This is a weird meme. The Democrats actively tried to court suburban white voters and other traditionally right-Leaning demographics. They tried to peel Republicans off. The democrats never offered socialists a cup labeled “liberalism”, they offered “moderate republicans” a cup labeled “Border Control and Bush era political icons” and they said “Bro. I already told you I will only ever vote for Republicans”.
need this comment pinned to the top of .world for the next months
WHeRe iS tHe leFt uNiTy
Buried with all of the socialists and unions liberals have betrayed.
If you go further Left
Marxist-Leninists: “WhERe iS tHe leFt uNiTy?”
Buried with all the Anarchists and Trotskyists cold bloodedly murdered by Lenin and Stalin.
“Further” left is demonstrably incorrect on account of all the genocide, union busting, and heirarchy enforcement they did, but otherwise yes, also true.
Fixed that second panel because there isn’t even a pretense of respect
“I like center-left policies”
“I like my policies further to the left”
“Aight let’s fight and make sure as few people as possible vote”
Meanwhile, the conservatives are laughing all the way to the bank.
Yeah, the Bush/Gore race ended so poorly we never got a Democratic candidate that was left of center again.
That started with Bill Clinton who intentionally and very openly ran towards the right. Al Gore was more of the same.
It’s good to see the old socialism vs liberalism appear again after the US-election. Cycles are a bit out of order lately.
The third panel should say “I prefer Trump to Harris”
Fucking too true.
Argued till I was blue in the face right here on Lemmy about sitting out and voting third party. The entire time I was thinking those who are fine with Trump must either be stupid or privileged so as not to be as affected by his bullshit.
You’ll be blue in the face 'til the end of time, 'cuz you’re still trying to blame the electorate for the failures of the party. Your conception of how voting works is so backwards you think that the party is owed the allegiance of the people rather than the people being owed the faithful representation of their interests regardless of who is in power.
“The Democrats can’t fail, they can only be failed!” That’s you. That’s what you sound like.
And I wish I had a million dollars. It’s just not reality.
People should be smart enough to work backward from a foregone conclusion: We’re getting the Dem or Rep nominee. Picking the best of your two options is logical. Anything else is wishing. Grow up.
There’s no “wishing” going on here. I’m explaining how your concept of voting has cause and effect reversed and you’re pretending that it’s “wishes” instead of basic political literacy.
People should be smart enough to work backward from a foregone conclusion: We’re getting the Dem or Rep nominee.
Not if the voters vote for someone else. You’re only assuming that the two major parties are inevitable because you’re drinking their kool-aid.
If they can’t convince people to vote for them then they lose. It’s on them to convince us, but you’ve already decided that they don’t need to because they’re owed your vote. You have deliberately rejected your civic duty to the nation in favor of blind obedience to the party just like Washington warned us about.
Grow up.
You first.
Damn that’s crazy because here’s me before the election telling the future. How in the world did I perform this feat? Do I have amazing powers of precognition?
Again, you’re telling us what you’d wish would happen. I was telling them what would happen.
What’s more is this is a concept that both the GOP and their voters understand. It’s why the GOP funds campaigns like Stein and gets others like RFK Jr. to bow out. Everyone who doesn’t understand this should be deeply embarrassed to misunderstand something about the US election system that Donald fucking Trump understands. And he dumb as shit.
See you in 4 years when the next president is the Dem or Rep nominee. *holds hands at temples, activating powers of foresight*
Damn that’s crazy because here’s me before the election telling the future. How in the world did I perform this feat? Do I have amazing powers of precognition?
Did you ever write to your congressional representatives like they suggested?
Again, you’re telling us what you’d wish would happen. I was telling them what would happen.
If the result was inevitable then the voters have no agency and are in no way responsible for the outcome.
What’s more is this is a concept that both the GOP and their voters understand.
You’re giving the most heavilly propagandized segment of the most heavily propagandized country on earth a lot of credit when they can’t even seem to understand that a tarrif is a tax on imports.
It’s why the GOP funds campaigns like Stein and gets others like RFK Jr. to bow out.
You mean like how the Democrats promoted Trump thinking that he’d be an easy win for Hillary?
Did you ever write to your congressional representatives like they suggested?
No, because I don’t support a weapons ban. That’s beside the point.
If the result was inevitable then the voters have no agency and are in no way responsible for the outcome.
I think you’re smart enough to know how a FPTP voting system works. We had 2 real options. Voters have agency as to which one of the two are elected. Stop pretending like you don’t understand how this works.
You’re giving the most heavily propagandized segment of the most heavily propagandized country on earth a lot of credit when they can’t even seem to understand that a tarrif is a tax on imports.
How sad is it then that this group understands this better than you pretend to?
You mean like how the Democrats promoted Trump thinking that he’d be an easy win for Hillary?
No, it would be like funding a third party candidate that is close to Trump with the express purpose of peeling votes off Trump.
If you couldn’t see that one of the two parties would end up in power then you are the problem.
If you think that what happened before must inevitably happen again then you are the problem. The major parties only win because they have people like you convinced that they are the only option.
So how did voting third party work for you? Did they win?
I voted for Harris, how did that work for me? Did she win?
Wow, if only you’d voted for the Greens they would have won
Genuinely clueless and wanting to understand here
What’s the difference between liberalism and leftism? My understanding of them is very nebulous and there’s a lot of overlap
Liberalism is the ideology of capitalism.
In the US, socialism has historically been shunned and not represented in the political sphere, to the point that the right started using “liberal” derisively and associated the term with socialism. Internationally, the term retains more of its original meaning, for example, in the UK the “Liberal Democrats,” are more like libertarians.
Liberals are generally conservative, meaning they support the status quo or gradual change. US “conservatives” are sometimes more accurately called reactionaries or regressives, because they don’t just want to preserve the status quo but to actively roll back progress that has already been made.
Because leftism is a very broad term, it’s difficult to define exactly what leftists believe in an uncontroversial way, but generally speaking leftists support radical change away from capitalism.
I wouldn’t necessarily say that the left right spectrum is tied to economic views only, while economics are usually part of a political view judging only by that is a bit one dimensional (non us perspective)
Personally, I don’t draw a distinction between economic and social issues, because solidarity between oppressed groups is vital for building collective power necessary to confront capitalism economically and laws that make people more vulnerable also affect us economically. But admittedly there are people who do view them as separate issues.
Liberalism is also quite a broad term, which on its own can only really be said to constitute a belief in “equal rights for everyone including the right to private property”. The Liberal Democrats, for example, are so-called because they were formed from the merger of the (classically liberal) Liberal Party, and the Social Democratic Party. They are more like libertarians in the sense that they were broadly pro-market but less authoritarian than the tories, but their policy platform has always been more like something that would be described as social liberalism.
In my experience, the word liberal is generally not used so much in UK politics (outside of the name of the Lib Dems), but if someone self-described themselves as a liberal, I think it would be generally understood as socially liberal rather than libertarian.
The cause of the confusion:
Liberalism is the political project which gave us the 18th century liberal revolutions of for instance, the US and France. It centers invidivual freedoms like free speech, association, and the right to own and use private property without interference from the government. It can be seen as a reaction by the land owning middle classes of the 17th and 18th centuries to the power of divine right monarchs, and is the founding principal of both the Democratic and Republican parties. It centralizes human rationality and debate of ideas as means of finding true paths to the future.
Leftism is an umbrella term which holds a few groups in it (Most notably Social democrats, Communist Socialist, and Communist Anarchist ideologies). It can be traced back through history to many times and places, but modern forms of it originate in the utopian socialism of post-revolution France. Leftism promotes the primacy of human well being and equality (or at least more equally distributed material wealth) over property rights. Generally this takes the form of support for the abolition of class society (owner class vs worker class), belief in worker-centered policy, trade unionism, worker cooperativity, and internationalism… but again, it is a big umbrella, and there is a lot of deviation from this formula. In place of rationalism and debate of ideas, Leftism generally centers material conditions and material outcomes of policy.
Liberalism is a moral philosophy based on individual rights, liberty and equality - this is universally agreed apon terminology almost everywhere apart from here on Lemmy. Here for some reason people keep referring to classical capitalism as liberals like it’s a historical discussion about the economic system of the 16th-18th centuries. We should really be using neoliberalism or libertarianism instead now days, because those are new words that evolved specifically to reduce confusion and refer to similar economic ideas but in modern context.
Here you go: https://youtu.be/33p-8QHZpzY
liberals tend to be democrats and support democrat views. leftists want something better and tend to vote democratic as there’s not really a better option. liberals tend to be center, even center right, while leftists are actually on the left
It depends on the person. For some liberalism is capitalism and leftism is socialism. The real cut is for some any capitalism is liberalism and any socialism is communist. So folks who want managed capitalism (regulations) for like selling crap but want social safety nets (government run programs) for necessary things like education and healthcare. Whelp one side says they are way right liberalists (classical) capitalist facists and the other says they are way left radical communist facists. Those who embrace the centerism (not very central now due to the overton window) disagree but are usually willing to give one way or another to get close to what they want. In the us they are called democrats (sorta, again, overton window).
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