I watched a video today talking about common talking points concerning how „the left has failed men“
I would argue F.D argues that while this is often cited as a critique on how „the Left“ is losing young men to right grifters like Tate, Peterson, etc.
He eventually argues that these misogynistic forces are not new and have only been thriving because of economic problems (capitalism yaaay) faced in the present.
As I really like this community I thought I give it a shot to post something. If I should try to give a broader summary of the video please feel free to tell me.
Thanks for reading :)
In another comment in this thread I list some of the specific problems of boys and young men with good leftist solutions.
Sure young men join the left. I wouldn’t dismiss this as “edgyness” as I said their brains aren’t fully developed and that’s just how they express themselves at that stage of development. But then they’re generally recruited as “allies” rather than as champions of their own leftist causes.
We definitely haven’t captured enough leftist men and pointed them to fight their own fights. That’s the whole concept of the left. Everyone fights the patriarchy in the ways they need, and we help eachother’s causes as allies. Only in all of our efforts combined do we destroy the structures that harm us all. What keeps a demographic here imo is having their own fights to fight. I think that’s what’s not addressed, the pipeline to channel curious dejected young boys and point them to their own leftist struggles while learning about the struggles of others isn’t as well developed as other pipelines. I think this is because it’s only in the last few decades that the left has had more to offer than the right for this demographic. To me that’s a call to work on the pipeline not to shrug and dismiss the situation.
Also I think you dismiss too quickly what the right has to offer women and minorities. Yes they openly hate them, but they offer them their own hierarchies under which to hate and control others. That’s why the right is so attractive to minorities such as immigrants who are used to thriving in the privileges offered to them in these structures. That’s why it’s so attractive to many older women who want power in local community social and political spheres. Although this is how their participation looks like in these structures, they usually see it as “improving societal norms” and “preventing moral decay and corruption of the youth”. This is important because people need to feel like the good guys. I’m not saying these people are better off under the right. I think EVERYONE is better off with the left. But there is a lack of understanding of what the right has to offer and why it’s attractive to people. It’s easier to tailor our message when we empathize with people and cater the message based on that.
Edit: I would also add being good allies to young men and boys fighting the leftist fight. Sometimes we tend to fear that helping them means somehow there will be less for everyone else, but it’s not a zero sum game. We destroy the patriarchy by dismantling it where it hurts us and by being a good ally to all of those who seek to dismantle it where it hurts them.
If you don’t engage with what I write, than there is little point in this conversation for me.
Just want to point out, you confuse leftism and feminism and you spend to much time debatelording online, afk most people just want to live their life and not fight the system.
My comment was too long as is. There are like 20 comments in this thread I didn’t think I was asking for a lot to point you to a list.
I got to “the patriarchy” through leftism not feminism. When I say patriarchy I mean hierarchal structures of oppression. I spent a long time working against hierarchal structures and thinking before I realized that when feminists say “the patriarchy” they refer specifically to the primary hierarchal structure of oppression that has been operating for the last few centuries in the western world and in other parts. Since it’s more specific and precise than “the primary hierarchal structure of oppression that has been operating for the last few centuries in the western world and in other parts” I use it. It also helps me understand and connect to feminism better. I find as a man, it’s easy to feel alienated with certain rhetoric lately so this helps counter that.
I feel like I responded directly to your question though:
We don’t have a good pipeline for young men to get from curious to fighting for their rights through leftism
We’re not good allies to young men who fight for leftist ideology.
You’re right in your final point, most people just want to live their lives. When we show them the things that help them are on the left they’ll vote left. The ones who want to fight will be the ones fighting.
No you still didn’t answer what aspects for young men, the left does not cover?
Also do you have any real life experience with leftist spaces? I happen to work with visuals and so I’m involved in with the alternative scene quite a bit. Never been alienated as a dude or see other guys being alienated for being a man. There is also no shortage of guys there.
Kudos to you for contributing! No, I’ve never felt out of place in leftist spaces, but I know many young men are alienated by what they see of “loud” leftist ideology, lack of support online etc…
As for “aspects” I believe ideologically the left has the best answers for men. I think it’s more the logistical aspects I described in previous posts we don’t cover well/enough.
So how does the left has the answers for men despite not even asking the questions?
Or maybe of what they see, by how right wing is portraying the leftist ideology? Lack of support online, what do you even mean?