There is no denying that white supremacy is an engine of the right.
There are some Republican voters who are sympathetic to their party’s ultranationalist turnand don’t believe the party’s attitudes toward issues such as immigration and crime are the products of racial animus. But over and over again, right-wing leaders and thinkers reveal that white supremacism is an engine of this movement.
The latest example comes via an episode of “The Tucker Carlson Show” released this week, in which the former Fox News host interviews podcast host and newsletter writer Darryl Cooper. Carlson, arguably the most influential right-wing nationalist commentator in America, said Cooper “may be the best and most honest popular historian in the United States.” But Cooper has made clear that his intellectual project regarding World War II includes Holocaust revisionism.
It is truly insane to me that the one party in this country has moved into straight-up holocaust denial, but the only thing that will get you labeled an antisemite by either party is suggesting we politely ask Israel to do a little less genocide with the weapons we give them.
I also love the fact that saying we shouldn’t allow one semitic group to eradicate another semitic group with our tax payer dollars, makes you antisemitic.
Careful buddy, if you keep talking like that, AIPAC is going to give hundreds of thousands of dollars to a Nazi-apologist to take your job.
To be fair both parties are currently engaged in genocide denial.
Well, you’re not wrong.
Alright, so stay with here…
Cooper also framed the slaughter of millions of people, most of them Jewish, as a logistical failure
The article is spreading Holocaust misinformation too. Most of the victims of the Holocaust were not Jewish.
6 million out of 17 million isn’t a majority.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_victims
It’s fucking infuriating that so many people keep repeating that bullshit. People legit believe it, it’s what we’re taught in schools even. But it’s just propaganda so kids grow up more likely to excuse Israel’s current genocides.
I was taught that it was the largest specific group targeted not that it was the majority.
And in this case it’s fine for the author to simplify. Because the specifics of the Holocaust isn’t the article focus. It’s about current day people denying it happened at all and their political affiliation.
Same, but it’s the framing of the number that they’re calling into question. As if to force people to say “only 6 million of the 17 million,” or, “if they’re lying about this, what else are they lying about?”
Truly devious and truly maniacal.
From the linked table, the largest specific group is Soviets.
Holocaust victims were people targeted by the government of Nazi Germany based on their ethnicity, religion, political beliefs, disability or sexual orientation For specified groups like the Jews, genocide was the Nazis’ primary goal. According to the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum (USHMM), the Holocaust was “the systematic, bureaucratic, state-sponsored persecution and murder of six million Jewish men, women and children by the Nazi regime and its collaborators”.[1]
Including 7.8 million soviet civilians and POWs in the count kind of seems like a revisionist definition of what the holocaust was to include anyone killed in the war. To undermine how much focus was on the jews pre-war.
To be fair, the Soviet citizens were targeted because of their ethnicity. Slavics were considered sub human like Jews.
Then you’d have to also look at deaths before the war for every group…
Like, you get that right?
Do you just not know most of the death wasn’t till Nazis understood they were likely going to lose the war?
That’s not a rhetorical question. To understand how to best explain this it helps if I know this is something you’ve thought about more than clicking on the Wikipedia link from a social media comment 2 minutes ago.
Where do I need to start explaining stuff here?
According to museumoftolerance.com and their Holocaust Timeline, Hitler said during a Reichstag speech in January 1939:
if war erupts it will mean the Vernichtung (extermination) of European Jews
So before the war even started, when these people were already surviving in the world, eating, etc, the Nazis and Hitler already knew feeding them would be a logistical problem best solved by death?
The Chelmno (Kulmhof) extermination camp began operations on December 8, 1941, literally one day after Pearl Harbor, far before Germany was “losing” the war. And camps don’t just pop up overnight, especially ones that earn the denomination of being an extermination camp, so was this just more logistical foresight on behalf of those oh so kind Nazi officials?
From the same source regarding the Kulmhof Extermination Camp opening:
340,000 Jews, 20,000 Poles and Czechs murdered by April 1943
Or the March 17, 1942 Entry:
Extermination begins in Belzec; by end of 1942 600,000 Jews murdered
Wow, the German 6th Armored didn’t surrender at Stalingrad until January 1943, and the Allies didn’t invade until June 1944, so that’s an awful lot of “mercy killing” happening before the Nazis knew they were going to lose the war.
And FYI, just because the Nazis didn’t begin their extermination campaign until after the war began, doesn’t mean their actions don’t signal what their intentions were from the start: Dachau opened in March 1933, Jewish Germans were barred from military service in 1935, Jewish doctors barred from practicing medicine in 1936, immigrant Jews having their German citizenship status revoked, the Nuremberg Laws of 1935, Kristallnacht in 1938… Like, you see all this, right?
Where do I need to start explaining stuff here?
So I said:
Do you just not know most of the death wasn’t till Nazis understood they were likely going to lose the war?
And you link about less than a million deaths…
Do you think 1 out of 17 million is a majority?
Then there’s a big rant about other stuff you didn’t understand…
But I won’t get to that, one thing at a time because it’s concerning we’re going in the wrong way.
6/17 isn’t bigger than half, and 1/17 is a lot less than half, you need the top number to get bigger
Removed by mod
Removed, civility.
So, nothing but insults?
And accusing the people who don’t want to ignore the majority of Holocaust victims the whole ones denying the Holocaust?
I’m not the one ignoring 11 million deaths because they’re not Jewish.
Ok, so then what was the plan? If the killing was a mercy, and was expedited by Germany losing the war, what was the plan for the 17 million collective people? Because I provided such a dismally low number of under one million in response to your comment saying the only reason the Nazis started killing more quickly was because they were losing. And those one million (more, since I’m sure my source didn’t count all deaths, only those who were Jewish) mattered to people, so they mean no less than the other 16 million killed later during the war.
I’m waiting, I’ve provided sources regardless of whether you respect them, you’ve provided nothing to back up any of your claims, so why don’t you refute my apparently unfounded claims of you being a holocaust denier?
Is that civil enough for a discussion with a holocaust denier, moderators? I’m glad we have to respect the opinions of holocaust deniers, god bless tolerating the intolerant. 🙄
Too chicken to answer my questions? Or did you finally realize you’re wrong?
I’ve always heard the figure being 12 million total. I actually saw an older piece of material recently that mentioned the total as being 11 million.i agree that saying Jews were a majority is incorrect and misleading but I don’t think it’s intentional misinformation. It was the largest individual group.
but I don’t think it’s intentional misinformation.
Are you saying this one journalist who wrote the article wasn’t intentionally spreading it as propaganda this time?
Cuz I could believe that, that’s how 80 years of propaganda works.
Unless you’re as old as Joe Biden, it’s been getting spread longer than we’ve been alive.
But people genuinely believing it doesn’t make it fucking better, sure as shit don’t make it true.
Look at all the shit trump supporters believe, sincerity of belief is not as important as the factual merit.
God damn. Go touch grass. Why do you think it’s acceptable to get so antagonistic when people share a reasonable thought of their own?
Yeah I was talking about this one particular journalist.
So what is the total amount of soviets that were victims?
I read that. I mean the total that we’re only killed because they were Soviets and not for any other reason, ethnic, sexuality, etc.
And this is the only way you can find anything out?
Asking random people on social media?
It’s taken two hours so far, this is faster than you googling?
Are you not able to?
If it’s that you do t know how or are so bad at it that this is faster. Have you tried asking nicely? May e I cluding “please”?
I just don’t understand what the point is in what you’re doing here…
Ok, fuck right off with that attitude.
That link cites the holocaust museum defining the holocaust as the extermination of the Jews.
That quote seems to “benignly” recast the holocaust and eliminate over half of the deaths. Even with POWs excluded.
Removed by mod
A holocaust/genocide studies professor once told me there were two categories of holocaust deniers, and while the former were fools, the latter truly scared him:
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“It didn’t happen.”
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“It wasn’t a holocaust because they didn’t finish the job.”
This is veering into #2 territory when you view these deaths as some sort of portion that had “overcrowding.”
#2 is what defenders of Israel are saying today too
Don’t know why you’re being down voted. “It can’t be a genocide there are still Palestinians living in Gaza” is literally a line being used by commenters.
They’re the ones down voting it
I guess all the downvotes on your comment with no one offering another explanation is probably proof you’re right.
Probably because it’s not actually a common talking point.
Sorry just realized I replied a comment level up from what I meant to.
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The racism is just used to distract from the economic issues faced by the middle class, low information voters need to be educated about this.
The republican party is going to destroy America and then their rich will move overseas. You already have TX governors fucking off every time a weather event happens.
I did Nazi that coming
Lazy but wholesome.
That can be applied to pretty much everything I do.
Cooper also framed the slaughter of millions of people, most of them Jewish, as a logistical failure. Nazi leader Adolf Hitler, he said, entered Germany into “a war where they were completely unprepared to deal with the millions and millions of prisoners of war, of local political prisoners.”
“They went in with no plan for that and they just threw these people into camps,” he added. “And millions of people ended up dead there.”
Poor little nazis, kek.
That ‘historian’ is to be bullied from every college debate club.
Also aside from the death camps the Nazis ran executions squads, just lining up and shooting all the villagers once they captured a village.
There is absolutely no question about the Nazis intention of murdering people they thought to be inferior or inconvenient.
Their initial approximations how it should go is to clear the Soviet Union from human pests and make germans settle there with slavic genetical garbage as mere servants if not pets allowed to live and reproduce in set margins.
Such a great starting point to treat civilians right.
Hell, not even the fucking Nazis themselves claimed that they weren’t deliberately operating death camps. Here’s Rudolf Höss, commandant of Auschwitz:
Technically [it] wasn’t so hard—it would not have been hard to exterminate even greater numbers… The killing itself took the least time. You could dispose of 2,000 head in half an hour, but it was the burning that took all the time. The killing was easy; you didn’t even need guards to drive them into the chambers; they just went in expecting to take showers and, instead of water, we turned on poison gas. The whole thing went very quickly.
And here he is, after his trial, four days before his execution:
My conscience compels me to make the following declaration. In the solitude of my prison cell, I have come to the bitter recognition that I have sinned gravely against humanity. As Commandant of Auschwitz, I was responsible for carrying out part of the cruel plans of the ‘Third Reich’ for human destruction. In so doing I have inflicted terrible wounds on humanity. I caused unspeakable suffering for the Polish people in particular. I am to pay for this with my life. May the Lord God forgive one day what I have done. I ask the Polish people for forgiveness. In Polish prisons I experienced for the first time what human kindness is. Despite all that has happened I have experienced humane treatment which I could never have expected, and which has deeply shamed me. May the facts which are now coming out about the horrible crimes against humanity make the repetition of such cruel acts impossible for all time.
Doesn’t really sound like the statement of a guy who was trying to claim it didn’t fucking happen, or that it was anything but a deliberate crime against humanity.
They’ve been called Nazis so much, they have to downplay what the Nazis did (and what they’d like to do). They can’t believe they’re becoming monsters.
Again???
Didn’t think they’d bring this one back until they released their ‘Greatest Shits’ album.
You’re not a REAL JEW unless you vote for the Republicans Rewriting the Holocaust!
Just when you think they can’t get more racist
This is the same demographic with the Q-anon stuff not shocking. Reality and history isn’t their thing.
MSNBC - News Source Context (Click to view Full Report)
Information for MSNBC:
MBFC: Left - Credibility: Medium - Factual Reporting: Mixed - United States of America
Wikipedia about this sourceSearch topics on Ground.News
https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/maddowblog/josh-hawleys-ahistorical-christian-nation-nonsense-matters-rcna161078
https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/fox-s-tucker-carlson-s-biggest-racist-conspiracy-theory-n1295212
https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/tucker-carlson-nazi-darryl-cooper-rcna169809Please understand that I did significant work toward the preservation of witness accounts of the Holocaust myself and I know that it all happened from firsthand observation of the evidence.
I’m having a hard time understanding how it matters that Republicans are bad on the Holocaust when the Democrats are currently the ones funding and arming and abetting a genocide. This is whataboutism at its most vile. I don’t want to read another word about revisionism while people in power NOW are allowing it to happen again on their watch. This is bullshit.
This comment is whataboutism.
Can the two things not be true at once? Could it not possibly be the case that both parties are too far right, but one is so much more extreme that it is not only comfortable with the current narrative but going so far as to rewrite the past in order to support it?
How is it now “whataboutism” to call out these talking heads for engaging in clear-as-day holocaust revisionism? Just because Democrats have the same garbage foreign policy? Is that not whataboutism in and of itself???
Because Gaza is still happening. It doesn’t matter what we remember if we don’t actually stop the genocides. That’s why we preserved that history, so it wouldn’t happen again.
Your anger should be directed at the military industrial complex.
Trust me I have plenty to go around
We already getting another remaster of it?
Why? Haven’t the bystanders suffered enough?I guess the last one with space lasers was pretty wild with flashy CGI, but I can barely keep up with the ridiculous plot - now somehow Palestine is involved, and there is that cartoonishly evil dark Sith Sam thats puppetmastering it all, very directly and obviously, but nobody believes it. It’s just so much bs one and can take.
