• trailing9@lemmy.ml
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    1 year ago

    Give me a hint. Are there reforms without staging a revolution? How can you dream of revolutions without believing in voters?

    • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      How can you dream of revolutions without believing in voters?

      You’re the one who doesn’t believe in the masses.

      • trailing9@lemmy.ml
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        1 year ago

        I don’t believe in revolutions, that’s a difference.

        Let me ask again:

        How can you dream of revolutions without believing in voters?

        • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
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          1 year ago

          I don’t believe in revolutions

          Like, that they historically exist and have resulted in massive gains for the working class, or what?

          Do you think not believing voting can affect change is the same as thinking the masses aren’t capable of affecting change?

          • trailing9@lemmy.ml
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            1 year ago

            Revolutions needed 2% of the population to fight. Voters are 50% and you need a majority, so in total 25% of the population.

            That made revolutions easier historically because you just needed guns and food for those 2%.

            Now look at Ukraine, are guns and food enough?

            You have to convince the population anyway or there will be a counter revolution. So I think if something is worth changing, it should be changed by voters.

            That said, let me ask again, why do you prefer revolutions?

            • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
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              1 year ago

              I didn’t say I prefer them, I said that historically over and over again they get the goods. The problems you’re asking about are questions all successful revolutions have succeeded at grappling with.

              • trailing9@lemmy.ml
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                1 year ago

                What does that mean? Should we perceive landlords as members of the ruling class and make owning property as difficult as possible because rising rent will lead to the revolution which will ultimately reduce rent?

                Or should we perceive landlords as cogs in the capitalistic machine and increase their supplies to increase their output to reduce rent?