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- cross-posted to:
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So long as they’re not moving on to a new one, good. Religion is a plague on human society. We don’t need it holding us back.
Depends on the religion. But as a whole, what we thing of “religions”, are definitely a net negative with our knowledge of the world. We no longer need to rely on superstition to survive.
Some religions are more a way of life rather than a structured creator being system with strict rules and exclusionary politics. Religions like Christianity/Judaism/Islam are quite different from Shinto or Buddhism for instance.
There’s still some toxicity around Buddhism at least. Living in SEA I now know several people who are really turned off by the practices and beliefs of their family’s religion, Buddhism, from the way all troubles are explained away as karma to neurodiversity and Learning Differences being hidden because that would mean that person did something bad in their past life.
I used to think Buddhism specifically was the “good” religion that’s more like philosophy, but spending more time with people who grew up deep in Buddhism has made me see there’s really more to the community and it’s beliefs and practices than I thought.
Like all religion, it can be messed up and carried on.
Sort of like when the winter solstice turned into “dead and buried three days, then rose again” and a bunch of zombie religions are still around.
That’s for Spring (rebirth, Easter), not Winter.
Christmas is for Winter, it celebrates the birth of Jesus Christ. It came from Saturnalia, probably the most important holiday of Roman society.
No. I mean, first of all let’s start with the fact that both Winter solstice and Spring Equinox were so-called pagan holidays that Christianty subsumed. Right? Let’s start there.
Then let’s understand that those so-called pagan holidays were traditions based on earlier - much earlier - observances. And those observances were astronomical in origin.
The winter solstice is when the sun stops moving for three days - it rises in the same location whereas all the time before that it had been moving slightly every day.
After those three days it starts moving back. That’s the birth. Life is born again. We’re going to make it around the sun another time. That sort of thing.
Spring / Vernal equinox is when we make sure everyone has progeny. Rabbits. Flowers. Eggs. Chrisitanity decided to appropriate this one to mark Jesus’ ascent into heaven. Fine. But irrelevant. Because it has nothing to do with life on earth - very literally, it’s about leaving earth and going to heaven.
That’s why there’s such a disconnect about crucifixion and rabbits and eggs. They don’t have anything to do with each other because the church yoinked a pagan tradition to keep people from celebrating it outside the church.
That makes a lot of sense. Until you consider that around Winter solstice, Christians don’t celebrate the resurrection, yhey celebrate the birth. How do you explain that disconnect?
This explains some of the reasoning, although because it was 350 CE they can’t confirm anything with 100% certainty. Such is history.
What is certain to anyone who has studied it even a little bit is that the winter solstice was near-universally recognized by all cultures prior to the common era.
December 25 is very often the solstice, or close enough to it that it was selected by some as the annual celebration for their deity of choice. As the article notes, in Rome that was the birthday of Sol Invictus. It’s also the birthday of Saturn, Mithras, and depending on whether you believe some fourth-century Christian authors, also Horus.
So Pope Julius “chose” - note that no one is in any doubt the date was selected, it wasn’t like Jesus’ old birthday cards were found and everyone knew that was his actual birthday - Pope Julius chose Dec 25 as the annual celebration day for Jesus. That became known as his birthday. But it wasn’t. What it WAS was the winter solstice.
Its a problem with all of them. How can any christians be non pacifist when direct from christs mouth was the very direct command:
“Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also. And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.”
I have had discussion and its ludicrous the other parts they engage in mental gymnastics to work around it. Its the same with the 4 noble truths and the 8 fold way. Its pretty obvious its about looking inward and delving into anyone elses life except to help them would be feeding into desire. Sihks have this whole thing about goofy practices of other religions and then have their own goofy practices. No idea how jainism gets corrupted or other faiths off the top of my head but im sure they are there.
There’s a lot of Buddhist teachings I agree with but do we really need all the supernatural baggage to teach people to be less materialistic and to be kind to each other?
Just because they aren’t theist doesn’t mean they don’t have horrible backwards teachings. Most people are good without religion. Religion creates situations where otherwise good people do evil, because they’re told it is actually good.
Most people are not good without religion, they are good because of civilization. If society breaks down, everyone is going to get real mean, real quick.
The most evil people in Nazi Germany were generally anti-religious.
Hard disagree. Yes, when people are desperate they’re capable of horrible things, but most people won’t shoot a home intruder even if they went through the process of purchasing a gun for home defence and have someone break in. Everyone is capable of great evil, but they are not evil. Most people will choose to cooperate if they can.
Also, I’d say the most evil Nazis were religious. Their religion was Nazism though. They had a belief (that they were told was scientific, but wasn’t) that some people were better than others, and some groups actively needed to be removed to make the rest of us better in the future. It’s the same beliefs religions create, and it was also based in faith, just not of a god.
Even with civilisation or society, there’s always been a subset of people looking to exploit whatever facet of existence they can, whether it be religion, politics, crimes of opportunity, weaknesses in social systems, or even the justice systems that are supposedly meant to deal with those flaws.
And to add even more complexity, other people who aren’t pieces of shit looking to exploit others form emotional attachments to those who are and are fooled by their lies and will defend them. Others don’t have attachments but see parallels to themselves and worry that attempts to deal with the problematic ones will result in the same treatment being applied to them (and aren’t necessarily wrong because even justice trying to act in good faith can get it wrong).
It’s all a complex web of power struggles and religion is just one set of stands.
The most evil people in Nazi Germany were generally anti-religious.
Unless you’re excluding old Adolf from that list (which would be both interesting and telling), this is not correct. A lot of people forget about him though.
Just sounds like the usual “no true Christ-man” being resurrected whenever there’s some atrocity for the church to slink away from once it becomes unpopular.
Be careful that anti-theism may e as harmful as any fundamentalist religion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3D4tMVaO7k
What I think is not that we should “abolish” religion (granted that I know you did not propose that. I’m just extrapolating from “religion is a plague”)
I think we should move to exploring different religions without holding any of them as superior to the other, or at least not judging before reading a it more on your own accord and desire.
Someone pointed about issues on buddhism, which are true issues.
But eastern religions take from buddhism, taoism and confucionism religions and it is not uncommon to take a few different takes from each one of these as one goes in their own studies.
Same way, I think the rise of pagan religions would be useful to have the idea of being exposed to different concepts of religious ideas
Or similarly, different philosophical ideas, like reading from plato, but also from hume, but also from descartes, but also from…
As long as one doesn’t stay stagnant on the same philosophical pool, there is no harm browsing (with sufficient care) other ideas.
“
MoneyReligion is the root of all evil.”
Christianity is basically just a pedophile ring at this point
That’s a bit unfair to the people who are in just for the homophobia
Or trans phobia
And they need your money!
Kirsten Lesage, Kelsey Jo Starr, and William Miner titled this erroneously. The title should be:
#Children are learning cults are bad, and their parents tried to indoctrinate them against their will
Whats funny is when they leave their childhood one and go to another. The new one seems better because they don’t know enough about it.
Some do, some don’t. Most ex-mormons like myself don’t end up going to another religion. We already have a community of like-minded people on the outside.
Just like they leave behind their other imaginary friends
Religion is for three kinds of people:
Fools
Liars
Disobedient children with fools or liars as parents
Tolerance of religion is a paradox as every religion is intolerant of other religions.
Yes Buddhism too.
Respect is earned. Trust is earned.
Religion deserves neither.
Not every religion is intolerant of other religions.
Greetings fellow lemming I’m new here and hope we can have a productive discussion.
Please allow me to elucidate my perspective on this question: are all religions intolerant?
I say yes, let me explain.
Many have told me about “their god” and I take their word for it. I believe everything everyone has told me about “their god”. Powerful, all knowing, usually vindictive, often horny for human girls, etc.
Resultantly I believe in all of “their gods”.
And I drew a conclusion about that guy.
I think “god” is a piece of shit unworthy of praise and we should seek to destroy and erase it. Those who worship it are dangerous and not to be trusted. At best they need psychiatric care, likely many of them should be incarcerated. The link between “piety” and “skeletons in the closet” is strong.
I hate god and have no respect for god-fearing people and no tolerance for their “beliefs”
Which supernatural make-believe system (read: religion ) is tolerant of my supernatural make-believe system?
Please don’t mistake my anger at religions as anger at you.
Cheers mate
I agree, fuck all religions
Many have told me about “their god” and I take their word for it.
Resultantly I believe in all of “their gods”.
I’m following so far
And I drew a conclusion about that guy.
What do you mean “that guy”. I thought we just established these are multiple guys?
I think “god” is a piece of shit unworthy of praise and we should seek to destroy and erase it.
What do you mean “it”? Don’t you mean “them”?
I hate god and have no respect for god-fearing people and no tolerance for their “beliefs”
Why are you talking about a singular God here? It reads like you’re blaming Yahweh for Zeus’ sexual behaviour and you’re blaming Hanuman for the Great Flood.
These aren’t the same character. Each “God” claim needs to be evaluated separately.
For example why do you hate Persephene so much? Why is she a piece of shit. You claim to believe in her right Your reasons shouldn’t include examples from the Bible.
Which supernatural make-believe system (read: religion ) is tolerant of my supernatural make-believe system?
You might find company among the Satanic Temple or other Satanists.
You said “Buddhism” was ruled out but you didn’t actually clarify so until you present your reasoning I’d say Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism and Jainism all lacking God’s are partially compatible.
I mean to be fair there’s not going to be a great answer because this isn’t a real question but a gotcha. And I say that as an atheist.
You obviously don’t actually believe in all the gods, your earlier language shows you haven’t thought enough about what that means and force them all into the same one God.
The Hittites believed in “all the gods” and absorbed every new God of neighbors they conquered. But they truly believed in these gods, not as a gotcha question but they really believed in the power of these entities.
Regardless of personal moral views on their behavior, outwardly taunting that being seems silly in light of genuine faith.
deleted by creator
Not me. I was born a snake handler and I’ll die a snake handler.
The thing I notice is there’s not really a good substitute for talking about the big questions yet.
I mean, I’m not missing any religion, but practically there was an hour or so a week dedicated specifically to thinking and talking about life from a non-materialistic perspective, and I think a lot of people now just - never do.
Isn’t that what we do on lemmy?
Not really! I mean like - why does life exist? Is there any relevance in the idea of reincarnation? Does time exist outside of us? What is “good works”?
Someone hold forth on a personal story that exemplifies something good.
You’d think we have enough stoners to get something like that going, but not really. And the esoterica side of Lemmy is very tiny and not well-attended.
tbh I think tumblr’s got more of a corner on that kind of work/vibe.
Not that Lemmy can’t or won’t become that but at the moment it’s more like alternate reality reddit which atm is just fine for most people.
Is there any relevance in the idea of reincarnation?
Of course. In Theravāda Buddhism you will find a highly literal interpretation as well as a more general, “spiritual” interpretation.
In a literal, mechanical, scientific sense, the cells in your body are constantly dying and being replaced using nutrients in the food you eat. The universe is moving through you. You are parts of every other organism that has existed on earth. You are parts of every human on earth. Every other human is parts of every other human on earth. What you do to others is done to yourself. Be kind to people.
I did, then returned but… Not to the hateful, exclusionary version taught by parentals.
I hope it isn’t like the similarly named subreddit where the moderator was against calling Elon’s salute for what it was.
I’ll be honest and a bit jaded, These “uplifting” comunities do feel a bit like the “this is fine” meme (https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/this-is-fine)
Not that I am against uplifting news. I’m just cautious because I’ve seen a fair share of nazi dogwhistle associated with this idea.
If I were to guess why its probably because religious communities always tend to lean into hateful rhetoric against “others”.
People realize the closer you are to religion the further from God you feel as you couldn’t believe that judgement of other humans is wise from an all knowing being if it exists.
Then the internet of course gives so many alternate sane opinions for consumption and exposure readily at your fingertips.
Ex-Roman Catholic here. I was never particularly devout but this is what drove me away from the church once and for all. I have never seen people preach about God’s love with so much hate in their hearts.
Religion has nothing to do with God, even if you believed God exists, then since God is omnipresent you can have a relationship with God from anywhere. Why would you need to gather with a group of people and have middle men priest who claim to speak on behalf of God. Religions are about power, control, elitism and us vs them tribalism. If there was a god, he’d be disgusted by the barbaric things done by religious people in his name.
Religion is not necessarily the same as religious institutions. Christianity is quite an outlier with its heavy centralization in the case of Catholicism, but there is many denominations of Christianity that are not adhering to a centralized institution.
Not enough people leaving the very worst religion of all.
I would argue that the antireligious sentiments of “the left” and some liberals is a part of their civil religion.
I believed in Santa longer than I believed in God. I don’t know how that happened.
Santa was more believable.
Good
