The Supreme Court has long held that “a pardon cannot stop” courts from punishing cases of civil contempt. And while the marshals have traditionally enforced civil contempt orders, the courts have the power to deputize others to step in if they refuse to do so.
This authority is recognized in an obscure provision of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, which govern proceedings in federal trial courts. Rule 4.1 specifies how certain types of “process” — the legal term for orders that command someone to appear in court — are to be served on the party to which they are directed. The rule begins in section (a) by instructing that, as a general matter, process “must be served by a United States marshal or deputy marshal or by a person specially appointed for that purpose.”
The next section, Rule 4.1(b), is entitled, “Enforcing Orders: Committing for Civil Contempt.” It sets some geographical limits for where “[a]n order committing a person for civil contempt of a decree or injunction” may be served based on the federal vs. state nature of the underlying lawsuit. But it does not say who may enforce such an order, and it never modifies the general rule that process may be served by a marshal, deputy marshal or person specially appointed for that purpose. Thus, by its plain terms, Rule 4.1 contemplates that the court may appoint individuals other than the marshals to enforce civil contempt orders.
Man I completely forgot about the Court’s ability to deputize.
Something tells me that it was intended that I forget that.
And when the courts go rogue they can deputize … Anyone. Like Andrew Tate, or elon.
Monkey paw urges caution
Fuck that. That monkey paw bullshit is how the courts were stacked in the first place… Because Democrats are too busy pretending to be the adults in the room to recognize the game has changed
We have to use the tools we’re given, or we hand a self described King all power
Not to mention, if this was a tool MAGA had use of, they’d use it with or without precedent
Being pragmatic and realistic is not all sunshine and lollipops. Sometimes it is. These days the sun hates us and the lollipops are 100%plastic.
You already have a king. You had one when his followers declared him god king emperor. It.wasn’t defeatist to try to sway people against him by warning of what the inevitable outcomem of.his reelection. Was it? Warning is not complying
It is warning.
J
F
CThe tools are not within the scope of the rules of the game.
Relying on rules while the bad guys relied on the good guys adhering to decorum is why we are here.
The institutions are being destroyed, their function and.power coalesced.
Do not hope an abstract concept of laws and justice will bring salvation or that they are finished perverting every noble intent and.safety mechanism.
I don’t know why you’re arguing with me.
Seriously, read my comments.
Tell me what I am.
I don’t think you’re on the wrong side, I think you’re advocating to hold back on using a tool that can be used, right now, to mitigate some of the most terrible shit that can be done to a group of people by a government
But even forgetting what’s at stake… Do you think there are no checks on this power? Do you think it isn’t used already? There was a case last year where a judge ordered a custom bat mobile or something, and was unhappy he hadn’t received it yet. The local cops flew across state lines and seized one in front of the judge in line. The judge ended up balking at using this legal argument, but it was discussed, and the opinion was that the judge had no legal basis for it anyways. I don’t remember the resolution, but the judge was in danger of losing his robes over it
There’s petty tyrants everywhere… The police are generally enablers of it to start with. Judges are still beholden to oversight, aside from the supreme court apparently
And back to where we are… Things aren’t just going to go back to normal in two or four years. We’re over the cliff, they’re disappearing people and throwing them into what legally classifies as torture with no due process. They’re trampling over the courts and the constitution - there’s no going back from that, only forward
This isn’t the time to tiptoe carefully around. It’s not time to come up with reasons to let them continue to act, even if there’s problems to work out later
Nowhere did I say anything about not defending.
Nowhere did I say anything about not going on offence.
Nowhere didi say do nothing
Nowhere did I say sit back and wait.
Nowhere.
I said what is likely to happened and presented facts as they are. And what the Rs would do, have done.
How people have chosen to interpret things I wasn’t thinking or saying is their fault.
In other posts I’ve advocated, very aggressively, in many ways, for learning defense, learning offense, ways to organise, etc.for helping others in need, encouraging those with the capacity to fight to fight and not embarrassing others who cannot.
Nowhere do i ever say lay down and die.
Ever.
Okay, then in that light, do you still think we need to be cautious in having the courts appoint people outside the executive branch to enforce their orders?
Like I said, I don’t think you’re on the wrong side, but I think this is a bad take. This is one of the last checks on Trump’s power, and no telling if it’s actually used… But it seems like caution is the absolute last thing we need to be advocating for right now
Marshals can also deputize, and they’ve already deputized Elon’s private security.
Nah, that’s nonsense. Trump controls umpteen kinds of law enforcement already anyway; he doesn’t need to deputize anything.
Your comment is just fearmongering to discourage resistance against his tyranny.
Your comment is just fearmongering to discourage resistance against his tyranny.
A lot of that going around lately, including telling people that the way they plan on resisting is “doing it wrong.”
There’s huge amounts of tone-policing anytime someone mentions active resistance or even non-compliance. Well, they might see some things that offend their delicate sensibilities, so they should stay home and let serious people deal with matters by any means necessary.
I’ve actually dealt with the opposite from keyboard warrior freedom fighters who chide me for wanting to do things like create parallel systems of mutual aid so that when the violence inevitably comes we have systems to support and take care of one another.
To quote a recent reply to me:
Think Blackwater is really going to let you have your little garden?
Not everyone has the capacity to be a fucking freedom fighter. Many of us are already physically disabled but these fucking chumps want me to go buy a gun, figure out how to afford training somehow even though I’m in poverty, and storm the capitol or some stupid shit.
Guess what, chumps, it takes a diversity of tactics and you need support systems like community doctors and community food to keep anything and anyone alive. You can’t fucking eat bullets, but I guess I’m stupid for wanting to have a plan.
serious people deal with matters by any means necessary.
Precisely, serious people have plans and don’t run in guns blazing like Meal Team Six.
No. Akshually, I keep having comments removed for urging resistance.
It isn’t trump who would be deputizing.
When shit hits, though, it won’t matter who is deputized.
It’ll be us vs them.
But, like you said, they basically control LEO. From FBI to marshalls and on down to the already rogue constitutional sherrifs.
In the meantime, do you think certain judges having the ability to deputize literally anyone for civil matter won’t also be weaponized?
Such as in cases of pardons, or the media, or congress, where the magats will likely lay ridiculous charges on anyone and then have the trump appointed maga judges annoint and send forth their crusaders.
Caution is warranted. There is danger in this power. And we know who will use it.
Edit: wanna complain about my assessment?
Do something to stop it. Stop them. Fucking do something. Anything.
The dems won’t. The feds won’t.
Only those who do will.
Fight back.
Courts and.laws mean.nothing now.
Understand that.
That is reality.You aren’t the voice of reason here. Caution is no longer warranted. If you intend to continue fear mongering, just stop talking. You have a defeatist mentality and we do not need it.
We’re very near the point where the only options are to resist, or to passively wait until they come for us (or in hopes that someone else will risk their neck to do the right thing). It’s a bleak choice, but that is the choice.
It is a warning, an educated expectation to prepare for likely outcomes.
If you aren’t prepared for likely futures you aren’t preparing.
Seeing the possible uses and outcomes is not defeatist. It is awareness.
Warning: bridge out You may drown, crash, etc
Yep, Defeatist.
Not a warning, not educated. Just foolishness. The other user already told you about deputizing and how you are wrong. You have the same mentality as the current Democrats in office - do not use the avenues available to you in fear they will be used against us.
They are already being used against us.
We are already crashing.
You are advocating for weakness. Like that user said, stop complying with fascism and expecting a better outcome.
Yes, defeatist.
You are reading what you want to hear.
That is not what I said.
At all.
But that’s not an originalist thing to do. At least 2 Supreme Court justices think this way.
They don’t, really. They’re just charlatans.
