• easily3667@lemmus.org
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    7
    ·
    19 hours ago

    Fun fact: there’s no such thing as a legal name in most states. There’s names you use, names assigned at birth, but no legal name.

  • rational_lib@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    22
    ·
    edit-2
    1 day ago

    This headline is horseshit so I’ve only read enough to establish that much and am ignoring the rest of the article. Someone post a different one.

    Here’s all you need to know from the article:

    Republicans, and apparently some Democrats

    many have warned that it could even make it harder for married women to vote.

    The only conclusion you should draw is this: Marin Scotten of the New Republic is full of shit and shall not be trusted ever. You may conclude as you wish about all other matters based on other sources.

    • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      10
      ·
      edit-2
      21 hours ago

      You’re being extreme. I suppose headline is misleading because the bill would have passed without Democrat support, and it doesn’t directly restrict the voting of married women. But four house democrats did vote for this (presumably because they’re in swing districts or border towns?), and the premise (requiring proof of citizenship is soft voter supression) appears to be true.

      But you are touching on something I feel. Lots of really sensationalist sources float to the top of Lemmy’s front page.

      • conditional_soup@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        edit-2
        15 hours ago

        New Republic is the worst. The Trump administration already does a lot of really awful, shitty, terrible things that deserve sunlight without sensationalizing shit, but they make a lot of sensationalist articles and a lot of “Oh Boy this ONE maga voter is really sorry now!” pieces. It’s got big institutional Democrat energy.

        That said, yes, the headline is indirectly correct.

        • brucethemoose@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          14 hours ago

          Rawstory is pretty bad too. Blogs/tweets that float up can be even worse.

          I get it, people have their regular sources and well we should do something about it and post better ones if we don’t like it, but still.

    • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      edit-2
      20 hours ago

      This headline is horseshit

      The legislation fucks with the ability for women who change their last name after marriage to obtain the IDs necessary to cast a ballot, which are increasingly fixated on tying everything back to your Birth Certificate. Four Democrats supported this bill, ostensibly in order to fuck over Transgender people.

      Incidentally, one of the four - Henry Cuellar - is indicted on charges of bribery, unlawful foreign influence, and money laundering, allegedly accepting nearly $600,000 in bribes from foreign entities in exchange for political favors. Crazy that Dem megadonors continue to back him in election after election.

      Marin Scotten of the New Republic is full of shit and shall not be trusted ever.

      My guy, you’re the one spewing horseshit here.

      • okgurl@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        15 hours ago

        right I thought I was waking up in crazy town. many women change their names and do not update their birth certificate My therapist was literally telling me about her issues with doing it because she’s been divorced a couple times this legislation directly impacts women and trans people specifically. It is intentionally written to make it harder for people in these groups to vote me personally I’m in the middle of getting my birth certificate updated so I’m hoping it won’t be a problem by the time midterms come up, but overall this bill is a bad bill it’s not needed there’s no need for this bill it’s absolutely pointless and pathetic attempt at voter manipulation

    • Bloomcole@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      1 day ago

      I’m going to conclude blue MAGA is angry and can’t take criticism.
      Attacking the source when NPR and plenty of media report the same thing.

      • Nalivai@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        19 hours ago

        Focusing direct attention on 4 out of 220 people and wording it as if those were the only people who did it isn’t a critisism, it’s a manipulation. It’s the same manipulation that was around for months before the election which lead to all this bullshit in the first place. For a median voter it makes this regular “both sides” bullshit, when in reality it’s 216 vs 4 people.

  • Lukas Murch@thelemmy.club
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    27
    ·
    1 day ago

    But that means something like 204 democrats voted against. Maybe if those 4 hadn’t of supported the bill, it might have failed, but you can’t blame the democrats for a shitty bill when 97% voted against.

    • okgurl@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      15 hours ago

      yeah you can because they need to all be united on this I bet you all the Republicans voted yes all the Democrats should have voted no not that it matters anyways because it would have still passed it’s just a matter of principle I don’t get why you guys don’t understand that it’s quite simple

  • Triple Iris@lemmy.wtf
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    17
    ·
    1 day ago

    It’s not these four cowardly DINOs that make me lose faith in this country. It’s the people continuing to defend them.

    • easily3667@lemmus.org
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      19 hours ago

      For freedom from having to deal with all the pesky women who vote democrat.

      Although more and more women aren’t changing their name because it’s a stupid tradition, but obviously that skews liberal, so it may be hurting republican women more… Which actually checks out, since republicans generally hurt their own (voting) constituents in favor of their true, rich constituency.

  • Wren@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    155
    ·
    edit-2
    2 days ago

    “Four democrats passed this,” but we are just going to ignore the 216 conservatives that passed it?

    So when do we get to start calling bullshit like this propaganda?

    • wpb@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      1 day ago

      “man bites dog” vs “dog bites man”

      We all know what the Republicans unanimously stand for. Apparently some democrats do too, and that’s worth noting.

    • reddit_sux@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      33
      ·
      2 days ago

      People expect the representative they voted for to vote how they want. Conservatives’ representative voted as they wanted. Whereas Democrats’ representative voted against their wishes. Hence the outrage.

      This is a simplistic explanation, 4 Democratic representative might have voted as their constituents have demanded.

      • dwemthy@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        2 days ago

        Based on what I hear on local news, Perez at least probably is doing what her constituents want. She won a very red district as a Democrat by appealing to the people in her district. I don’t like her vote, but I get it.

      • LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        2 days ago

        I’d bet most conservative women didn’t vote to have their ability to vote taken away as well. Having to have a “real ID” license accepted in every state not be accepted to vote is pure ridiculousness.

    • A_norny_mousse@feddit.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      28
      ·
      edit-2
      2 days ago

      My initial reaction to this headline was: “what now?”, and my first reaction on reading the article was “oh, it’s a continuation of the horror show that calls itself US government - not actually something that four democrats are responsible for”

      So I’m totally with you. Stop the sanewashing of the continued and systematic madness rising to ever new heights of depravity, should be the headline.

      Republicans built the foundation for what’s happening now for decades, and it was always like you said in your other comment: “Conservatives have survived on their ability to never be held accountable for what they do.” Well, slightly more differentiated.

      This bill is yet another voter supression tool. This is what they ultimately want: you have to be rich, male, of a certain ethic, and “white” to have a say. And they’re almost there. If voting was really made easy for everyone, do you really think the GOP would still win?
      This is yet another piece of codified and systemic racism, misogyny, homo- and transphobia, richism.
      The hollowing out of what was once a working, relatively democratic system to a point where even the empty shell is starting to break up.

      All that said, Democrats should start wielding what power they have (both in the government and in media, public opinion etc.) way more decisively. Between elections we must talk about how fucked up both parties are.

      This comment (from this post) puts it best imho:
      https://lemmy.world/comment/16414382
      https://feddit.org/post/10702307/6001640

    • Signtist@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      49
      ·
      2 days ago

      Everyone already knows all the republicans supported it; anything under their jurisdiction is already a lost cause. What I want to know is how many people from the “left” party can’t even keep their own votes on the right side of history. It’s not news when villains are villains - it’s news when the people who say they’re here to fight back against the villains are caught supporting them, and it’s important not to drown out that important detail among a bunch of already-known regressives. People need to see that the current democratic party isn’t a viable defense against conservativism, and that we need to do something more to get things moving in the right direction again than simply trusting democrats to fix everything.

      • Wren@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        edit-2
        2 days ago

        I get what you’re saying… but have a hard time accepting that just because, conserves are being conservatives, it’s seemingly fine that they do villain-shit. We’ll just be outraged at the audacity of four idiot democrats that voted in lock-step with them.

        ALL of them need to be held accountable.

        But here, when all I see are people ignoring the villains, it makes me wonder why I ever bothered to question how we got here.

        Conservatives have survived on their ability to never be held accountable for what they do. And seeing everyone focused on holding four democrats responsible for their joint effort with 16 conservatives and not even mentioning the assholes that drew this up to begin with-

        I guess it all makes more sense now how thoroughly we are fucked.

        It’s totally Democrats fault.

          • Wren@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            ·
            edit-2
            2 days ago

            pastin

            And what I said is slop?

            I’ll digress and simplify it for you since you seem to be having trouble:

            I find it strange how here on lemmy, whenever something happens, any time a democrat is involved in the slightest- whatever bad happened, it’s entirely blamed on the democrats, regardless of the fact that it wouldn’t have even happened to begin with had it not been for conservatives.

            Further simplification:

            • A bill is drafted- by conservatives
            • 216 conservatives vote for it
            • 4 democrats vote for it

            You: “See? We told you! All of the democrats are evil!

            • ace_of_based@sh.itjust.works
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              4
              ·
              2 days ago

              Or is it every time (cuz there are countless times) people get mad at Dems for failing just enough to enable the Republicans some copy pastin breathless newbie to politics comes in with copypasta defending them?

              Hmmmmmm 🤔

              • Wren@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                3
                ·
                2 days ago

                I’d prefer to go with what’s empirically provable vs. some random shit you came up with because you can’t be seen to be proven wrong about something- in an argument with someone that you need to assume shit about in order to look like you know what you’re saying.

                And “breathless newbie”?

                Hilarious! You know nothing about me, therefore, you don’t get to make edits to who I am.

                Now… You’re just going to have to be okay with all of this and move on, alright?

                We’re done talking now. Enjoy that ever-important last word you seem to always have to have.

  • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    11
    ·
    2 days ago

    You can currently vote in the US without ID?

    I don’t understand what the controversy is, providing ID along with your voting card seems normal to me.

    What am I missing? I scimmed the article.

    • Taleya@aussie.zone
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      15
      ·
      1 day ago

      You can vote in a lot of countries without ID dude.

      A birth certificate is a static document. In my case it was issued 47 fckn years ago. Why should i pay to update a half century document to match my current legal ID (passport, license , etc) I shouldn’t and it’s ridiculous

      A friend changed her surname after being adopted by her stepfather. She’s fucked by this as well. Anyone who’s ever changed a stupid name, broken from a bad parent, been adopted, anglicised, or even had a fat fingered nurse typo is now fucked…because idiots are hysterical over 0.6% of the population.

      • Gurei@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        9
        ·
        1 day ago

        Oh hey, that’s me! Nurse swapped my vowels around. Literally hasn’t been an issue for 37 years and now, it just might be.

      • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 day ago

        Could you name these “a lot of countries”? Since it’s a lot of them, shouldn’t be too difficult to mention 20 right?

        They say it’s to prove citizenship, a passport is proof of citizenship isn’t it? So that is enough no?

          • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            ·
            1 day ago

            Wow… 4 countries + various US states doesn’t require ID. Yeah, that’s truly “A lot” of countries, dude.

            • Taleya@aussie.zone
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              6
              ·
              1 day ago

              You know how you keep saying “well we do this in my country so it’s normal

              That shit cuts both ways dude…and I’m in Australia

              • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                1 day ago

                If you want to paraphrase me, at least do it correctly, “Well, we do this in MOST countries, so it’s normal” And yes, that is the definition of normal. It’s normal because it’s the norm. You guys are the exception. Not the other way around.

                You said ID isn’t required in “a lot of countries”, and then you provide a graph (without a verifiable source) where the number of countries you don’t need ID to vote in, can be counted on a single hand.

                • Taleya@aussie.zone
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  6
                  ·
                  1 day ago

                  You know, you had a chance to learn about how other countries do things. Instead you chose to be a self righteous butt. Shame.

          • absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 day ago

            From vote.nz

            You don’t need to take your driver licence, your passport, or anything else with you to a voting place. No ID is required.

            Your EasyVote card, if you have one, will make voting faster – but you can vote without it.

            When you go to vote, you’re either marked off the printed roll at the voting place, or your details are recorded. During the official count, we compare all the rolls from all the voting places in each electorate to make sure everyone has only voted once.

            So you don’t require ID, but you get sent an easy vote card, to speed up the process when you go to vote. It is super quick though, usually less than 5 minutes to vote usually.

            • Taleya@aussie.zone
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              1 day ago

              yah in AU you go to a polling place in your LGA, and they check off your name / enrolled address on big ol’ paper-filled binders listing everyone eligible to vote in that area. Then they validate the voting slips they give you and direct you to the booth.

    • saigot@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      17
      ·
      2 days ago

      I live in Canada, I can vote using my free government issued healthcard or I can bring a friend to vouch for me, or i can bring a student id and a bill. While most people probably vote with their drivers license or photo ID this enables people who are homeless, very old, or in my case in 2021, just moved. (Here’s what’s needed for the curious). You’ll notice in that link there are special exemptions for people who live in long term care homes, for whom it is much more common to have no form of id.

      People who don’t have easy access to id are societies most vulnerable people and I think it is especially important that they have access to voting.

      America does not have a free form of id (in most states anyway) and does not allow someone to vouch as a form of identification.

      • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 day ago

        I’m Swedish. Don’t know if someone can vouch for me. Never tried. Pretty sure I need an ID.

        Everyone (18+) get a voting card in their mail sent to their adress. You bring the voting card and ID, like passport or drivers license. Someone ticks your name off a list and you can vote. (No registrering to vote or anything)

        ID isn’t free, but a passport costs like $40-50.

        You can also get a national ID card. But that’s even more expensive and I still don’t quite understand why you would want one rather than just getting a passport.

        • boonhet@lemm.ee
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          6
          ·
          edit-2
          1 day ago

          I’m Estonian, we also have ID requirements, and an ID card is cheap. Passports aren’t expensive either, but ID cards are more useful in day to day life.

          The US is fucked. There’s no standardized photo ID that everyone has to have. People only get passports for travel and the country is literally so huge and diverse you can travel more than most people have money to and see many different environments without leaving it. I reckon you could spend a year in NYC alone and not see everything there is to see. In 2006, 20% of Americans had passports, in 2011 it was 37%.

          The most common form of photo ID to have is the driver’s license. But some people don’t get one. People also have social security cards, almost everyone has one, but that’s not a photo ID.

          Luckily they now have something called a passport card (pretty much just an ID card but allows travel to like Canada and Mexico I think?), that only costs 30 bucks to get. The actual book form of passport is 130 for application, and if you’re an adult and it’s your first passport, there’s a 35 dollar acceptance fee, which all together is actually too much for some people.

          They also have free voter ID cards which are nowhere close to free.

          There’s just a lot of bureaucratic inefficiency in the whole ID system in the US. It’s fucked. If you’re poor and can’t get time off work to get a cheap form of ID, you might be fucked. If you don’t have transport, you might be fucked.

          Really, they should fix all this first and THEN mandate photo ID for voting. Right now it disproportionately affects people who have a hard time getting a photo ID, i.e poor people. Then there’s the whole single voting day for in-person voting. It also disproportionately affects the working class - people who might have a hard time getting time off work. Wait, why is this an issue, your employer is legally mandated to give you time off to vote? Because in red states, in areas that vote blue, they only put one voting station for a whooooole bunch of people so you’d have to drive a long distance AND wait a long time in line. AND it’s only 1-4 hours depending on state AND not all states have these laws.

          The whole country is rigged to not let poor people to vote as easily as the wealthy, unfortunately.

          • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 day ago

            I’ve spent quite some time in the US. I’m well aware of their bureaucracy. Maybe I just have a different opinion than others. I understand it causes some issues for some, but you can get a copy, or amend your US birth certificate for $50 using their own Government website. It’s really not that difficult.

            The fact you need to prove citizenship to register to vote is the least of their election problems.

            • boonhet@lemm.ee
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 day ago

              The fact you need to prove citizenship to register to vote is the least of their election problems.

              Is it? Potentially millions of citizens can’t vote. There’s exactly one party pushing for voter ID laws and it’s not the one that young people without driver’s licenses would likely vote for.

              • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 day ago

                Yes… the electoral college is a much bigger issue. Senators each represent vastly different amount of people, yet their voting power are equal.

                Two senators from California, representing 39 million people. Have no more say than two senators from Idaho representing 2 million people.

                So 39 million people get 2 votes in the senate. And 2 million people also get 2 votes in the senate.

                Democrats have had total power under Biden for 2 years. Did they make it any easier to vote? So you can say that only Republicans want “voter ID laws” but neither party gives a fuck about creating a functional system.

                If they cared at all. They’d make sure every citizen is automatically registered. And there wouldn’t even be a need for what they’re pushing now.

        • saigot@lemmy.ca
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          edit-2
          1 day ago

          According to this and this vouching can be a thing for both eu and Riksdag elections.

          40 dollars may not seem like a lot to you, but for a homeless person, that’s quite a lot and they font have foxed addresses for mailing either. Homeless people deserve to vote.

          • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 day ago

            Cool, never seen someone be vouch for, but as stated, that person vouching for you needs ID.

            I understand that it’s difficult for someone that is homeless to vote. The way we “solved” that here, is by doing everything we can to ensure that homeless people can be taken care of and have some kind of home, e.g. A room. And if all else fails, you can at least register with the government and they will make sure you have a place to receive mail. Meaning you will still get your voting card. You still need an ID, or have someone vouch for you, which could be difficult for a homeless person. But let’s be real. Voting is going to be the least of their problems.

            I agree. All citizens of legal age deserve to vote.

    • aesthelete@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      21
      ·
      2 days ago

      We make people pay to get an ID partially because it’s outsourced in many states to private companies.

    • mapmyhike@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      10
      ·
      2 days ago

      Imagine a woman being born a Smith. She marries a Jones and changes her name and license. Her birth certificate is still Smith. She will be required to have the same name on her BC and License. She will have to choose and change one of them at her expense.

      • Atomic@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 day ago

        I don’t quite follow the last part. “She will have to choose and change one of them at her expense”

        Obviously you need to update your license if you change your name.

        So she can update her BC to match her new name? Or is that impossible, thus making her unable to vote because of it.

    • Snail@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      2 days ago

      I think many states require you already to provide an ID to vote. ID/Drivers license aren’t free.

      I believe what they passed now, the SAVE Act, results in additional identification like a Birth Certificate or Passport. You have to prove citizenship in some manner. If you got married your last name won’t match your birth certificate, I’ve read of that being used as an example for reason to deny voting access.

      I personally feel this is a waste of time and money to implement and will just be used for voter suppression.

      Among the most notable changes outlined in the bill is the requirement to prove U.S. citizenship before registering to vote. Acceptable documents will include a birth certificate, U.S. passport, naturalization paperwork and certain versions of the Real ID that indicate citizenship.

      (https://www.npr.org/2024/10/11/nx-s1-5147732/voter-fraud-explainer)

  • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    173
    ·
    3 days ago

    IANAL but in my reading of the text of the bill the only way for a married woman that took her partner’s last name (that wasn’t in the military with her married name) to be able to vote if this becomes law is for them to spend at least $30 to get a USA Passport card. This would tick all the boxes the bill requires for these women:

    • Government ID
    • Shows citizenship status (by nature of it being a Passport)
    • Shows place of birth
    • Shows the married last name

    …or as I’m calling it:

    This is violation of the 24th Amendment banning poll Taxes.

    In this case, its a required fee married women must pay to be able to use their Constitutional guaranteed right to vote granted by the 19th Amendment. How is this not a poll tax by another name on married women?

    • Bytemeister@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      22
      ·
      edit-2
      2 days ago

      Consider this too. A woman has all of her ducks in a row with her married last name, and then divorces her POS republican husband. Now she needs to re-establish her identity all over again.

      For the ladies out there (or anyone getting married) keep your last name. My partner kept theirs, and it tickles them pink when the systemic chauvinism gets reversed and I get called by their last name.

      • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        7
        ·
        2 days ago

        My partner kept theirs, and it tickles them pink when the systemic chauvinism gets reversed and I get called by their last name.

        Same here. :)

        • Klear@sh.itjust.works
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 day ago

          They didn’t. People who know the wife assume her name will be the same and mistakenly call them the same.

    • A_norny_mousse@feddit.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      22
      ·
      edit-2
      1 day ago

      It always seems to me that this wouldn’t be such a big problem if the US had a working bureaucracy. I know $30 can be a significant sum (plus the pictures and other expenses) but it would be less of a hurdle if

      • relevant offices were within reasonable distance
      • they were sufficiently manned
      • all or part of the process could be done online
      • the government actually strives to make these processes as user-friendly as possible

      This is something Americans rarely talk about because it’s just assumed that everybody knows? Maybe somebody could explain to a EU dweller.

      edit: maybe I didn’t phrase this properly. I’m fully aware that preventing people from voting has a long “tradition” in the US; my question was more general I guess, and meant as an “in addition to the points already mentioned”.

      • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        2 days ago

        It always seems to me that this wouldn’t be such a big problem if the US had a working bureaucracy.

        As a European I have no expectation you’d had this nugget of US history, but I can fill in the gap. After slavery was outlawed in the entire USA in the 1850s (post civil war) racist bigots enacted laws preventing black Americans from using their newly gained Constitutional rights. There were lots of examples of this. In many of the southern state local leaders instituted poll taxes, which was a required fee that someone would have to pay before being able to vote, but these same laws gave exemptions to anyone whose grandfather had voted in a prior election. Because whites had a long history of voting they were exempt from these taxes. Because newly freed slaves whose grandfathers had not been allowed to vote hadn’t, the poll tax applied only to blacks. This disenfranchisement was deliberate on the part of white leaders with the intent to suppress black voting.

        This is obviously fairly fucked up way to run a country, so the people of the USA passed an amendment to the US Constitution banning poll taxes on everyone. This is the 24th Amendment (passed in 1964). Better late than never.

        So this new requirement on married women to pay at least $30 to get a passport card is a de facto poll tax which is outlawed by our Constitution (24th Amendment) also because it violates the 19th Amendment (the one that gave women the right to vote) as this law specifically targets married women (and not married men).

        • Log in | Sign up@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          2 days ago

          You’re absolutely correct, but Donald Trump dgaf about the constitution, at most he sees it as an inconvenience, something that other people have to do or something to wave like a flag, not something for him personally to actually obey. And the scotus has no intention whatsoever of holding him to it.

      • theparadox@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        9
        ·
        2 days ago

        Those in power absolutely know these things but making things more difficult is the actual point. Voter fraud is extremely rare. The justification is all bull shit.

        It’s ultimately about preventing people who might vote Democrat from voting. If it affects a ton of Republican voters that’s fine so long as it hits disproportionately more Democrats.

    • HubertManne@piefed.social
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      36
      ·
      2 days ago

      Worse getting the card is a major pita with the documentation and photo and having to mail it for first time.

    • thedruid@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      2 days ago

      here’s the issue.

      There’s been a tax on the second amendment for decades. Having to pay the fees for licensing, and the classes, means there’s a cost to exercise the right. Since people with no knowledge about the subject made sure to make it as expensive as possible to enjoy a right, the psychopaths in office now have precedent.

      one cannot tax one right and hand wave another. So . which do you think will fall first?

      • SqueakyBeaver
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        30
        ·
        2 days ago

        Is there an amendment that bans a tax on gun ownership?

        If not, then your argument has no standing

        • thedruid@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          2 days ago

          is there an Amendment that bans a tax on any right?

          if not then your argument has no standing.

          Point is, requiring people to pay to exercise rights is now enshrined. and we watched it happen.

          • SqueakyBeaver
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            33
            ·
            2 days ago

            The 24th amendment very specifically bans polling taxes

            The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax.

            • thedruid@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              2 days ago

              Miller v. US, 230 F2d 489 “The claim and exercise of a Constitutional right cannot be converted into a crime.”

              Shuttlesworth v. Birmingham 394 U.S. 147 (1969). “Persons faced with an unconstitutional licensing law which purports to require a license as a prerequisite to exercise of right… may ignore the law and engage with impunity in exercise of such right.”

              US Supreme Court in Hurtado v. California 110 US 516: “The state cannot diminish the rights of the people.”

              Sherar v. Cullen, 481 F2d 946(1973) “… there can be no sanction or penalty imposed upon one because of his exercise of constitutional rights”

              Also in Murdock: “a person cannot be compelled “to purchase, through a license fee or a license tax, the privilege freely granted by the constitution.”"

              • Resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                3
                ·
                1 day ago

                The claim and exercise of a Constitutional right cannot be converted into a crime.

                Irrelevant to this conversation.

                Persons faced with an unconstitutional licensing law which purports to require a license as a prerequisite to exercise of right… may ignore the law and engage with impunity in exercise of such right.

                By this logic, voter registration isn’t in the constitution, so you might be able to make the argument that it violates the 14th, 15th, 19th, and 24th amendments. Again, by this logic, regardless of if people have proper voting registration or any voting registration at all, they should still be able to vote anyways. The 4 Democrats mentioned in the above article pass a law against the above.

                The state cannot diminish the rights of the people.

                Tell that to the Republicans that introduced the above bill.

                there can be no sanction or penalty imposed upon one because of his exercise of constitutional rights

                What about the right to protest of UCLA students last April being violated because of false claims of anti-semitism, or the right to protest of Columbia students last March because of similar false claims? Did the US care about imposing sanctions or penalties on those people, or did they just detain and deport them instead?

                a person cannot be compelled “to purchase, through a license fee or a license tax, the privilege freely granted by the constitution.”

                Again, tell that to Republicans that introduced the above bill.

        • dickalan@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          2 days ago

          Holy fuck, simmer down now, and right back at you dip shit why don’t you try shutting the fuck up, you have absolutely nothing else add besides that to the conversation you’re pretty pathetic my guy

          • eric5949@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            24
            ·
            edit-2
            2 days ago

            Bruh I don’t give a single solitary fuck what you think. Poll taxes are bad and any justification of them or any other form of voter suppression deserves a round “fuck you.”

      • Auli@lemmy.ca
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        7
        ·
        2 days ago

        So which amendment bans taxes on gun ownership. Must have missed that one.

      • kreskin@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        13
        ·
        2 days ago

        Dont stop! I’m playing sad violin music to back you up! keep typing, think of the children who wont get to fire guns without your continued effort.

        • thedruid@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          2 days ago

          Jesus Christ what’s the matter with you! I didn’t think id see the same type of insulting children here as on reddit. What ever happened to civil discourse?

            • thedruid@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              2 days ago

              Umm. I don’t own a modern firearm

              Don’t be so antagonistic. No one’s asking for sympathy. Why so angry?

              • Goodmorningsunshine@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                2 days ago

                Lol up and down this thread crying about gun taxes. “Why so angry?” You’re that kind of redditor lol. I’d say go back, but I’ll bet you’re one of the ones that actually earned your ban.

                • thedruid@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  2
                  ·
                  2 days ago

                  Um. You ok ? What have I said to offend you so? Did I call you a name or something?

                  I’m a bit confused as to why you won’t just have a civil discussion?

          • kreskin@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            edit-2
            11 hours ago

            ( sad violin music intensifies, with frett pounding added to simulate bullet firing noises )

            Its about time someone spoke up for pew-pew owners rights. Why do the anti school shooting folks get all the press?

            How dare everyone not consider my gawd-given personal rights to mass casualty tools.

            /s

      • webadict@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        10
        ·
        2 days ago

        How does the 2nd amendment stop taxes on guns?

        You’re being an idiot, and you should shut up.

        • thedruid@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          2 days ago

          what are you talking about? No one said that. the gun itself isn’t the question.

          learn how to read

          • webadict@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            5
            ·
            2 days ago

            Which part of the 2nd amendment bans any taxes?

            You moved the goalposts, but you moved them to an even easier way to make you look like a loser. Stop posting.

      • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        edit-2
        2 days ago

        There’s been a tax on the second amendment for decades. Having to pay the fees for licensing, and the classes, means there’s a cost to exercise the right.

        I looked at the receipt for a recent gun purchase, a rifle, and there are zero taxes or fees on it except sales tax which applies to nearly all items (such as video games or automobiles) for sale. There were no required licenses or classes to purchase or own this firearm.

        • thedruid@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          2 days ago

          in your state. Where I am there are requirements for everything. from buying ammo to getting separate licenses for long guns and pistols.

          the weapon itself is not what I’m talking about. of course that’s taxable.

          • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            7
            ·
            2 days ago

            So your beef is with a State (or municipal) government. That isn’t quite the same as a restriction at the Federal level that we’re discussing here.

            • thedruid@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              2 days ago

              It is though. The constitution is the law and it does give supremacy to the feds. Meaning a state or municipal law gives way to federal laws when there are none.

              • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                2 days ago

                Again, I think this is a tangent, but even you admit that you are able to buy a gun and own in with these taxes in place. Your 2nd Amendment right is clearly intact. There’s no Constitutional right protecting gun ownership from taxation. Where that isn’t the case with voting. The 24th Amendment protects your right to vote without any fee. Gun ownership has no corresponding Constitutional protection.

                • thedruid@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  2 days ago

                  No. In my state you cannot unless you pay for the classes , fingerprinting and background checks , etc…

                  Do not get me wrong I am for classes , and background checks.

                  I don’t believe those should cost the prospective owner though.

                  Now if there was no cost and those were required, I wouldn’t say a word. I hope my point is a bit clearer

      • unphazed@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        2 days ago

        I have multiple guns. Never paid for a class, don’t need a license. Only cost was in the guns and ammo. Now, I WAS taught at an early age how to handle guns safely, and am damn near brainwashed to handle them thusly (I never leave a bullet in chamber and I still clear my weapons every time I even touch them.) That said, I do need to stop being a lazy ass and finish building my ak47 instead of leaving it half assembled. Still needs a couple of American parts and I will not risk being dinged with an illegally built firearm.

      • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        15
        ·
        2 days ago

        They could do that but besides still being shitty, it may not satisfy the 19th Amendment. The text of the Amendment read:

        • The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

        source

        Making married women jump through the arduous hoops of obtaining a passport card (and indirect costs associated with it such as postage and photography costs) could still be possibly considered “abridged” in violation of this Constitutional Amendment. This is especially true when this new bill effectively singles out married women. Married men don’t have to do any of this so it could also still be a violation on the “on account of sex” portion of the Amendment.

      • jumjummy@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        2 days ago

        How about making Bubba from bumble-fuck Arkansas have to drive to some major city to register for his right to vote?

        See how that can be seen as an undue burden on voting?

  • Archangel@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    175
    ·
    3 days ago

    I love how they never once mention in the article that Republicans wrote the bill, proposed it, and 100% of them voted in favor of it.

    But, despite all that…the headline still reads, “Democrats passed it”.

    • dohpaz42@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      155
      ·
      3 days ago

      Because we expect that from Republicans. It’s the democrats defecting that is the worrisome part.

    • Libra00@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      92
      ·
      3 days ago

      The fact that Republicans want to take away peoples’ ability to vote isn’t really news, but the fact that any Democrats supported it is.

      • EmpireInDecay@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        2 days ago

        the fact that any Democrats supported it is

        No one paying attention would have expected anything different. Its been 13 years since the VRA was struck down and democrats have done nothing meaningful, other than fundraise, off protecting voting rights. Doing nothing is worse than taking rights.

    • Randomgal@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 day ago

      I was thinking the same. Like what? 6 dudes didn’t pass the bill, half of your representatives did.

    • metaldream@sopuli.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      edit-2
      2 days ago

      When are you doing to hold these fucking pro-Trump Democrats accountable? So such of the constant whining and crying every time the Democrats are called out on their bullshit.

      • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost@lemmy.dbzer0.com
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 day ago

        They never will. They will defend them because even when they vote in agreement with stripping the rights of Americans because of Trump, they’re on the blue team, so it’s always valid and justified.

      • Archangel@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        2 days ago

        I’m fine calling out the 2% of Democrats that vote against their own constituents interests. But what I find hilarious, is the total lack of focus on the fact that 100% of Republicans are behind this.

        This is what Chomsky was talking about when he wrote manufacturing consent. The framing here is massively deceptive, to the point of being completely backwards…and folks just eat it up this way. They swallow this narrative whole, and spit it back up for others to swallow.

      • timbuck2themoon@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        2 days ago

        What’s Anyone doing to hold Republicans accountable?

        The headline should read 216 Republicans ensured passage of this bill.

        My God, part of everything we deal with these days is no one holds Republicans accountable. Media, voters, commenters, etc. Maybe try that for once instead of focusing on 4 Democrats who DON’T MATTER.

    • Tinidril@midwest.social
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      24
      ·
      3 days ago

      Try to primary them and see how fast the Democratic establishment is to come to their defense. “Democrats” is fair. Not all Democrats, but the party establishment is rotten.

      • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        3 days ago

        Try to primary them and see how fast the Democratic establishment is to come to their defense

        Who fucking cares what the establishment says. The nominees is whoever won the primary vote.

        • Tinidril@midwest.social
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          11
          ·
          2 days ago

          Which, far too often, is whomever has the most money. The Democratic establishment and AIPAC have successfully flooded progressives out in several races. It’s not that we can’t win, but it’s clear that the party is against us, which was my point. It’s not just a handful of shitty Democrats we need to replace.

          • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            2 days ago

            The Democratic establishment and AIPAC have successfully flooded progressives out in several races

            At the end of the day, those progressives lost because the voters went the other way. Either there are enough progressive voters in a district or there aren’t. If there are, then they just need to go out and vote and then the money and PACs can get fucked.

            • Tinidril@midwest.social
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              8
              ·
              2 days ago

              Thanks for explaining how voting works but ignoring the impact of money is lunacy. There aren’t enough “progressive voters” in any district in the country to win an election. The same can be said about conservative, libertarian, socialist, or MAGA voters. The vast majority of voters are not policy wonks and, if they even claim a political philosophy, they sure can’t explain it.

    • EmpireInDecay@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      13
      ·
      2 days ago

      Republicans tell us who they are, so theres no need to point out what theyve already told us. Democrats however always claim to hold the high ground as if they are not collaborators in regressive legislation.

      • Archangel@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        2 days ago

        So the trick to getting away with doing shit like this is to just be open about it? Weird. If that was the case, then why not give these Democrats a pass, as well? They aren’t exactly hiding it either.

        Or are you just getting these four mixed up with the 200 others that didn’t support this legislation?

        • EmpireInDecay@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          2 days ago

          These are the Democrats that will replace Manchin and Semina as the rotating villains once they come back into power.

          ‘We tried, but look what Cuellar did’

      • spamfajitas@lemmy.dbzer0.com
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        2 days ago

        It really shouldn’t be news, but remember…there are most likely a lot of morons out there who would still be shocked to hear about it. The ones who don’t like to talk or read about politics, the uninformed voter. These are Americans we’re talking about.

        • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          4
          ·
          2 days ago

          Those people aren’t on Lemmy and they aren’t reading New Republic articles.

          The morons who would be shocked by this news are other Republicans that only consume Republican news sources.

      • Walican132@lemmy.today
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        ·
        3 days ago

        Yep she’s a piece of shit and it’s pissing me off. I get the alternative would have been voting the same but now I have disappointment as well.

      • Zaktor@sopuli.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        11
        ·
        3 days ago

        Yeah, they all suck. Ed Case is a world class piece of shit as he’s representing urban Honolulu, in a SOLIDLY blue district.

        • Ledericas@lemm.ee
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          2 days ago

          following in TULSI footsteps, probably wants a deal with the gop down the line.

    • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      2 days ago

      This is why democrats worked so hard to keep coathager cuellar in office. They need people like him to vote how they want.

  • Ledericas@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    24
    ·
    2 days ago

    im not surprised these DINOs are here, theres like 10 in then senate and probably just as many in the house.