- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.ml
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The title is very confusing. And the article is like a long essay.
Here is a summary by Chat GPT:
The web page is a blog post by a teacher who argues that most kids today can’t use computers effectively. He shares several anecdotes of students and adults who lack basic computer skills, such as troubleshooting, googling, and programming. He criticizes the education system for not teaching computer literacy and problem-solving, and he urges parents and teachers to help kids become more competent and confident with computers. He also warns that relying too much on technology can make us vulnerable to manipulation and exploitation by those who control it.
Wow, the irony.
he effectively used technology to solve his problem. seems he did alright, to me.
Thanks for the tldr, this guy goes on forever. Really didn’t enjoy his condescending, judgemental additude either.
Removed by mod
I’m getting PTSD flashbacks to that stupid “Gen Z can’t use rotary phones” video. Guess what, they can’t start a fire by rubbing sticks together either, and neither can I. We don’t have to. People who want to work with technology will learn to do so or they won’t be able to find or keep a job. This isn’t just a non-problem, it’s a non-problem that has existed since the first Homo Erectus learned to sharpen a rock and immediately started bitching at all the other Homo Erecti for being stupid and using blunt rocks.
The thing is, there was a minute where to get online, to use a computer, to do these things, you needed basic tech troubleshooting competence.
Just like there once was a time where if you weren’t a bit of a mechanical type, you couldn’t make an automobile work.
These days, it’s pretty rare to see someone who can do work on their own car. The cars have gotten both vastly more complex and significantly more reliable. Meaning fixing it up is both harder and less necessary. That means when an inevitable problem DOES happen, you have to take it to a mechanic. The cost of car ownership is at an all-time high. It also means that people don’t even know basics. They don’t know how to do simple stuff like changing an air filter, oil, or sometimes even wiper fluid & blades. That feels pretty not good, as someone who wants advocacy for consumers. It’s true that it barely costs more to get an oil change than just the cost of the oil – but also, there’s a whole predatory industry in the halo around oil changes.
That’s happening with computers too. Since you can mostly use them without troubleshooting, the skills of troubleshooting atrophy. Or maybe aren’t developed in the first place. And just like with cars, life goes on. The basic issues? You can still fix them. It just costs a bit more and a halo of predatory shit around that is a problem, but life goes on.
I’ve mostly switched to riding an eBike lately. Mechanically simple. I can deal with it myself. Very little to break down or surprise me with costs the way my car likes to. I wonder what the electronic equivalent of that kind of lifestyle-simplification would be.
That’s happening with computers too. Since you can mostly use them without troubleshooting, the skills of troubleshooting atrophy. Or maybe aren’t developed in the first place. And just like with cars, life goes on. The basic issues? You can still fix them. It just costs a bit more and a halo of predatory shit around that is a problem, but life goes on.
Let’s not forget the computer manufacturers which increasingly won’t allow users to upgrade memory, hard drives, or components.
Hey, at one point I partially build my computer. On a regular basis I’ve replaced my laptop hard drives, added memory, etc., but companies like Apple (ESPECIALLY Apple) have engineered their hardware to at the very least, discourage, at worst engineer away the ability to complete very simple upgrades to exacerbate a throw-away culture.
I think Right to Repair will help a long way in helping people, yet I also believe that is only one step.
I get your perspective. The halos of predatory shit are everywhere. Extended warranties, maintenance for pretty much any mechanical device - it costs a fortune to tune a piano -, snake oil salesmen and salesmen of legitimate products and services upselling you on a more expensive option that you don’t need because you don’t know better. It’s bad, it’s slimy, and you’re right that if everyone took the time to learn the basic skillset associated with one area, it’d go away.
But there’s just too many areas for that to be feasible. I can do the absolute basics when it comes to my car and bike, I can fend for myself very well where most electronic devices I use are concerned and I happen to have gone to Law school, so there’s an entire industry of parasites that I’m lucky to know my way around. But that still leaves anything to do with home maintenance/improvement, furniture, healthcare, veterinary healthcare, financial services, diet, exercise regimes and Zeus knows what else I’ll have to deal with in my life where I know jack and people who know more than me can still take advantage. It’s too much to expect any one person to know everything.
The thing is, there was a minute where to get online, to use a computer, to do these things, you needed basic tech troubleshooting competence.
There was a minute when computing devices came with printed owners manuals that described set-up, usage, and troubleshooting in detail. Many even had a label with a phone number – right on the front of the device – which would connect one to US-based technical support for as many hours as one needed, for a small fee.
Today, if you’re lucky, you get an Ikea-style wordless pamphlet that depicts how to plug in the power cord. Then halfway through setting up everything, the device installs an update, reboots, and comes back with a completely different UI. And if you’re brave enough to Google for technical support, you end up downloading malware or on the phone with someone in Nigeria who needs you to go buy iTunes gift cards before they can help you.
My WWII-era grandparents had no problems buying a Gateway desktop, setting it up, and spending hours on the phone learning how to do everything that they couldn’t otherwise figure out about Window 98 Second Edition or AOL from the novel-length books that came in the box. These days, all you can really do is phone a friend or hope your local library has some free courses.
I think there’s always a benefit to learn “low level” tasks that may not be relevant to daily use but inform children (or young adults) how these things work from a fundamental standpoint. For example, your rubbing two sticks example, there is a benefit to knowing the basics of how this works, how to achieve it, and the science behind why it works. I think those lessons are things that kids today have already, but are missing it when it comes to the world of technology/maths/computer sciences.
Having said that, I have no kids so I have no say on this matter. If I did have a kid, I would hope that they learn the foundation of any technology they are expected to use on a day-to-day basis.
So he connected her to the WiFi but didn’t set up the proxy he knew was required and just expected her to figure it out from there? Wtf? At no time in history would I expect a rando to even know what a web proxy is, let alone the address of this particular one.
I also found it ironic that they call out https as something desirable and how kids can’t describe why that is, but they don’t have Let’s Encrypt or something else setup for the very site where the otherwise great writeup is shared.
That said, it’s possible that the network had an automatic configuration script for the proxy that would have configured on connection under Windows systems and he just wasn’t aware that it would require manual steps on OSX? Still a bit ironic, but maybe excusable? I feel like if I managed a network with a proxy that would automatically configure on connection, I would understand the limitations of that setup, but that’s assuming a lot? I’d love to see their explanation on why that was her fault rather than theirs all the same, because the first thing I do after getting someone connected to a network is attempt to access something unlikely to be cached just so I can validate that the task was completed successfully.
I assumed that maybe (since they were colleagues) that they had some sort of training or provided documentation that says “set this proxy to connect”. And a tech literate person would know how, or figure out how to set the proxy. And this user did not.
If your kid can’t use wireshark, what’s the point?
Agreed, I don’t think the situation has gotten any better. That article was a good read. Thanks for sharing MistyMtn421!
