I’m pretty sure snow leopard was the last version you could buy physical media for at the very least because that’s the last version I have physical media for lol
In my experience they are (comparatively) I absolutely hate using ipados and they messed up airdrop (because why support Bluetooth fileshare when you can have a proprietary protocol) between different versions of ipados with the latest update and now it doesn’t work half the time…
My 2013 macbook pro with 16 GB of RAM and 1 TB SSD has been deprecated by apple so the latest OS it gets is Big Sur, it has now been barred from signing updates (since they require the latest XCode which I cannot get with Big Sur) so its only viable life is via Linux from now on.
I have had to buy a Mac Mini with 8 GB of RAM and a 250 GB SSD to be able to upload updates for my iOS apps.
I mean I can afford it, but yeah, we are paying for OS updates dude.
That’s the reason they also updated their EULAs to set a minimum renting period of 24hs for providers like Amazon and MacStadium. They want you buying hardware, they don’t want to leave any easy way out.
There are still workarounds for getting new macOS on older not supported hardware (aka the OpenCore Legacy Patcher) which works very well, even with really old macs.
But yes, of course, there are no official updates.
That’s not an Apple problem per se though, that’s an industry problem. Windows 11 isn’t officially supported on Devices older than 2018 and unofficially not older than like 2015-ish, if you want full functionality and a non-hacky install (because of TPM 2.0). Also, most Android phones have a notoriously short period getting updates (although that is getting better with some manufacturers promising and delivering way more than before).
Windows 11 isn’t officially supported on Devices older than 2018 and unofficially not older than like 2015-ish
Having old computers not compatible with the latest OS is not a problem, just keep running Windows 10. Having an OS that no longer gets security updates is a huge problem.
Fortunately Apple goes out of their way to ensure their hardware doesn’t survive that long anymore.
You’re either memeing, and you use Arch btw, or you are a decade behind. Most PC users surf the web, print a PDF, and possibly look at pictures from their phone on a larger screen. All of those can be done from a vanilla install of most Linux distros. Before you say “yeah, but windows comes pre-installed on my pc” congratulations you’ve discovered why monopolies are bad, but also I can install Linux on my hardware before you’re done watching the “please wait while we are setting up your computer” and “just a few more moments” screens that give you absolutely no information about what is actually happening.
“please wait while we are setting up your computer” and “just a few more moments” screens that give you absolutely no information about what is actually happening.
Fun fact, Windows actually does have a verbose mode for these screens. It’s completely convoluted to get it to do it though, but you can lmfao 😂
It’s been awhile, but the gist of it as after the boot disk installation you have to stop it from rebooting and go back into the boot disk, open a command prompt, open the boot disk’s regedit, connect it to the registry hive installed on the drive and set some flags there and reboot
If you like pain, there’s a YT video of a madlad installing windows completely manually
If you want to do anything beyond using linux as a web browser, then nothing is simple.
Windows and mac also have web browsers, but in addition to that they can also do a lot of other things easily.
You don’t have to open a single terminal window if you don’t want to, nowadays. Hardware compatibility is mostly excellent, outside some specific vendors that keep giving trouble (fucking Nvidia, go fuck yourself). I’m not sure what’s inherently complicated about the modern Linux experience otherwise, outside having to figure out what’s a distribution. Most have app stores with bunch of stuff available OOTB, excellent software, etc.
Now, I’d have agreed with you 10 years ago. Just installing Ubuntu on a laptop meant dealing with shit power savings and non functional sleep unless you were ready to tweak obscure config files and install stuff manually. Wifi support was a nightmare.
Unless you’re speaking about software availability, which is not something you can really blame the OS for. Unless vendors make their software available natively, of course trying to mess with compatibility layers like Wine will always be complicated. I still can’t fully get rid of Windows because of media creation software mostly - music/audio DAWs are slowly coming over to Linux, but most commercial plugins obviously aren’t following. The rest is pretty smooth sailing though. I haven’t had a single fluke with my PopOS partition in years, while I’ve already had to repair my Windows partition twice in the same period - once for a borked update, and the second it just broke itself after a power outage.
“I just heart my Ubuntu, and my computer friend was right: this was easy to install!.. wait a sec. What do you mean it’s only got 3 months of support left?!? You told me to get the latest version!”
except the time is spent learning something instead of waiting for the pc to update(or you can, of course, use one of the many common distros that require no time to understand, eg. linux mint, fedora, tuxedoOS etc)
I know we all get off on a little Apple hate from time to time, why do so many of these things feel they need to make shit up? There’s so much real shit they do that you could just make fun of
I think this comic might have been from the era when you did have to pay for new versions of OS X… they stopped doing that around Lion I think in 2011 or so.
I’m not sure what you’re getting at. The versions up to and including Mountain Lion in 2012 cost money on release. If you didn’t upgrade or bought new hardware, you would not have had to pay to upgrade specifically. You could also bum copies off of somebody else… But it did technically cost money.
You’re saying your 13 year old macbook is still getting updates? I know the Pro models usually have extended support, but 13 years sounds a bit extreme. The latest version of OS X that supports the 2010 Macbook Pro is High Sierra from 2017.
Updates? No, but still runs like a champ. Even so, an OS from 7 years after its manufacture date is pretty good. My main point was against your “after 4 years” you need to buy a new Mac.
I’ve got MacOS 13 running on a 2010 MacBook Pro with OpenCore Legacy Patcher. It’s not the fastest laptop but it runs way better than you’d expect a first gen mobile i7 to handle a modern OS
Hey, they could have taken the Google option and let the phones die at 20% charge because there was too much voltage draw for the aging battery to handle
Good luck with what? Replacing a battery at home is not that difficult on an iPhone, and it’s fairly cheap without AppleCare if you just go to an Apple Store. Covered if you have it.
No, but you’ll have to buy another 3000 dollar laptop that’s only worth maybe 1200 bucks because they arbitrarily decide that their hardware can’t support a new OS and lock you out of upgrading it.
We have them where I work and it’s the biggest time sink for our service desk to deal with, replacing with Windows 10 machines absolutely saved us from having to deal with constant “network issues” and Adobe projects that can’t be accessed on a workstation not running Monterrey or whatever version the person who last edited it was on, etc.
Fuck Mac, they’re fine for personal use (if you like wasting money) but are absolutely dogshit for a commercial environment where work actually has to get done.
I don’t like apple but none of what you wrote has been reflected in my last 20 years of Mac experience. There is no “arbitrary” lack of support for older machines and in my experience machines usually get updates for several years.
Uh, what? Have you owned a Mac in the last 30 years?
That’s not how it works. I’ve had two macs in the last 20 years, and more than a dozen Windows machines. I had to reformat the Windows PCs every year or so for various reasons until they became obsolete after like 5 years, but my macs have worked for 10 years each with no issues, and always upgraded to the latest OS easily and always for free. Both my macs lasted 10+ years of heavy use (my current one is 5+ years and still young).
Every time a Windows update came out it was an ordeal and I dreaded it; with each update I’d start looking at the cost of replacing the whole machine in case it bricks and it’s just not worth fixing things. Mac updates are barely a blip in my workflow.
Adobe projects that can’t be accessed on a workstation not running Monterrey or whatever
This makes zero sense. The Adobe suite runs much better on OSX than Windows by orders of magnitude, even on outdated and non-updated OS. There’s a reason most designers and professional VXers have always preferred Mac. (eta: also, rereading, this makes even less sense because Adobe projects don’t care about your OS when opening; just the version of Adobe itself. You can easily open projects made on a whole different OS: Windows/OSX, any recentish version with no problem. Even files made in CS6/OSX can be opened in the latest cloud app on Windows easily. You’re either mistaken here or being deliberately dishonest for some reason.)
I’ve been in IT/software development and VX design for a few decades and I’m really wondering how this is an ordeal for you. It makes no sense to me. My 3000 dollar laptop has outlasted 5 1000 dollar windows machines. You get what you pay for.
e: some words were cut
Also, in my few decades in the industry, the sales and marketing staff always ran Windows, but the design staff usually worked on Mac. That speaks for itself.
Macs only get support for three years now. So you’re paying between $1,000 and $53,799 for a computer every three years instead of just updating the operating system in the same period of time.
So yeah, your right… This is inaccurate. It’s not $99 any longer, it’s starting at $1,000 every major update. If you’re outside those three years, too bad. No updates for you, and in a year or less many of your favorite programs will get updates you can no longer ever use again.
Apple machines are supported for like 7-8 years from launch
macOS is only maintained for 3 years (3 generations).
macOS 14 Sonoma just came out, so support for macOS 11 big sur just ended
I think that the oldest system that is still officially supported is the Mac Pro from 2013. So 10 years of support. Likely will not be officially supported next year.
Get your facts straight. Linux fan boyism is lazy and not supported in 2023
Would be funny if it was true…but you never pay for OS updates on Mac.
lol i was about to say. Updates have been free since what , Lion? Lemmy is just hurr durr non Linux operating systems bad 🙄
Yeah, it was Lion and even before then it was something like $35 to upgrade which was less than the cost to upgrade Windows at the time.
Why pay Microsoft though?
This meme is older than Lion
So old it’s yellowed
Same tbh
I’m pretty sure snow leopard was the last version you could buy physical media for at the very least because that’s the last version I have physical media for lol
Same
In my experience they are (comparatively) I absolutely hate using ipados and they messed up airdrop (because why support Bluetooth fileshare when you can have a proprietary protocol) between different versions of ipados with the latest update and now it doesn’t work half the time…
Are you kidding? Lemmy is overwhelmingly in favor of Linux. Like, holy persecution complex, Batman…
You may need to re-read the comment you answered carefully.
You pay it by buying new hardware.
My 2013 macbook pro with 16 GB of RAM and 1 TB SSD has been deprecated by apple so the latest OS it gets is Big Sur, it has now been barred from signing updates (since they require the latest XCode which I cannot get with Big Sur) so its only viable life is via Linux from now on.
I have had to buy a Mac Mini with 8 GB of RAM and a 250 GB SSD to be able to upload updates for my iOS apps.
I mean I can afford it, but yeah, we are paying for OS updates dude.
That’s the reason they also updated their EULAs to set a minimum renting period of 24hs for providers like Amazon and MacStadium. They want you buying hardware, they don’t want to leave any easy way out.
There are still workarounds for getting new macOS on older not supported hardware (aka the OpenCore Legacy Patcher) which works very well, even with really old macs. But yes, of course, there are no official updates.
That’s not an Apple problem per se though, that’s an industry problem. Windows 11 isn’t officially supported on Devices older than 2018 and unofficially not older than like 2015-ish, if you want full functionality and a non-hacky install (because of TPM 2.0). Also, most Android phones have a notoriously short period getting updates (although that is getting better with some manufacturers promising and delivering way more than before).
Having old computers not compatible with the latest OS is not a problem, just keep running Windows 10. Having an OS that no longer gets security updates is a huge problem.
Fortunately Apple goes out of their way to ensure their hardware doesn’t survive that long anymore.
Windows 10 is also nearing end of life. In two years it’s over
It’s the same with windows though, I can’t get Windows 11 on my laptop.
Same with many things, it’s just not feasible to support decade old hardware with new updates.
hav ye herd a linux?
You pay for linux with your time and sanity.
You’re either memeing, and you use Arch btw, or you are a decade behind. Most PC users surf the web, print a PDF, and possibly look at pictures from their phone on a larger screen. All of those can be done from a vanilla install of most Linux distros. Before you say “yeah, but windows comes pre-installed on my pc” congratulations you’ve discovered why monopolies are bad, but also I can install Linux on my hardware before you’re done watching the “please wait while we are setting up your computer” and “just a few more moments” screens that give you absolutely no information about what is actually happening.
Fun fact, Windows actually does have a verbose mode for these screens. It’s completely convoluted to get it to do it though, but you can lmfao 😂
Wait, how? (out of curiosity)
It’s been awhile, but the gist of it as after the boot disk installation you have to stop it from rebooting and go back into the boot disk, open a command prompt, open the boot disk’s regedit, connect it to the registry hive installed on the drive and set some flags there and reboot
If you like pain, there’s a YT video of a madlad installing windows completely manually
If you want to do anything beyond using linux as a web browser, then nothing is simple. Windows and mac also have web browsers, but in addition to that they can also do a lot of other things easily.
You don’t have to open a single terminal window if you don’t want to, nowadays. Hardware compatibility is mostly excellent, outside some specific vendors that keep giving trouble (fucking Nvidia, go fuck yourself). I’m not sure what’s inherently complicated about the modern Linux experience otherwise, outside having to figure out what’s a distribution. Most have app stores with bunch of stuff available OOTB, excellent software, etc.
Now, I’d have agreed with you 10 years ago. Just installing Ubuntu on a laptop meant dealing with shit power savings and non functional sleep unless you were ready to tweak obscure config files and install stuff manually. Wifi support was a nightmare.
Unless you’re speaking about software availability, which is not something you can really blame the OS for. Unless vendors make their software available natively, of course trying to mess with compatibility layers like Wine will always be complicated. I still can’t fully get rid of Windows because of media creation software mostly - music/audio DAWs are slowly coming over to Linux, but most commercial plugins obviously aren’t following. The rest is pretty smooth sailing though. I haven’t had a single fluke with my PopOS partition in years, while I’ve already had to repair my Windows partition twice in the same period - once for a borked update, and the second it just broke itself after a power outage.
If you’re definition of simple is just clicking things until you get the response you want then you might be correct.
“I just heart my Ubuntu, and my computer friend was right: this was easy to install!.. wait a sec. What do you mean it’s only got 3 months of support left?!? You told me to get the latest version!”
except the time is spent learning something instead of waiting for the pc to update(or you can, of course, use one of the many common distros that require no time to understand, eg. linux mint, fedora, tuxedoOS etc)
It used to be the case yea, but my experience last 5 years or so has been that especially for old hardware everything works out of the box.
Might be extremely hardware or distro dependent though.
You can, but not officially.
I know we all get off on a little Apple hate from time to time, why do so many of these things feel they need to make shit up? There’s so much real shit they do that you could just make fun of
I think this comic might have been from the era when you did have to pay for new versions of OS X… they stopped doing that around Lion I think in 2011 or so.
They used to sell it? Criminals!
The first few iOS updates they tried to charge for as well
I remember because it was laughably easy to just go grab the package file online and “flash” it manually.
Always better to sail the high seas
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I’m not sure what you’re getting at. The versions up to and including Mountain Lion in 2012 cost money on release. If you didn’t upgrade or bought new hardware, you would not have had to pay to upgrade specifically. You could also bum copies off of somebody else… But it did technically cost money.
Because Apple bad obviously, get on the bandwagon
There was a time when you had to pay for the next major version. I think it went free around mountain lion or so?
And even then it was only $20. The last time it was over $99 was 16 years ago.
Indeed. Last two were twenty.
Are you telling me I can get a cougar for free?
Animal protective services entered the chat
Go to the right bar and she’ll buy your drinks.
After 4 years, you have to pay $1999 to get a new iMac. (all numbers were made up)
My 2010 MacBook Pro disagrees
2012 MBP still going strong as a daily driver.
You’re saying your 13 year old macbook is still getting updates? I know the Pro models usually have extended support, but 13 years sounds a bit extreme. The latest version of OS X that supports the 2010 Macbook Pro is High Sierra from 2017.
Updates? No, but still runs like a champ. Even so, an OS from 7 years after its manufacture date is pretty good. My main point was against your “after 4 years” you need to buy a new Mac.
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Do they still do security updates for old versions of MacOS? It’s something they’re really good at when it comes to iOS after all.
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I’ve got MacOS 13 running on a 2010 MacBook Pro with OpenCore Legacy Patcher. It’s not the fastest laptop but it runs way better than you’d expect a first gen mobile i7 to handle a modern OS
Heah, my 2013 MBP died this year (at least the wifi module did), so I replaced it. 9 years is good in my book
You pay for them when they slow down your hardware
Hey, they could have taken the Google option and let the phones die at 20% charge because there was too much voltage draw for the aging battery to handle
This.
The only negative thing about the whole situation was that Apple didn’t publicize it, not that they throttled the devices.
Get a new battery for it and the thing works just fine.
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Good luck with what? Replacing a battery at home is not that difficult on an iPhone, and it’s fairly cheap without AppleCare if you just go to an Apple Store. Covered if you have it.
Here in Sweden you can just go to partners too. Replacing the battery on my XS cost $50 or so.
I recall new batteries for my old 3330 going for like $25 back in the day so I don’t get the big honestly.
Yea, and if we are talking about MacBooks it’s ridiculously easy to do. Not sure what the whole “can’t replace the battery” thing is about.
You can disable the throttling.
No, but you’ll have to buy another 3000 dollar laptop that’s only worth maybe 1200 bucks because they arbitrarily decide that their hardware can’t support a new OS and lock you out of upgrading it.
We have them where I work and it’s the biggest time sink for our service desk to deal with, replacing with Windows 10 machines absolutely saved us from having to deal with constant “network issues” and Adobe projects that can’t be accessed on a workstation not running Monterrey or whatever version the person who last edited it was on, etc.
Fuck Mac, they’re fine for personal use (if you like wasting money) but are absolutely dogshit for a commercial environment where work actually has to get done.
I don’t like apple but none of what you wrote has been reflected in my last 20 years of Mac experience. There is no “arbitrary” lack of support for older machines and in my experience machines usually get updates for several years.
Uh, what? Have you owned a Mac in the last 30 years?
That’s not how it works. I’ve had two macs in the last 20 years, and more than a dozen Windows machines. I had to reformat the Windows PCs every year or so for various reasons until they became obsolete after like 5 years, but my macs have worked for 10 years each with no issues, and always upgraded to the latest OS easily and always for free. Both my macs lasted 10+ years of heavy use (my current one is 5+ years and still young).
Every time a Windows update came out it was an ordeal and I dreaded it; with each update I’d start looking at the cost of replacing the whole machine in case it bricks and it’s just not worth fixing things. Mac updates are barely a blip in my workflow.
This makes zero sense. The Adobe suite runs much better on OSX than Windows by orders of magnitude, even on outdated and non-updated OS. There’s a reason most designers and professional VXers have always preferred Mac. (eta: also, rereading, this makes even less sense because Adobe projects don’t care about your OS when opening; just the version of Adobe itself. You can easily open projects made on a whole different OS: Windows/OSX, any recentish version with no problem. Even files made in CS6/OSX can be opened in the latest cloud app on Windows easily. You’re either mistaken here or being deliberately dishonest for some reason.)
I’ve been in IT/software development and VX design for a few decades and I’m really wondering how this is an ordeal for you. It makes no sense to me. My 3000 dollar laptop has outlasted 5 1000 dollar windows machines. You get what you pay for.
e: some words were cut
Also, in my few decades in the industry, the sales and marketing staff always ran Windows, but the design staff usually worked on Mac. That speaks for itself.
Macs only get support for three years now. So you’re paying between $1,000 and $53,799 for a computer every three years instead of just updating the operating system in the same period of time.
So yeah, your right… This is inaccurate. It’s not $99 any longer, it’s starting at $1,000 every major update. If you’re outside those three years, too bad. No updates for you, and in a year or less many of your favorite programs will get updates you can no longer ever use again.
Apple machines are supported for like 7-8 years from launch
macOS is only maintained for 3 years (3 generations).
macOS 14 Sonoma just came out, so support for macOS 11 big sur just ended
I think that the oldest system that is still officially supported is the Mac Pro from 2013. So 10 years of support. Likely will not be officially supported next year.
Get your facts straight. Linux fan boyism is lazy and not supported in 2023