This operation has the potential to better Ukraine’s strategic position greatly. Ukraine winning means the dying of civilians stops. Ukraine giving up would not have the same result.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Czechoslovakia? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Poland? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered the Netherlands? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Denmark? - No.
Ukraine winning means the dying of civilians stops. Ukraine giving up would not have the same result.
Ukraine winning, Ukraine giving up, Ukraine making a peace deal with Russia, Russia winning - all those options will mean the dying of civilians stops.
The only option where people will continue to die is the option you (probably) support - continuing the war.
Russia winning means, the dying will continue in the suppression of their new subjects and in future invasions since this one would have been successful in the end.
How many people have died from “supression” (whatever it means in this context) in the Crimea, that has been occupied for 10 years now?
And the next question - how come this number (is it 0 or more?) is less then the number of civilians (some of whom be Ukrainians or ex-Ukrainians) that died from Ukrainian shelling of Crimea?
Do you think people should have a choice of dying in this, very real, war, or in some hypothetical could-happen war in the future?
You lie, moskals have been observed to continue stealing, raping, killing and ethnic cleansing long after any hostilities ceased in many armed conflicts before. Their behaviour in Bucha and elsewhere proves they haven’t changed one bit.
would ukraine winning mean civilians stop dying in the eastern oblasts where the coup regime have been murdering civilians and bombing and shelling them since 2014?
You support who fighting back against the aggressor?
People who are now trapped in the biggest mass prison in the world? People who are trying to escape this prison by any means, including through the occupied territories, mountains and rivers? People who are afraid to leave homes and go to grocery shops, because any day they might be kidnapped by “recruitment officers” and forcefully sent to die?
You are not supporting us, you are killing us, together with Russia.
The deleted comment said that I’m lying. By definition it means the author thinks that I’ve said something that is not true, so it can be disproved (or at least one can provide an argument why it’s likely not to be true).
you’ve offered an idiotic opinion
Is there any reason that it is idiotic, other than not being aligned with western propaganda?
That cedeing to a country that openly plans to retake its former Soviet borders will somehow dispite all logic result in Russian withdrawal and lasting peace.
Now, you’ve said peace talks. No one has stopped those and it’s no surprise fighting still has not stopped.
You sure it isn’t the people literally blowing up Ukrainians. If Russia is so altruistic when then do they not see these “desperate prisoners of war” and give them mercy by withdrawimg from Ukraine since as your source says they are there killing civilians… Children… For a fucking political stunt.
That cedeing to a country that openly plans to retake its former Soviet borders will somehow dispite all logic result in Russian withdrawal and lasting peace.
If anything, the initial proposal was about Russia cedeing territory that it has captured (since 2022 invasion) to Ukraine, not the other way around.
No one has stopped those
No one has been doing any serious peace talks after the initial ones either.
You sure it isn’t the people literally blowing up Ukrainians
Those as well, but you have to deal with more immediate problem first.
It’s funny that you call me a fascist, despite me arguing against fascism :)
Wikipedia:
Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/ FASH-iz-əm) is a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement,[1][2][3] characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.[2][3]
How many of those points are not true about current Ukrainian government?
Okay, you hate Russia.
But why do you hate Ukrainians? Why do we have to die for your grudge with Russia?
This operation has the potential to better Ukraine’s strategic position greatly. Ukraine winning means the dying of civilians stops. Ukraine giving up would not have the same result.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Czechoslovakia? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Poland? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered the Netherlands? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Denmark? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered France? - No.
Did ww2 stop when Germany conquered Norway? - No.
Ww2 ended, when Nazi Germany was defeated.
Ukraine winning, Ukraine giving up, Ukraine making a peace deal with Russia, Russia winning - all those options will mean the dying of civilians stops.
The only option where people will continue to die is the option you (probably) support - continuing the war.
That is not my perception.
Russia winning means, the dying will continue in the suppression of their new subjects and in future invasions since this one would have been successful in the end.
How many people have died from “supression” (whatever it means in this context) in the Crimea, that has been occupied for 10 years now?
And the next question - how come this number (is it 0 or more?) is less then the number of civilians (some of whom be Ukrainians or ex-Ukrainians) that died from Ukrainian shelling of Crimea?
Do you think people should have a choice of dying in this, very real, war, or in some hypothetical could-happen war in the future?
Bro people died defending it and the rest fled so they weren’t raped or sledgehammered to death.
What’s your solution dipshit.
Are we still talking about Crimea? Because what you are saying is completely false…
Please link some proofs to what you’re saying.
Are you honestly looking for proof of the crimean invasion famously costing Ukraine an international airport and many many dead defenders.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Antonov_Airport
The only people who say no one died dispite all evidence otherwise is Russia.
Ed: PS claiming you’re Ukrainian is pretty shitty boss, you clearly aren’t what’s next you have cancer and a Canadian girlfriend?
Are you trolling or something?
We are talking about Crimea in 2014, and you are linking an article from 2022 about Kiev…
You lie, moskals have been observed to continue stealing, raping, killing and ethnic cleansing long after any hostilities ceased in many armed conflicts before. Their behaviour in Bucha and elsewhere proves they haven’t changed one bit.
Oh wow we got some “have to blow off the dust it is so old” racism here
deleted by creator
would ukraine winning mean civilians stop dying in the eastern oblasts where the coup regime have been murdering civilians and bombing and shelling them since 2014?
I’m not the one who invaded Ukraine, but i support them fighting back against the aggressor.
would you rather just roll over and let russia take over?
You support who fighting back against the aggressor?
People who are now trapped in the biggest mass prison in the world? People who are trying to escape this prison by any means, including through the occupied territories, mountains and rivers? People who are afraid to leave homes and go to grocery shops, because any day they might be kidnapped by “recruitment officers” and forcefully sent to die?
You are not supporting us, you are killing us, together with Russia.
Removed by mod
Ah yes, another lemmy.world account accusing me of spreading lies and yet not disproving any of them…
You haven’t said anything to disprove, you’ve offered an idiotic opinion not a fact or anything you even claim to be a fact.
The deleted comment said that I’m lying. By definition it means the author thinks that I’ve said something that is not true, so it can be disproved (or at least one can provide an argument why it’s likely not to be true).
Is there any reason that it is idiotic, other than not being aligned with western propaganda?
They’re implying you’re lying to yourself.
You keep saying everything like you have a solution but won’t say what it is.
It’s idiotic because no bully is going to stop bullying you because you stop fighting back especially when they want something you have.
Your fixing platitudes and dipshit idealism aren’t helpful.
About what?
Already told you what the solution is.
The bully that bullies people in Ukraine is Zelensky though.
That cedeing to a country that openly plans to retake its former Soviet borders will somehow dispite all logic result in Russian withdrawal and lasting peace.
Now, you’ve said peace talks. No one has stopped those and it’s no surprise fighting still has not stopped.
You sure it isn’t the people literally blowing up Ukrainians. If Russia is so altruistic when then do they not see these “desperate prisoners of war” and give them mercy by withdrawimg from Ukraine since as your source says they are there killing civilians… Children… For a fucking political stunt.
If anything, the initial proposal was about Russia cedeing territory that it has captured (since 2022 invasion) to Ukraine, not the other way around.
No one has been doing any serious peace talks after the initial ones either.
Those as well, but you have to deal with more immediate problem first.
Where did I say that?
Ukraine does it as well.
deleted by creator
Yep, that was dumb.
It’s early morning for me and I’ve misunderstood your comment but deleted my reply a moment after sending it, cut me some slack :)
Nope, I don’t cut fascists in any way you might want invite upon yourself boss.
It’s funny that you call me a fascist, despite me arguing against fascism :)
Wikipedia:
How many of those points are not true about current Ukrainian government?