Next time the public should brutalize the agents
Depends.
If an overwhelming crowd can come together fast - arrest can be blocked and persons de-arrested. But it has to be overwhelming, so that no cop would think of aiming a gun.
Throughout the history of resisting repression - this arrangement is hard to spontaneously produce.
As a minimum, people would have to organize with the clear goal of interrupting ICE raids. They’d likely establish a means of communcation (most likely a phone app backed up by mesh networking) and dedicate resources to offering each other legal assistance later. Possibly, everyone who goes to jail for the hypothetical anti-ICE movement should be celebrated like a rock star (with their permission) and their families should be helped through hardship, to encourage people to undertake risky actions.
The other option - working underground - would be exhausting either ICE or a local police force by persistent sabotage against them. Neutralizing the ICE would have the aim of them organizing less raids, neutralizing police might have the aim of them not backing ICE raids. While more straightforward to accomplish, this approach would bring about high risk (e.g. accusations of terrorism) to people carrying out sabotage. To avoid this, sabotage would have to be carefully considered and low-key. Perhaps, for example, it would aim to upset the agency’s ability to process data - to know whom it actually wants to deport.
Of course, with local police, one should consider the potential outcomes of successfully neutralizing police: both their negative and positive functions would be neutralized, and people might start complaining about crime.
A curious tactical perspective becomes evident when thinking about this: police resources could be diverted in peaceful ways, with false reports.
When I think of how one might decrease police responsiveness to an ICE backup request, I can’t avoid thinking of nice movie scenarios: e.g. while some people are busy obstructing an ICE raid, some other reliably anonymous people divert police resources by calling 911 and reporting various violent situations elsewhere. Others create a traffic jam, effectively isolating the street involved from motor vehicle traffic. Backup will have to arrive on foot, after they’re done chasing the hostage-taking bank robbers who did not exist. :)
Violence begets more violence. This isn’t the way.
Empty platitudes. Pacifism doesn’t work on Nazis. Mandalorianism though…
So they’ll just get to kill us without consequence. Fucking awesome
And us killing them comes without consequences?
clearly we need to wait for the death camps
And doing nothing when someone is violently assailing you seems like it would carry consequences of its own. I’m not advocating that we meet violence with murderous retribution, but when diplomacy fails and someone intends to cause you harm no matter what you do, defending yourself is the only reasonable course of action.
Just passively get into the van please.
“whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”
-Preamble to the Declaration of Independence (of the United States of America)
“When peaceful revolution becomes impossible, violent revolution becomes inevitable.”
-John F. Kennedy, 35th President of the United States
Says person whose rights have all been secured via violence.
If you view ICE as zombies that can think, it gets a lot easier.
They think?? You might be giving them to much credit
Yes, it is. They are willing to use violence against us all, we should be willing to do the same. The only downside is that when they brutalize and jail us, they get to go home. We don’t stand a fucking chance.
I most heartily agree it’s simply senseless and cruel to brutalize other humans, cut their throats wide better to put them down like rabid dogs.
What’s with the masks. Who are these fuckers?
Seriously, what’s with the masks?
ICE refused to produce a warrant, so this wasn’t an arrest, it was an abduction. The folks who were charged for trying to stop it were acting in defense of others and ought to be acquitted.
A few more instances of this in some staunchly liberal communities and there’s gonna be at least an armed standoff between ICE and a local militia (they’re not all conservative). I’m sure that’s the outcome they’re going for; that doesn’t mean it can or should be avoided.
ICE are cowards. Unless someone is actively watching them, they’ll kidnap people when the opportunity strikes
This is exactly why people don’t trust the system. No warrant shown, no explanation given, a terrified child cuffed and dragged away for reacting like any human being would. Local police claim they don’t assist ICE, but when it counts, they show up to protect federal agents instead of their own community. This wasn’t law enforcement, it was a disappearance in broad daylight, and everyone there knew it.
Look there’s more than enough handguns in the US of A to arm each and every person who opposes ICE agents kidnapping innocent people illegally. This is not by accident. The second amendment was crafted with this very scenario in mind. It’s time.
Time to pick up the very arms the Constitution guarantees you have the right to bear to fight the very people your Constitution armed you to fight.
Always have an escape route ready. Do your thing then get the hell out of there.
While this sounds nice police largely have no fear of consequence because qualified immunity and even threatening to do harm against a cop carries big consequences. The truth is that lawmakers need to step up and make it clear what they’re doing is illegal, that way refusing an unlawful command or protecting yourself can be easily defended in court. Shooting a cop is only going to add fuel to the fire.
If you’re targeted for kidnapping/rendition, your choice is to either die in an El Salvadoran prison or to die in a hail of bullets with the hope of at least taking a few Nazi thugs with you. Due process is not an option. That’s what’s happening now. It’s not a hypothetical.
We need a “Boston Massacre” to trigger the 2nd American Revolution.
The first battle of the Revolution was fought 5 years after the Boston Massacre.
The truth is that lawmakers need to step up and make it clear what they’re doing is illegal, that way refusing an unlawful command or protecting yourself can be easily defended in court.
Yeah that’s not going to happen, what now?
Shooting a cop is only going to add fuel to the fire.
The fire doesn’t care about your fuel. If you stay paralyzed in fear of adding fuel to the fire you’ll wake up to find yourself burning.
What are you doing for the cause lol I love how it’s so easy to talk big on the Internet. Are you burning down courthouses and shooting cops?
Have you noticed that the courts are ruling against Trump’s fascist policies? Do you know what will happen if Trump continues to disobey lawful orders? It becomes lawful to disobey those orders.
I know it’s fun to be a doomerist online but we’re not at boiling point yet. It’s getting hot and people are growing more sympathetic towards minorities and understanding that if there is no due process then anyone can be targeted, journalist, opponents, etc. until that happens at large most people are unbothered.
What are you doing for the cause lol I love how it’s so easy to talk big on the Internet. Are you burning down courthouses and shooting cops?
Watching this shit go down from a safe distance and taking notes, why do you ask?
I know it’s fun to be a doomerist online but we’re not at boiling point yet.
At this rate when you reach boiling point it’ll be too late.
until that happens at large most people are unbothered.
First they came for the Communists And I did not speak out Because I was not a Communist Then they came for the Socialists And I did not speak out Because I was not a Socialist Then they came for the trade unionists And I did not speak out Because I was not a trade unionist Then they came for the Jews And I did not speak out Because I was not a Jew Then they came for me And there was no one left To speak out for me
-A dude from Nazi Germany.
