There’s a visibly coordinated effort to trash Biden and/or democrats on lemmy. The commentary is all the same. They use some form of “both sides” blaming both democrats and republicans for being awful while attacking voting for either. They focus hard on Israel and call Biden “Genocide Joe” or some similar derogatory term. Overall, they always pick at Biden’s policy completely devoid of nuance while never discussing Trump’s policies past or planned. I got several posts removed from /world calling out such similar comments.
Conversely, every single time someone makes a legitimate criticism of Biden or the Democratic establishment (and there are many to be made), someone dismisses it as “both sides”.
Democrats are undoubtedly better than Republicans. Biden is undoubtedly better than Trump. Both parties are still corrupted by mega-donors and entrenched elitism.
I have no problem with legitimate criticism. There’s plenty to criticize. However, when that criticism is derogatory, often baseless, and comes with the aforementioned attacks on voting, you bet your *** that there was nothing constructive about it.
The only people propping up their argument these days with “both sides” are the willfully uneducated and the conservatives.
I’m willfully educated and a Bernie Democrat, and I’ve been accused of making “both sides” arguments many, many times. It’s almost a guarantee that it will come out in response to any criticism of Democrats.
I don’t disagree about disengenuous conservatives making bad equivalency or “uni-party” arguments. However, it’s also true that the establishment consensus across both parties is very much outside the needs and desires of mainstream Americans.
I’m just pointing out of that it’s really easy to accidentally throw the baby out with the bathwater, and it’s not in the long term interests of the Democratic party to derail serious criticism.
sourced, or very well established facts, i.e. winner of an election (not including The Big Lie of course)
longer than one paragraph
have an original point
Bernie Bros are a thing. Not that you’re a Bernie Bro, just that - Trump-supporting Bernie people most definitely exist and are famous for crapping in threads. As a Bernie person myself, I don’t mean offense, I’m saying it’s easy to say “hey i’m a progressive, but Biden sucks” and that’s actually what we’re calling out here. That’s a russian troll mainstay. Actual reasoned criticism is . . . rare at best.
Please try and apply your criteria to that statement. Write it up with multiple paragraphs with ample citations, add something original to it, then, frankly, shove it up your ass.
Or they call you a Russian asset/plant/bot or whatever.
Further, if you’re a wage earner, chances are pretty good nothing has happened under Biden to make meaningful positive change in your life, so why skip a day’s pay you desperately need in order to vote?
Unless you are in a union, have a child, drive an electric vehicle, did anything to make your home more energy efficient, want to avoid WW3, or benefit from a functional economy, Biden hasn’t done anything for most Americans.
I have a lot of criticisms to make of Biden, but he’s the best president we’ve had in at least 50 years. That is sadly an incredibly low bar, but I think he’s cleared it. I think he could have handled Gaza a lot better, but I’m not sure it would have actually helped, and I’m pretty sure that no other recent president would have done much different.
If you mean he hasn’t personally come to your home and washed the dishes and played with the kids, yeah. Ok.
For having not eventwo years to unfuck all the amazing bullshit Trump intentionally or incompetently caused with a Democratic house, he’s done amazingly well.
And seriously “I’m a workin’ man he ain’t done nothin’ for me” is straight up talk radio garbage. Do you want examples? We got a bag full. But I’m guessing you don’t.
I totally agree. However I never see any well-stated nuanced argument against it.
It’s always “Yeah teh genocide” and a (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
My point being, that’s indistinguishable from a russian troll / MAGAt / b0tH SiDeS comment. Occasionally people will use some keywords like FPTP or Citizens United or such, which is good, but they usually still essentially just leave snark droppings and wander off. Which doesn’t really help.
If Trump wins, he will outright ban the Democratic Party, if not at least make it SUPREMELY difficult for the party to be changed in any significant way for the better. I will only vote for Biden to buy a little more time in which for the more progressive wings of the Democratic Party to act. Technically, there’s nothing stopping our government from just Thanos snapping a party out of existence. I really would not want to see Trump snap his fingers and suddenly the only party with the means to oppose him just stops existing. And before you say the DNC doesn’t have the means to oppose Trump and the GOP, they absolutely do have the means. They have all the tools they need to stop them. The will to use those tools? That’s what the DNC is sorely lacking. This is because the party is suffused with neoliberals and their bullshit that MUST be called out and pushed out. Unfortunately these neolibs also have a lot of money, something something the more progressive members of the Party are lacking.
While I’m sure these trolls exist, I think there is still a minority that genuinely disliked the dems and don’t want to support genocide.
My point is: everytime I see someone saying that lemmy is having a coordinated effort to trash Biden, it kind of makes me trust that statement less because I’m one of those who actually criticizes Biden without trolling.
This is why those trolls are so effective, cause their goal is not to troll us, is to get us to troll and argue with each other over miscommunications they started.
Then I don’t think you understand the difference between trolling and criticism. There is absolutely plenty to criticize about Biden, and criticism should be done, however making up “genocide Joe” comments, trashing on voting for him, and implying potential supporters are complicit in the actions of the administration is not criticism.
There’s a visibly coordinated effort to trash Biden and/or democrats on lemmy. The commentary is all the same. They use some form of “both sides” blaming both democrats and republicans for being awful while attacking voting for either. They focus hard on Israel and call Biden “Genocide Joe” or some similar derogatory term. Overall, they always pick at Biden’s policy completely devoid of nuance while never discussing Trump’s policies past or planned. I got several posts removed from /world calling out such similar comments.
Conversely, every single time someone makes a legitimate criticism of Biden or the Democratic establishment (and there are many to be made), someone dismisses it as “both sides”.
Democrats are undoubtedly better than Republicans. Biden is undoubtedly better than Trump. Both parties are still corrupted by mega-donors and entrenched elitism.
I have no problem with legitimate criticism. There’s plenty to criticize. However, when that criticism is derogatory, often baseless, and comes with the aforementioned attacks on voting, you bet your *** that there was nothing constructive about it.
The only people propping up their argument these days with “both sides” are the willfully uneducated and the conservatives.
I’m willfully educated and a Bernie Democrat, and I’ve been accused of making “both sides” arguments many, many times. It’s almost a guarantee that it will come out in response to any criticism of Democrats.
I don’t disagree about disengenuous conservatives making bad equivalency or “uni-party” arguments. However, it’s also true that the establishment consensus across both parties is very much outside the needs and desires of mainstream Americans.
I’m just pointing out of that it’s really easy to accidentally throw the baby out with the bathwater, and it’s not in the long term interests of the Democratic party to derail serious criticism.
Show us this “serious criticism”. It needs to be:
Bernie Bros are a thing. Not that you’re a Bernie Bro, just that - Trump-supporting Bernie people most definitely exist and are famous for crapping in threads. As a Bernie person myself, I don’t mean offense, I’m saying it’s easy to say “hey i’m a progressive, but Biden sucks” and that’s actually what we’re calling out here. That’s a russian troll mainstay. Actual reasoned criticism is . . . rare at best.
Please try and apply your criteria to that statement. Write it up with multiple paragraphs with ample citations, add something original to it, then, frankly, shove it up your ass.
Or they call you a Russian asset/plant/bot or whatever.
Further, if you’re a wage earner, chances are pretty good nothing has happened under Biden to make meaningful positive change in your life, so why skip a day’s pay you desperately need in order to vote?
Unless you are in a union, have a child, drive an electric vehicle, did anything to make your home more energy efficient, want to avoid WW3, or benefit from a functional economy, Biden hasn’t done anything for most Americans.
I have a lot of criticisms to make of Biden, but he’s the best president we’ve had in at least 50 years. That is sadly an incredibly low bar, but I think he’s cleared it. I think he could have handled Gaza a lot better, but I’m not sure it would have actually helped, and I’m pretty sure that no other recent president would have done much different.
If you’re a wage earner, he is exactly the same as a Republican.
If you mean he hasn’t personally come to your home and washed the dishes and played with the kids, yeah. Ok.
For having not even two years to unfuck all the amazing bullshit Trump intentionally or incompetently caused with a Democratic house, he’s done amazingly well.
And seriously “I’m a workin’ man he ain’t done nothin’ for me” is straight up talk radio garbage. Do you want examples? We got a bag full. But I’m guessing you don’t.
I totally agree. However I never see any well-stated nuanced argument against it.
It’s always “Yeah teh genocide” and a (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
My point being, that’s indistinguishable from a russian troll / MAGAt / b0tH SiDeS comment. Occasionally people will use some keywords like FPTP or Citizens United or such, which is good, but they usually still essentially just leave snark droppings and wander off. Which doesn’t really help.
And it’s always either lemmygrad or Lemmy.ml
as expected, socialists and communist can’t and won’t tolerate the existence of a fascist state
And yet China and Russia are facist states
Neither of those countries are fascist.
Go to China and talk about tiananmen square or go to Russia and oppose the invasion of Ukraine. You’ll be locked up instantly.
Self proclaimed communists who support authoritarianism are either wildly propagandized or flat out shills
with a bit of lemmy.world sprinkled on top
If Trump wins, he will outright ban the Democratic Party, if not at least make it SUPREMELY difficult for the party to be changed in any significant way for the better. I will only vote for Biden to buy a little more time in which for the more progressive wings of the Democratic Party to act. Technically, there’s nothing stopping our government from just Thanos snapping a party out of existence. I really would not want to see Trump snap his fingers and suddenly the only party with the means to oppose him just stops existing. And before you say the DNC doesn’t have the means to oppose Trump and the GOP, they absolutely do have the means. They have all the tools they need to stop them. The will to use those tools? That’s what the DNC is sorely lacking. This is because the party is suffused with neoliberals and their bullshit that MUST be called out and pushed out. Unfortunately these neolibs also have a lot of money, something something the more progressive members of the Party are lacking.
Being unhappy with both options and focusing on Israeli war crimes is a perfectly valid political stance.
Da
True. The American uniparty corpocracy does mirror Russian oligarchy.
While I’m sure these trolls exist, I think there is still a minority that genuinely disliked the dems and don’t want to support genocide.
My point is: everytime I see someone saying that lemmy is having a coordinated effort to trash Biden, it kind of makes me trust that statement less because I’m one of those who actually criticizes Biden without trolling.
This is why those trolls are so effective, cause their goal is not to troll us, is to get us to troll and argue with each other over miscommunications they started.
Then I don’t think you understand the difference between trolling and criticism. There is absolutely plenty to criticize about Biden, and criticism should be done, however making up “genocide Joe” comments, trashing on voting for him, and implying potential supporters are complicit in the actions of the administration is not criticism.
Seriously? You think a majority of Democrats support genocide? That’s . . . incorrect.