- cross-posted to:
- usa@midwest.social
- cross-posted to:
- usa@midwest.social
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“The young man was not dangling from a tree. He was not swinging from a tree. The rope was wrapped around his neck. It was not a noose. There was not a knot in the rope, so therefore, it was not a lynching here in Vance County.”
Umm, are you saying it wasn’t a lynching on a technicality? Everyone in the south must be Olympic level mental gymnasts. In particular to say there’s no evidence of foul play, at least.
This is like Russian dissidents falling out of windows or down stairs.
The legal definitions can be far removed from normal usage: in California “lynching” is when a crowd forcibly removes a suspect from police custody, which historically was often a prelude to what we would recognize as actual lynching (presumably it was defined that way so participants could be charged even if they were stopped before harming the victim). But it’s been used in more recent times to charge protesters with “lynching” for interfering with the arrest of other protesters.
That is interesting that it has bespoke legal definitions. The Wikipedia entry is what I expected
Lynching is an extrajudicial killing by a group. It is most often used to characterize informal public executions by a mob in order to punish an alleged transgressor, punish a convicted transgressor, or intimidate people. It can also be an extreme form of informal group social control, and it is often conducted with the
Yes, legal definitions vary a lot by jurisdiction. “Assault and battery” is probably the most varied. Some places they’re two separate things.
I guess based on that definition, since it wasn’t proven yet that a group of people did this, it does not meet the criteria.
A group could be three dudes in Klan robes. I haven’t seen anything yet indicating that applies here. But the history of Deep South racism is also a history of terrorism. It only takes three homicidal maniacs to terrify a county.
I didn’t realise lynching had to be done in a certain specific way.
Yeah, otherwise it’s just sparkling racism.
otherwise is general racism, not specific enough for “lynching”
/s
Brame told ABC11 that there were no signs of foul play in Magee’s death.
Suicide and lynching can look similar. The officer said no signs of foul play first, then got a little too technical on the details of lynching as a response to speculation which probabky contained those details.
Yes, the response about specific details sounds ridiculous in a vacuum. But keep in mind that what he is saying is also a way to describe why a suicide isn’t a lynching.
At least the police are reaching out to an external agency to hopefully provide some conformation on the circumstances.
I would love to see someone explain how you could commit suicide by having an untied rope around a tree.
D E D I C A T I O N
Rope was wrapped around his neck, and wrapping rope around a rough or aoft object a few times can create enough friction to keep it from moving. So loop it around the neck a few times, and around the trunk a few times, and it will behave the same way as being tied on both ends with some tension if the loops are pressed against each other.
So from a standing position loop it around the tree a few times, the neck a few times, and then sag so the friction keeps it in place. My understanding is that people who die from autoerotic asphyxiation sometimes have the rope looped around their neck without tightening it thinking it will slip off if they pass out but end up hanging themselves instead because it doesn’t slip off. Someone who is committing suicide could have the same end result if they left it untied just in case, but if it tightens and gets stuck they will still die from strangulation.
That all sounds like a huge leap to me.
I’m not gonna say it’s not possible and honestly I’d like to see the tree it happened on but if you’re gonna actually kill yourself with a rope a noose isn’t hard to learn to tie.
I actually think it would be easier to learn to tie a noose than it would be to configure the rope in the way you described.
This reeks of foul play. Like it’s practically dripping with it.
I actually think it would be easier to learn to tie a noose than it would be to configure the rope in the way you described.
I’m literally describing just winding a rope around a cylinder, then around another cylinder. It is also a way to intentionally set up a suicide, although it might be the least likely way that he died.
Of course if he was really drunk or under the influence of some other drug it is also possible that something led to him wrapping rope around his neck and choking out. Or he had the rope around his neck, but died from some other means like an overdoes. There are dozens of things that could accidentally lead to death with a rope looped around the neck that are more likely that intentional suicide.
He said Magee went to a nearby Walmart shortly before he died. That is where he is believed to have bought the rope found around his neck.
If this young man bought the rope himself, if there is evidence of this like surveillance video, that paints this situation in a pretty different light.
Edit: I want to be very clear that the police should be presenting any evidence they have of this. I would not take the police at their word. My comment here hinges on the report being true.
I want to be very clear that the police should be presenting any evidence they have of this
Are you willing to wait for the investigation to finish, or do you prefer to have incomplete information so you can jump to conclusions sooner?
Maybe the cop should have waited for the investigation to finish before making a fool of themselves by jumping to the conclusion of what this was not.
It’s not a real lynching unless you know how to tie a proper noose. That means 13 loops.
very high chances they were interrupted trying to hang him or the body afterwards. sheriff is a tool.
He obviously hung himself from the tree with nothing to stand on and then untied the rope as a precaution. You know, in case any kids walked by.
Call it what you will, it’s a travesty and should be taken very seriously. But, this is the south, and most southerners love to mince words; especially when it comes to race and politics.
This could be funny if it wasn’t so sad. Reminds me of the episode in The Wire where the various departments wouldn’t take responsibility over the dead girls in the can because of they could t pinpoint where exactly they died and when. They care too much for the state. God forbid there’s a lynching and instead of admitting they have a problem they focus on cooking the stats.
There are a concerning amount of not-a-lynchings in this country.
“Lynching-lite”? “I can’t believe this is not a lynching”? “Lynching adjacent”?
What are we going with for the new term?
It’s only a lynching if it’s from Lynch, Kentucky
Otherwise it’s just a sparkling hate crime
Given that the sheriff in question is black, and that he has requested investigations from outside parties, I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt until the investigations are complete.
The sheriff is blue.
In addition to…
Just like internalized misogyny is very much a thing in women, internalized racism is a thing, too. It’s sort of like a poor person aligning themselves with the rich against their own interests, if that’s easier for you to visualize. All that to say, I agree with the other commenter— that cop is blue.
OK, like, MAYBE everyone should quit knee-jerking and claiming being experts off a headline, and maybe this guy is a grown-up who understands the situation more than you do?
I could be wrong. But the pitchfork mentality and outrage addiction is even worse on Lemmy than it was on Reddit, and that’s really not a good thing.
I’m not saying assume nothing is wrong. I’m just suggesting that it accomplishes nothing to jump to conclusions until all the evidence is available. Is that so unreasonable to you?
Butbutbut… the internet demands instant answers to everything!
Is it more racist to assume it was a lynching because he’s black so therefore any death involving a rope – an accident, happenstance, autoerotic asphyxiation, suicide – must be a lynching, or to assume that it might not be a lynching because it would be stereotyping and objectifying black bodies to assume any death involving or related to a rope must be a lynching? 😬
I mean there is literally video of him buying the rope that he was found with from Walmart, buying smokes from a smoke shop, which were found next to his body, him driving to where his body was found, and not returning to his truck. There was no signs of assault or trauma. It would be pretty crazy if someone happened to stumble upon him near a tree with a rope and smokes and was able to then lynch him without him resisting.
Ah, yes, suicide. Like Epstein.
I would say this department is full of “bad apples.” You might remember the kid being slammed a few years back. Even if the event was a suicide, the community will always wonder. They like to hid stuff and pay corrupt sheriffs.
I can see why the sheriff doesn’t want to rush to call it lynching when there isn’t evidence of lynching specifically. BUT it appears to be a horrific and violent crime that surely should be their first priority. Sheriff’s statement is downplaying the whole thing.
No defensive wounds, if the sheriff’'s office isn’t lying.
Well yes if they had said “by technicality this is not a lynching, but it certainly smells like one” I don’t think we’d be thinking the sheriff is fucked in the head. But he didn’t say that
I got a lot of negative comments I could make; I will not. The only comment I will make will be that I hope he has evidence it isn’t.
Obviously the investigation should be thorough to rule out alternatives, especially considering the history of such racist crimes, but it may legitimately be a suicide.
It’s only lynching if it’s commited in the Lynch region of the deep south. Otherwise it’s just sparkling hate crime.
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