• yesman@lemmy.world
    69·
    2 个月前

    There was a long time when a casual user would have been better off on Windows, but I don’t think that’s true anymore, at least not on every distro.

    Just as you can use Windows for years and never need Group Policy or Regedit, you can do Linux just the same without terminal.

    This is the area where I feel Linux has come the farthest since I became interested in it.

    • cholesterol@lemmy.world
      32·
      2 个月前

      I just have never had a Linux system that didn’t require some sort of terminal work to fix the occasional bug. A couple of updates ago Fedora left me with conflicting packages that needed the terminal to straighten out.

    • Raltoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
      26·
      2 个月前

      Here’s the thing that a lot of long-term linux users don’t seem to understand: If it involves typing out a command in a terminal, or editing a configuration text file, 99% of casual users are already out. It doesn’t matter if they just copy-paste a command or have change a single number in a text file, they literally don’t even want to try, they consider that “too complicated”.

    • Possibly linux@lemmy.zipEnglish
      2·
      2 个月前

      If you are using Linux you should learn terminal basics. The terminal is a very powerful tool that can be useful if you learn it. That doesn’t mean you need to use it all the time but it is nice to have in some cases.

  • LucidNightmare@lemm.ee
    37·
    2 个月前

    No, seriously.

    This mindset of, “If you don’t like to read pages of documentation to figure out how to do the thing you’re wanting to do, then maybe Linux isn’t for you?” Or the “god. How dare you ask such a STUPID question. You’re using Linux wrong and it probably isn’t for you. Go back to baby’s first OS!” Is the biggest gripe I have about using Linux.

    • Natanox@discuss.tchncs.deOPEnglish
      17·
      2 个月前

      Especially since the manpages are not written to always be comprehensible for end-users, but for developers and professionals. Some tools like tldr can help, however they rarely come preinstalled and aren’t getting the attention they deserve.

    • AugustWest@lemm.eeEnglish
      12·
      2 个月前

      So you ever tried support with windows? Go to some crappy community site with people who barely know what they are talking about and try some powershell and regedit crap.

      Or go read conflicting Microsoft documentation that always seems to make man files look easy.

      Its computers. You read stuff to deal with stuff, the OS is irrelevant.

    • figjam@midwest.socialEnglish
      7·
      2 个月前

      My gripe is “oh, you picked the wrong distro”

      I just want my printer to work ffs

      • lorty@lemmy.ml
        2·
        2 个月前

        I’d put that one on the printer manufacturers. They love making them crappy.

  • halcyoncmdr@lemmy.worldEnglish
    25·
    2 个月前

    The biggest barrier to widespread adoption is the portion of the toxic parts of the general community. You know who they are, you see them all the time. They exist across all distros, and they seem to go out of their way to make the experience as miserable as possible when new users are asking simple questions.

    They often are some of the first people new users interact with when needing help transitioning over. They seek out those beginner questions to act superior, and just turn the average user off to the point they decide to never try it again.

    Without strong moderation to reduce that dipshit commentary, the Linux community will always be working against mainstream adoption.

  • Yaky@slrpnk.net
    21·
    2 个月前

    To configure most suckless tools you need to… recompile them. The readme says:

    Because dwm is customized through editing its source code, it’s pointless to make binary packages of it. This keeps its userbase small and elitist. No novices asking stupid questions.

    But if you are trying to compile suckless tools, you are already in too deep.

    • Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
      9·
      2 个月前

      Wow. Just wow. What a bunch of utter darlings. Just let them stew in their own idiocy.

      Edit: To clarify, I mean the people who wrote this readme.

    • DefederateLemmyMl@feddit.nl
      2·
      2 个月前

      LOL yes, I had a look at those too when I was looking for a more minimal terminal. Noped the fuck out when I read you had to recompile the tools to configure them.

      It’s not that this is beyond my skill level, but that is just so … why would I want to do that?

  • WalnutLum@lemmy.ml
    17·
    2 个月前

    The problem is that the road between creating a piece of software that does something well, and then creating simplification layers on top of it is typically much longer than just “edit a config file” and “here’s a readme”.

    You need extra documentation, config gating and workflow, warnings, UI/UX work etc.

    I know there are Linux elitists but kind of expecting that much extra work for what is still at it’s core mostly volunteer software seems like it’s own form of elitism.

    • kittenzrulz123
      4·
      2 个月前

      Absolutely agreed, I find it extremely telling that most people who say that have never personally contributed nor donated. Its ok to have expectations but its not ok to make demands from volunteers, thats why so many devs get burnt out and leave.

    • DefederateLemmyMl@feddit.nl
      4·
      2 个月前

      The thing is, simple can mean two things, and they are quite often at odds with each other.

      It can mean simple to understand, or simple to use.

      For example, a piece of software that’s just a binary, a config file and a man page describing the config file and the software’s behavior is generally quite easy to understand. Like, you can fit the idea of the program entirely into your mind and “comprehend” it, though it may not be easy to use for a novice.

      By contrast, a piece of software that contains additional layers for easy of use, like a GUI to edit options, may be simple to use, but not necessarily simple to understand. The additional layers add more complexity that does not contribute to core functionality of the program, it can become unclear what gets changed where when you click on buttons, the config file is likely not documented, human readable or editable, or it may even be a completely opaque configuration database (the registry), … So making the software more simple to use, often makes it harder to comprehend.

      I, and I think many other nerds, like software that is simple in the “comprehensible” sense, we want to be able to wrap our head around it completely and we don’t mind putting in a little bit of effort to achieve that comprehension, whereas other people prefer to hit the ground running.

    • Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
      5·
      2 个月前

      Git gud n00b!

      /s, of course.

      I’ve come across this kind of response a few times on here and elsewhere, but I think it’s nowhere near as prevalent as it’s sometimes made out to be.

  • onlinepersona@programming.dev
    12·
    2 个月前

    Agreed. I wish moderators would ban those people from linux communities and more users would report their elitist behaviour. It’s really annoying to ask a question and get belittled for having the audacity of being ignorant.

    I understand these people lack power elsewhere in their lives and want to be powerful where they believe themselves to be experts, but it’s a real pity they express it with a complete lack of empathy. If you don’t want to help, don’t say anything. Let somebody who does want to help nicely do the helping.

    Anti Commercial-AI license

    • Taleya@aussie.zoneEnglish
      9·
      2 个月前

      It’s a sadly entrenched part of the culture. Literally 30 years ago the joke was “if you ask a question in a linux forum you get a bunch of shitheads screaming rtfm. But phrase it as a complaint about linux not doing something windows can, and they will fall over themselves with detailed instructions to prove you wrong”

  • Shanmugha@lemmy.world
    11·
    2 个月前

    Fuck right off with that, whoever actually made this image. I am fed up with “simplification”, which is actually making everything as dumb and as closed as possible

  • FreshLight@sh.itjust.works
    9·
    2 个月前

    Hey, I installed Arch btw with Hyprland and I gotta say, the docs are super newbie-friendly. No problems on my end.

  • BussyGyatt@feddit.orgEnglish
    9·
    2 个月前

    man this is a good linux meme, its funny and its real criticism of linux. why were all the linux memes shitty for a while there? why are they better now suddenly?

    • kittenzrulz123
      1·
      2 个月前

      Absolutely this, im all in favor of making Linux more accessible but we dont need to become a Windows clone

  • Strawberry
    6·
    2 个月前

    Fedora Kinoite/Silverblue is hard to fuck up and Just Works®

    • CommanderShepard@lemmy.world
      2·
      2 个月前

      Yes, except I needed to modify some kernel parameters to fix display artifacts a few months ago due to an upstream bug. Wasn’t a big deal for me but the user who uses the system, even the concept of editing some parameters is beyond their comprehension.

    • Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
      2·
      2 个月前

      Yeah, I think the biggest obstacle to wider adoption of Linux is the lack of availability of devices that come with it installed. As long as you can’t buy a Linux PC at Best Buy & co, it will always be somewhat niche. Pretty much anyone can use Linux these days but installing it is just too much of a hassle for the average user.

      • The_Decryptor@aussie.zoneEnglish
        1·
        2 个月前

        Yeah, the days of end users installing their own OS is in the past, PCs are appliances for most people now.

        • Jakeroxs@sh.itjust.works
          1·
          2 个月前

          I think it’s still around the same amount of people, just that the wider amount of users of PCs in general is far higher so the percentage of tinkerers to “just make it work” is completely different.

  • Omega@discuss.online
    5·
    2 个月前

    What’s something you think could be made easier or just fixed if implemented as a plugin in kde, gnome, or as a software for every other DE?

    • cmhe@lemmy.world
      15·
      2 个月前

      I don’t think that there is any one issue that hurts the Linux desktop, I think it is more a matter of death by a thousand cuts.

      I think for the Linux desktop to be (more) successful we need dedicated QA teams, with a direct connection to usability developers that constantly test and write automated tests for the whole integration on different hardware, and fix any issue as well.

      • Omega@discuss.online
        2·
        2 个月前

        Valve doesn’t have much interest besides it working good enough, so we would need either china or EU to fund a group to do that for us

        • cmhe@lemmy.world
          5·
          2 个月前

          Yes, currently Valve is mostly interesting in a base system that just runs Steam and games, not a general Linux desktop. Commercial Linux distributions are more about servers and professional workstations.

          We either need PC hardware manufacturers or public funding to push Linux desktop, since I don’t think that normal users would pay directly for a Linux system.

          PC hardware manufacturers however are more about selling the next device that constantly improving a system non-customers could also use for free, so I doubt they would commit to it fully, and instead use it for marketing.

          So all that is left is public funding.