Strawmen and baselessly accusing anti-authoritarian pacifists of being tankies won’t convince anyone that waiting 164 days to call for an end to a genocide is in any way acceptable.
Most politicians will play it safe and stick with the most popular opinion for their voter base, or just stay silent.
Sanders, AOC and the protesters helped to turn the tide, which is the reason some politicians speak out now. Those new voices will continue to change public opinion, force others to speak out and apply more pressure.
You rather want this not to happen?
I thought, getting people and politicians to agree that Israel needs to be stopped was the goal?
And why would it be “too late” while Palestinians are still dying?
This account does this all the time. Part of a legion trying to do anything and everything to convince Americans that voting is against their better interests bc “muh boff sides.” As if the choice wasnt between Status Quo Joe and a hostile foreign agent. Theyve a vested interest in using the Gaza crisis as a cudgel to beat any hope anyone may have into oblivion.
Which is still what she’s doing. She’s not suddenly developed principles, it’s just reached the point where she can’t get away with not pretending anymore.
stick with the most popular opinion for their voter base what the owner donors who keep them in legal bribes prefer, or just stay silent.
Fixed that for you.
You rather want this not to happen?
No, but have you never heard the expression “too little, too late” ? This is the very definition of that.
And why would it be “too late” while Palestinians are still dying?
Because tens if not hundreds of thousands have already died as a result of the actions of the Israeli government and the inaction of the United States government. Even more people, mostly children, have reached a point where they’re going to be horribly affected for life if they survive at all.
It’s too late to avoid the irreparable damage that she and her colleagues already share some of the responsibility for.
anti-authoritarian pacifists
first your not a pacifist. Second for the anti-authoritarian parts… well that’s really the wrong conflict to get involved in.
out of the two parties here, the most stable and democratic ones killed 30 000 civilians. The other one is an authoritarian theocracy.
The Israeli government is a far right one with fascist tendencies that was already trying to take full control of the courts before October 7th happened. It is NOT a stable liberal democracy, it’s an increasingly authoritarian government trying to tightly control everything and oppressing not only Palestinians but Israeli citizens too.
The other one is an authoritarian theocracy.
No argument there. You don’t have to not abhor Hamas to abhor the atrocities of the Israeli government.
The reason I mentioned the fact that I’m anti-authoritarian had nothing to do with the genocide in particular and everything to do with the fact that tankies are by definition authoritarian, which is one of the many reasons why it’s ridiculous to assume that I’m a tankie.
Yes, especially when people with the power to put it out neglect to do so in spite of the people burning and people who sympathize with them scream for them to take action for whatever the fire equivalent of OVER FIVE MONTHS is.
Ok, so which would you rather? The fire to be put out after 5 months of burning, or not at all?
I know your preference is for the fire to have been put out 5 months ago, but unfortunately we haven’t figured out time travel so that one’s not on the table anymore.
How is it a strawman? The goal of genocide is to kill/remove all the people. You claimed the house is already burned down, very clearly implying that there is no one left to kill or no one who can go back.
It’s a strawman because you’re ascribing a position that I haven’t taken to me in an effort to make it seems like my argument has less merit than it actually does. That’s the definition of a strawman and that’s what you did.
You claimed the house is already burned down
Meaning that irreparable catastrophe has already occurred. Catastrophe that could have been avoided if not for the delayed reaction of her and other leading US politicians
very clearly implying that there is no one left to kill or no one who can go back.
Only to the most literal of bad faith interpretations. Don’t be fatuous, Jeffrey.
Oh, so the analogy is just terrible. The house hasn’t burned down, it’s just the fire looks like it’s about to spread out of the garage, and you’re saying its too late because it irreparable damage has already been done.
What the other poster is saying is that we can still save the rest of the house.
Although it should be clear that if you say the house has burned down, that means all of it and not just a small part.
Yeah, because it’s SUPER helpful to call for the fire to be put out after the house has burned down 🙄
Oof, lemme just tell the living Gazans dont matter bc the same lemmy tankies as ever dont find them useful to their narrative if we help em. 😪
That’s nowhere near what I said and you know it.
Strawmen and baselessly accusing anti-authoritarian pacifists of being tankies won’t convince anyone that waiting 164 days to call for an end to a genocide is in any way acceptable.
Most politicians will play it safe and stick with the most popular opinion for their voter base, or just stay silent.
Sanders, AOC and the protesters helped to turn the tide, which is the reason some politicians speak out now. Those new voices will continue to change public opinion, force others to speak out and apply more pressure.
You rather want this not to happen?
I thought, getting people and politicians to agree that Israel needs to be stopped was the goal?
And why would it be “too late” while Palestinians are still dying?
This account does this all the time. Part of a legion trying to do anything and everything to convince Americans that voting is against their better interests bc “muh boff sides.” As if the choice wasnt between Status Quo Joe and a hostile foreign agent. Theyve a vested interest in using the Gaza crisis as a cudgel to beat any hope anyone may have into oblivion.
Which is still what she’s doing. She’s not suddenly developed principles, it’s just reached the point where she can’t get away with not pretending anymore.
Fixed that for you.
No, but have you never heard the expression “too little, too late” ? This is the very definition of that.
Because tens if not hundreds of thousands have already died as a result of the actions of the Israeli government and the inaction of the United States government. Even more people, mostly children, have reached a point where they’re going to be horribly affected for life if they survive at all.
It’s too late to avoid the irreparable damage that she and her colleagues already share some of the responsibility for.
“Which is still what she’s doing”
I know, I was talking about her.
“it’s just reached the point where she can’t get away with not pretending anymore”
Exactly, and that’s a good thing.
“owner donors”
If true it means that even they think it’s beneficial to change course which would be great.
“It’s too late”
Yes, it’s too late to reverse time. But I’m pretty sure the Palestinians that are still suffering at the moment would appreciate help anyways.
And real “help” is only going to happen if not only the politicians with principles but also the opportunistic ones agree on it.
Feels like your top priority is to hate on them instead of moving forward on a path that might finally bring a halt to that genocide.
Maybe you should reconsider what’s really important to those people dying right now, I’m pretty sure they don’t give a fuck about that senator.
Ah yes, the underdogs of the current ruling party of the unites states turned the tide
You’re right, it was the communists on Lemmy.
We should probably ask those who died.
The dead Palestinians say it’s too late to save the living Palestinians?
Yep, the dead definitely wouldn’t want their loved ones to continue living.
Yes I’m a pacifist. What makes you think I’m not?
The Israeli government is a far right one with fascist tendencies that was already trying to take full control of the courts before October 7th happened. It is NOT a stable liberal democracy, it’s an increasingly authoritarian government trying to tightly control everything and oppressing not only Palestinians but Israeli citizens too.
No argument there. You don’t have to not abhor Hamas to abhor the atrocities of the Israeli government.
The reason I mentioned the fact that I’m anti-authoritarian had nothing to do with the genocide in particular and everything to do with the fact that tankies are by definition authoritarian, which is one of the many reasons why it’s ridiculous to assume that I’m a tankie.
so i see where you are going but… fire spreads
Yes, especially when people with the power to put it out neglect to do so in spite of the people burning and people who sympathize with them scream for them to take action for whatever the fire equivalent of OVER FIVE MONTHS is.
Ok, so which would you rather? The fire to be put out after 5 months of burning, or not at all?
I know your preference is for the fire to have been put out 5 months ago, but unfortunately we haven’t figured out time travel so that one’s not on the table anymore.
So there’s no one left to kill? Or you just don’t care about them?
That strawman was ridiculous when the other person built it and it still is.
How is it a strawman? The goal of genocide is to kill/remove all the people. You claimed the house is already burned down, very clearly implying that there is no one left to kill or no one who can go back.
It’s a strawman because you’re ascribing a position that I haven’t taken to me in an effort to make it seems like my argument has less merit than it actually does. That’s the definition of a strawman and that’s what you did.
Meaning that irreparable catastrophe has already occurred. Catastrophe that could have been avoided if not for the delayed reaction of her and other leading US politicians
Only to the most literal of bad faith interpretations. Don’t be fatuous, Jeffrey.
Oh, so the analogy is just terrible. The house hasn’t burned down, it’s just the fire looks like it’s about to spread out of the garage, and you’re saying its too late because it irreparable damage has already been done.
What the other poster is saying is that we can still save the rest of the house.
Although it should be clear that if you say the house has burned down, that means all of it and not just a small part.
Or maybe the way you phrased it sounded exactly like what I said. All the comments and downvotes are a hint that this might be true.
But No. No. It’s the kids who are wrong.
As opposed to the actually SUPER HELPFUL option of letting the fire continue to burn and spread? Yeah, you’re right, let’s not bother at all.