Edit: It looks like the argument here is that the US is not calling for an instant ceasefire, but instead saying that one is very important to have. China and Russia say it should be immediate. The US also tied it to hostage talks.
Another resolution is in the works to call for an immediate ceasefire, but the US is expected to veto it because they believe it could endanger hostage talks.
So I want to be upfront and say I don’t really agree with their argument, but I do understand it. What Russia and China are saying is by tying the ceasefire to the release of hostages is unfair to the Palestinian side. This is because they lose all leverage and then would be easy targets for Israel who doesn’t seem to mind bombing Palestinian civilians.
My issue is that technically the only reason their bombing is because of the hostages and perhaps if they release the hostages peace talks can begin. The opposite of that argument is it will allow Israel to be even more aggressive after the temporary cease fire is ended.
I don’t know, but that’s the argument.
Israel is bombing to exterminate the Palestinians so they can claim all the land. It’s pure genocide.
Pity China and Russia are blocking an immediate cease fire.
An immediate temporary ceasefire.
Permanently blocking an immediate temporary ceasefire permanently forever because the US is involved and they’re not over the ussr failing hilariously in 1990 or being outmaneuvered for at least 60 years technologically in China’s case.
That’s some massive copium. Not that I’m a fan of China or Russia, but there’s a reason Hamas has been rejecting temporary ceasefires.
Removed by mod
It’s disgusting. Goes to show they don’t actually care about Palestinians and probably don’t even think this is a genocide.
I mean, if they genuinely cared or thought this was a genocide, why are they now defending China and Russia blocking an immediate ceasefire that would at least temporarily stop Palestinian suffering?
How entirely predictable that the same kind of people who make excuses for Russia’s role in the genocide in Darfur, Russia’s role in Syria, Russian war crimes in Ukraine, and China’s treatment of the Uyghurs, care more about scoring points against the US than ending the war in Gaza.
I mean, if they genuinely cared or thought this was a genocide, why are they now defending China and Russia blocking an immediate ceasefire that would at least temporarily stop Palestinian suffering?
Because freeing the hostages for a 6-week ceasefire would be effectively approving Israel’s planned attack of Rafah. They literally say that. There’s a reason Hamas has been rejecting this same deal over and over again.
Removed by mod
They’re right, though. The proposed resolution put a ceasefire wholly contingent on Hamas giving up their only bargaining chip (hostages) instead of outright calling for an immediate ceasefire.
Had it passed, Hamas would have simply ignored it and Israel would have felt justified in continuing its murderous ethnic cleansing campaign.
You still fail to call HAMAS for what they are while arguing in defense for them. Why is it so hard? HAMAS are terrorists that rape and murder innocent people. There. Should not be too hard to agree with that, right?
I see you only care for civilians on one side since you keep moving the goalpost to avoid answering a simple question.
technically the only reason their bombing is because of the hostages
That’s not the reason, it’s just the excuse
I think y’all are missing the elephant in the room here. This is a resolution that demands Hamas hand over all their hostages for a temporary ceasefire, with no mention of the 3000+ hostages Israel still holds.
My issue is that technically the only reason their bombing is because of the hostages and perhaps if they release the hostages peace talks can begin.
This might work somewhere else, but not with Israel. Hamas isn’t good, but they’re for better or worse one of the organizations with the most experience at negotiating with Israel and getting actual results (small as they may be). And Hamas knows there’s no way in hell Israel would just quietly leave after being handed over all the Palestinian side’s leverage when they’ve been very clear they want to re"settle" Gaza and rule it like (or worse than) they rule the West Bank.
BTW I’m relying on reporting so if anyone can find the whole thing please link it.
I can understand it but treating the hostages as merely bargaining chips ignores that they are innocent civilians caught in this idiotic conflict through no fault of their own. Hamas has no right to use the hostages as a tool to protect themselves.
The real issue with this ceasefire is that linking the ceasefire to the release of the hostages tacitly endorses continued atrocities by IDF if and when the demand for release is ignored.
I can understand it but treating the hostages as merely bargaining chips ignores that they are innocent civilians caught in this idiotic conflict through no fault of their own. Hamas has no right to use the hostages as a tool to protect themselves.
They have the right to use the hostages to protect Gazans. Don’t blame the player, blame the game.
This is a slightly more interesting moral argument but I think in general I would have to disagree. Particularly because it doesn’t seem like the hostages have done much if anything to blunt Israel’s aggression.
They haven’t, but we’re not talking about now. We’re talking about later when this mess dies down. The hostages are likely to make a difference in Gaza’s post-war fate. And given the stakes (Israel has been pretty clear they want to re"settle" Gaza) I’d say while the hostages are victims and deserve better we can’t blame Hamas for holding onto them.
Edit: The hostages are also likely to be involved in things like how much food and other goods Gazans are allowed through the blockade, trying to get Israel to not do random airstrikes and other such things.
I find it incomprehensible that anyone could justify the holding of innocent hostages.
Agreed, hundreds of thousands of Palestinians, including Children, have been taken hostage and tortured by Israels Military Courts
Do we honestly think any of the hostages are still alive at this point? Gaza has already been reduced to a pile of rubble, and there is widespread starvation in Gaza already. And we know Israel shot three of the hostages a couple months back.
Historically ceasfires have been used by Hamas to resupply rockets for the next rocket barrage on Israeli civilians. A ceasfire without hostages being released would be nothing more than a failure on the Israeli side, so would not be accepted.
America posturing by submitting Israel’s demand for a 6 week ceasefire in exchange for all hostages and then continuing their Genocide. Fuck Biden.
Let’s not forget the real story.
The United States had vetoed three previous resolutions demanding a stop to fighting in Gaza, arguing that the measures could disrupt hostage negotiations and staunchly defending Israel’s right to defend itself after the Hamas-led attack of Oct. 7. In each of those earlier Security Council votes, the United States was the only vote against the resolutions. Russia and Britain abstained from the first vote, in October, and Britain abstained from the votes in December and February.
New video by Democracy Now on this facade: https://youtu.be/Ggpc9QHc_vk
Removed by mod
The US has veto’d 4 permanent ceasefire voting sessions in the UN so far.
Removed by mod
Imagine being this retarded.
6 day old account
Also @fedia.io, not sure what’s going down on that instance but the several unhinged comments I’ve seen today all came from there. Maybe it’s just a coincidence.
I’ve seen that icon before. I wonder how many times they’ve been banned.
geee it’s almost as if things changed from october 7th to now that could lead to the us changing their position.
Not quite, it looks like the US resolution just calls for the importance of a ceasefire, and Russia/China are saying there should be an immediate ceasefire.
No, in the article it states the US resolution called for an “immediate” cease fire as well.
It looks the disagreement is over the word “sustained cease fire” vs “permanent cease fire.” The US resolution also calls for release of the hostages as a part of the ceasefire, whereas in the other version the hostages are not linked to the cease fire.
Maybe they demand permanent instead of “sustained”
Removed by mod
Let’s not assume anyone is in favor of that. Either way the genocide is a genocide and completely wrong. It needs to stop immediately.
Removed, rule 5, if you’re going to disagree, don’t accuse the other user of supporting rape and murder.
I’ve been accused of much worse things on these very pages.
deleted by creator
