Changing their plug design with every new generation of products has created a lot of e-waste as the older plugs are no longer usable, as well as some countries have deemed this practice as a form of planned obsolescence which they have policies/laws against. So the EU basically told Apple that if their new products didn’t switch to a universal standard plug design (currently being the usb-c), then they would not be allowed to sell them in Europe. I’m guessing Apple is now trying to pass this off as their idea.
Yeah it’s a really weird reputation Apple’s gotten, but it’s completely unfair. In the time I’ve been using Android smartphones they’ve switched from micro-USB to USB-C.
Over that same time period, Apple has always used Lightning.
Go back a bit further and Apple’s older 30-pin connector comes into play, but that’s still just 2 cables in the entire history of smartphones so far. Compare that to the proprietary cables that could often vary by model on the various devices that existed prior to Apple and Android taking over the market and it’s a pretty good situation.
iPads have been a little worse, going from 30-pin to lightning and starting to use USB-C in 2018. But still, even that’s been very stable since then.
There’s plenty of legitimate things to criticise Apple for. Like their opposition to the right to repair. We don’t need to be making shit up.
That’s fair. I do know that miniB phones were few and far between, since the microB was popularized shortly after the smartphone was starting to go ubiquitous. I know about HTC phones, since those were where my experience was with early smartphones (specifically the HTC Dream and HTC Hero, which both had miniB).
USB C didn’t exist, but it was being developed, and apple was on the USB-IF forum which developed it. So literally part of apple was developing USB-C while another part decided “nah, we will make our own” and of course it takes less time to make your own than to make something everyone agrees on.
It was weird how you’d go to plug it in in the darkness of night, and it wouldn’t fit, so you’d rotate it, but inexplicably it still wouldn’t fit, so you rotate it again….and now it fits?!?
No thank you, I don’t like cables that break the fabric of space and time and betray reality itself.
Micro-usb is just about the most garbage connector in the last 30 years. I’d damn near rather Apple have actually sent me a breadboard and some leads than have that connector.
Also, it’s frustrating that everyone acts like lightning has no redeeming qualities. Lightning is a postless port, meaning that the failure mode is outside the device. If you accidentally trip over your cable, the cable will break but the port will be fine. That’s why your grandma can be using a 10 year old iPhone and treat it like shit
I think a serious argument could be made that more e-waste could be made by having a device that has a higher chance of breaking.
I’ll be happy to have a single cable for everything but that device will have a short life overall once it hits the point where the cost of any repair on the port outweighs the value of the device.
I’ll also have a lot of lightning cables that will become obsolete but that’s how it goes. There will be a ton of old people giving a lot of retail works a lot of shit that Apple changed ports just to make money. It happened when they went from 30-pin to lightning over decade ago and will happen again
If you accidentally trip over your cable, the cable will break but the port will be fine.
Tbh this is thing I’m not excited about the USB-C future on. On paper, I would expect that Lightning be more problematic since the springy bits are on device rather than the connector. In practice, I’ve never seen a Lightning port fail since it’s come out. Micro-USB, which is much closer to USB-C in design (obviously with improvement) for me has basically come with an expiration date. I don’t have enough USB-C stuff yet to say if that’s going to continue, but it’s a concern for sure.
That reputation is definitely unfair for their mobile devices but extremely fair for their laptops. 3 different magsafe connecters, switched to thunderbolt, switched to a new magsafe connector all over again, all in 10 or so years.
That’s a fair point. Though I’d point out that two of the three pre-Thunderbolt (which—and I assume you know this, but I’m adding it in for the casual reader who might not know—uses the USB-C connector) Magsafe cables actually used the same connector, so you could use them interchangeably. They just improved the way the cable itself worked to come out at an angle instead of 90º. And that the new post-Thunderbolt Magsafe laptops can also be charged using the Thunderbolt/USB-C ports, so it’s only adding a new option, not replacing one.
So it’s definitely worse than their mobile devices, but not quite as bad as it might at first seem.
It’s not an unfair reputation at all. I still have trauma from needing to buy new 24/30pin connectors every couple iPod generations. They absolutely did that shit on purpose, and lightning might have been a more moderate version of their planned obsolescence peripheral policy, but there was no fucking reason in the world for them to stick with the inferior lightning standard, other than forced fragmentation of the peripheral market. Apple knows that the number one reason people don’t even consider switching away from iPhone is because of all their lightning peripherals
This is a weirdly untrue comment. The iPod used FireWire for a couple generations before switching to 30 pin and never changing again throughout the rest of the history of the classic iPod form factor.
And a cable has nothing to do with why people buy or stick with an Apple or Google device. A switch to USB C would be better for everyone and Apple knows it (otherwise why switch the iPad to usb c? Why not put proprietary connectors on macs???)
Also? If Apple switched to USB C when it was invented AFTER Lightning, you’d be complaining even harder about how Apple keeps switching their ports to get you to buy more cables. Better late than never
Nothing and no-one other than Apple though, so I would welcome them being forced to use a universal standard instead of that ugly-ass fucking conglomerate of multiple types of bullshit proprietary standard they keep pushing so they can get even more money.
I’d be way happier with Apple existing if they wouldn’t always push these overly obvious proprietary money grabbing bullshit.
I use 10 Apple hardware devices currently, and have owned well over 100 since my first Mac 128K in 1984. I’m a sucker for Apple shit.
I kind of have to agree with the spirit of previous poster’s point. Apple does do annoying shit with port formats.
Between the four MacBooks in front of me, only two share the same main power format—and, of course, one of those can’t get enough juice from the other’s PSU.
Have two different formats for my iPads, and my partner’s iPhone and mine don’t share a format. That’s not remarkable, but the timing of the various iOS port format changes was frustrating, as certain devices made the port jump at the same time that their brethren did not.
I would finally note the rather large bouquet of different Apple wall-warts we have collected, also in two different formats, and a variety of wattages.
Finally, a lot of Apple’s cables have tips that seem purpose-built to fall apart, meaning even more trash in landfills.
The “purpose-built to fall apart” is real, I used to have a best friend who had to get new apple headphones every 2-3 weeks because they always somehow broke.
My apple headphone clones on the other hand lasted at best 2 years and at worst I can’t say yet because this is the second pair I got from the manufacturer and they’re still going strong. And I usually handle my headphones like shit, though not intentionally, of course, but the usual wear and tear.
Your friend is incredible if he’s able to kill Apple’s headphones in under a month. Unironically he should apply to work for some of these companies for QA if he’s actually capable of doing that.
For all of my suckerdom, the one Apple thing I don’t buy is headphones. Between the pre-sale engineered obsolescence and the post-sale engineered obsolescence (looking at you, AirPods and your declining noise-canceling levels after software “updates” as a new model is about to launch), I managed to achieve escape velocity to other headphone brands. Love the Sony WF-1000XM series for noise-canceling earbuds.
Your data isn’t comprehensive: Intel MB Air used MagSafe until 2017, but not same MagSafe as currently offered.
And, I meant that, among iOS devices, iPads did not switch to USB-C at same time phones did.
From cgpt, through 2021:
iPhone and iPad models did not make the shift to USB-C at the same time. As of my last update in September 2021, iPads started transitioning to USB-C with the iPad Pro in 2018. Other iPad models like the iPad Air followed suit, adopting USB-C in 2020.
iPhones, on the other hand, have stuck with the proprietary Lightning connector for charging and data transfer. As of 2021, no iPhone models had transitioned to USB-C, although the topic has been a subject of speculation and rumors.
Changing their plug design with every new generation of products has created a lot of e-waste as the older plugs are no longer usable, as well as some countries have deemed this practice as a form of planned obsolescence which they have policies/laws against. So the EU basically told Apple that if their new products didn’t switch to a universal standard plug design (currently being the usb-c), then they would not be allowed to sell them in Europe. I’m guessing Apple is now trying to pass this off as their idea.
They don’t change it every generation. Apple has been using the lightning port since 2012.
Yeah it’s a really weird reputation Apple’s gotten, but it’s completely unfair. In the time I’ve been using Android smartphones they’ve switched from micro-USB to USB-C.
Over that same time period, Apple has always used Lightning.
Go back a bit further and Apple’s older 30-pin connector comes into play, but that’s still just 2 cables in the entire history of smartphones so far. Compare that to the proprietary cables that could often vary by model on the various devices that existed prior to Apple and Android taking over the market and it’s a pretty good situation.
iPads have been a little worse, going from 30-pin to lightning and starting to use USB-C in 2018. But still, even that’s been very stable since then.
There’s plenty of legitimate things to criticise Apple for. Like their opposition to the right to repair. We don’t need to be making shit up.
Don’t forget miniB USB before the microB.
It went: proprietary–>open standard MiniB–>open standard MicroB–>open standard C.
On iPhone: proprietary 30pin–>proprietary Lightning
Mini USB was a dark dark time. Please don’t bring up those bad memories.
Hahahahahhahaha!!! I was actually thinking how bad those times were in tech hahaha
I didn’t forget it, I just have never seen a phone with mini USB. I’ve still actually got some devices that use it, but never a phone.
Not doubting that they exist, but I was very explicitly comparing my own personal experience to the Apple one.
That’s fair. I do know that miniB phones were few and far between, since the microB was popularized shortly after the smartphone was starting to go ubiquitous. I know about HTC phones, since those were where my experience was with early smartphones (specifically the HTC Dream and HTC Hero, which both had miniB).
If every cell phone brand acted like Apple we would have like thirty different proprietary chargers.
We shouldn’t give them a pass just because they’re the only ones brazen enough to be stupid.
USB C didn’t exist when Apple made the lightning connector.
Are they idiots, or are they innovators and the rest are just trying to catch up?
USB C didn’t exist, but it was being developed, and apple was on the USB-IF forum which developed it. So literally part of apple was developing USB-C while another part decided “nah, we will make our own” and of course it takes less time to make your own than to make something everyone agrees on.
Micro USB did.
And then instead of making a connector like USB-C that everyone could use they made their own proprietary one.
Micro usb sucked.
It was weird how you’d go to plug it in in the darkness of night, and it wouldn’t fit, so you’d rotate it, but inexplicably it still wouldn’t fit, so you rotate it again….and now it fits?!?
No thank you, I don’t like cables that break the fabric of space and time and betray reality itself.
Micro-usb is just about the most garbage connector in the last 30 years. I’d damn near rather Apple have actually sent me a breadboard and some leads than have that connector.
It used to be the case, just like it was for laptops until very recently.
Also, it’s frustrating that everyone acts like lightning has no redeeming qualities. Lightning is a postless port, meaning that the failure mode is outside the device. If you accidentally trip over your cable, the cable will break but the port will be fine. That’s why your grandma can be using a 10 year old iPhone and treat it like shit
I think a serious argument could be made that more e-waste could be made by having a device that has a higher chance of breaking.
I’ll be happy to have a single cable for everything but that device will have a short life overall once it hits the point where the cost of any repair on the port outweighs the value of the device.
I’ll also have a lot of lightning cables that will become obsolete but that’s how it goes. There will be a ton of old people giving a lot of retail works a lot of shit that Apple changed ports just to make money. It happened when they went from 30-pin to lightning over decade ago and will happen again
Tbh this is thing I’m not excited about the USB-C future on. On paper, I would expect that Lightning be more problematic since the springy bits are on device rather than the connector. In practice, I’ve never seen a Lightning port fail since it’s come out. Micro-USB, which is much closer to USB-C in design (obviously with improvement) for me has basically come with an expiration date. I don’t have enough USB-C stuff yet to say if that’s going to continue, but it’s a concern for sure.
That reputation is definitely unfair for their mobile devices but extremely fair for their laptops. 3 different magsafe connecters, switched to thunderbolt, switched to a new magsafe connector all over again, all in 10 or so years.
That’s a fair point. Though I’d point out that two of the three pre-Thunderbolt (which—and I assume you know this, but I’m adding it in for the casual reader who might not know—uses the USB-C connector) Magsafe cables actually used the same connector, so you could use them interchangeably. They just improved the way the cable itself worked to come out at an angle instead of 90º. And that the new post-Thunderbolt Magsafe laptops can also be charged using the Thunderbolt/USB-C ports, so it’s only adding a new option, not replacing one.
So it’s definitely worse than their mobile devices, but not quite as bad as it might at first seem.
It’s not an unfair reputation at all. I still have trauma from needing to buy new 24/30pin connectors every couple iPod generations. They absolutely did that shit on purpose, and lightning might have been a more moderate version of their planned obsolescence peripheral policy, but there was no fucking reason in the world for them to stick with the inferior lightning standard, other than forced fragmentation of the peripheral market. Apple knows that the number one reason people don’t even consider switching away from iPhone is because of all their lightning peripherals
This is a weirdly untrue comment. The iPod used FireWire for a couple generations before switching to 30 pin and never changing again throughout the rest of the history of the classic iPod form factor.
And a cable has nothing to do with why people buy or stick with an Apple or Google device. A switch to USB C would be better for everyone and Apple knows it (otherwise why switch the iPad to usb c? Why not put proprietary connectors on macs???)
Also? If Apple switched to USB C when it was invented AFTER Lightning, you’d be complaining even harder about how Apple keeps switching their ports to get you to buy more cables. Better late than never
Nothing and no-one other than Apple though, so I would welcome them being forced to use a universal standard instead of that ugly-ass fucking conglomerate of multiple types of bullshit proprietary standard they keep pushing so they can get even more money.
I’d be way happier with Apple existing if they wouldn’t always push these overly obvious proprietary money grabbing bullshit.
I mean, yeah, but there’s no need for OP to lie about Apple swapping ports every generation.
I use 10 Apple hardware devices currently, and have owned well over 100 since my first Mac 128K in 1984. I’m a sucker for Apple shit.
I kind of have to agree with the spirit of previous poster’s point. Apple does do annoying shit with port formats.
Between the four MacBooks in front of me, only two share the same main power format—and, of course, one of those can’t get enough juice from the other’s PSU.
Have two different formats for my iPads, and my partner’s iPhone and mine don’t share a format. That’s not remarkable, but the timing of the various iOS port format changes was frustrating, as certain devices made the port jump at the same time that their brethren did not.
I would finally note the rather large bouquet of different Apple wall-warts we have collected, also in two different formats, and a variety of wattages.
Finally, a lot of Apple’s cables have tips that seem purpose-built to fall apart, meaning even more trash in landfills.
The “purpose-built to fall apart” is real, I used to have a best friend who had to get new apple headphones every 2-3 weeks because they always somehow broke.
My apple headphone clones on the other hand lasted at best 2 years and at worst I can’t say yet because this is the second pair I got from the manufacturer and they’re still going strong. And I usually handle my headphones like shit, though not intentionally, of course, but the usual wear and tear.
Your friend is incredible if he’s able to kill Apple’s headphones in under a month. Unironically he should apply to work for some of these companies for QA if he’s actually capable of doing that.
“I see the problem, you’re going to want to not chew on those.”
For all of my suckerdom, the one Apple thing I don’t buy is headphones. Between the pre-sale engineered obsolescence and the post-sale engineered obsolescence (looking at you, AirPods and your declining noise-canceling levels after software “updates” as a new model is about to launch), I managed to achieve escape velocity to other headphone brands. Love the Sony WF-1000XM series for noise-canceling earbuds.
Apple swapped MacBooks to USB C in 2015
2018 was first USB C iPad.
Unless your partner is using an iPhone 4s, they have a lightning port. Not sure why you’re saying they’re different.
Again. Not every generation.
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“Spirit” was the operative word.
Your data isn’t comprehensive: Intel MB Air used MagSafe until 2017, but not same MagSafe as currently offered.
And, I meant that, among iOS devices, iPads did not switch to USB-C at same time phones did.
From cgpt, through 2021:
iPhone and iPad models did not make the shift to USB-C at the same time. As of my last update in September 2021, iPads started transitioning to USB-C with the iPad Pro in 2018. Other iPad models like the iPad Air followed suit, adopting USB-C in 2020.
iPhones, on the other hand, have stuck with the proprietary Lightning connector for charging and data transfer. As of 2021, no iPhone models had transitioned to USB-C, although the topic has been a subject of speculation and rumors.
deleted by creator
People in this thread are apparently too young to remember how often the original iPod connectors changed.
You keep saying this but the first two generations were FireWire only and after that the 30-pin dock connector was used until Lightning came out.
And even then the classic iPod never used lightning, just stuck with the 30 pin
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Once. Firewire then 30pin
what are you talking about? They’ve used the same lightening connector for the past 10 generations.