• Rickety Thudds@lemmy.ca
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    8 months ago

    I’m all for the general gist, but “no criminals?” Bullshit.

    They had slavery. Don’t imagine it was a utopia just because colonizers hadn’t made it worse yet.

    • Bye@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      They, like most other people in the world, had slavery, genocide, theft, the death penalty, and all sorts of other bad things. None of this excuses colonialism, at all. But to pretend that native peoples were some kind of wonderful noble savages is very very racist in and of itself. Even this comment is fairly racist because I just implied some kind of homogenous culture in North American indigenous peoples, which was obviously not the case.

      • TheFriar@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        I mean, the quote is from a first nations person. The only one “pretending that native peoples were some kind of wonderful noble savage” is the person the quote is attributed to. A holy man of the Lakota tribe. Calling him discussing his tribe racist is…weird.

        • phx@lemmy.ca
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          8 months ago

          Comparison of “we” versus “our white brothers” is a racial one and not a tribal one.

    • rockSlayer@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      Criminality as we understand it is a European concept. Native Americans had relatively advanced societies before the colonial settlers came through and genocided hundreds of tribes. Their politics were pretty complex, but they didn’t have criminals the way we understand the term.

    • iheartneopets@lemm.ee
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      8 months ago

      Who exactly are you talking about when you say “they”? Indigenous peoples weren’t all the same culture and didn’t have all the same cultural practices.

        • Psychodelic@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          Uh that was my first comment. How did I move the goalposts? How would you have asked the question? The other comment gave a decent answer. Not sure why you’re offended. It’s a legit question

          • Zoboomafoo@slrpnk.net
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            8 months ago

            I read your comment as being as snarky as mine was. I didn’t realize it was an honest question, sorry.

    • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
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      8 months ago

      WTF

      I was all set to type up a little semi agreeing comment about how it was a continent-spanning complex mixture of very different tribes with different cultures and practices, only some of whom practice slavery

      But I don’t really know what I’m talking about so I read a little and I got distracted by this

      Several tribes held captives as hostages for payment.[2][3] Various tribes also practiced debt slavery or imposed slavery on tribal members who had committed crimes; full tribal status would be restored as the enslaved worked off their obligations to the tribal society.[2][3]

      Slaves would sometimes be killed in potlatches, to signify the owners’ contempt for property.[citation needed]

      And this

      Captive-taking was most often used to replace a dead loved one within the family with a new person. The captive would then take on this deceased person’s sexual or labour-related capacities.

      What the fuck was going on with the Native Americans