
This post isn’t attacking you for your area’s lack of infrastructure.
Your ability to think, or rather the lack of it, is astounding.
Yeah the suggestion was “organize for better bus routes and in the meantime don’t go to work”. Exactly what was said. Word for word.
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You’re quite picky. Appropriate for a 1st Worlder, I might say.
