Ironically, retard was originally a kinder word cooked up to describe people with lower intelligence, along with moron, idiot, cretin, and imbecile. Over time these became pejoratives. Just kind of interesting to see how language develops and terms intended to avoid offense over time turn into ones that offend people.
Yes, when you come up with a word to describe people that others consider less/worse than themselves, they will invariably end up using the word to describe them as an insult to others. This will happen no matter how mundane or non offensive you try to make the word.
Retarded people are literally retarded. Hope this helps.
This is the very nature of slurs, and more largely language in general, in the first place. It’s not the signifier, it’s the signified.
Amazing how referring to people by their perceived flaws can be offensive. Woke culture strikes again.
Edit: In case it wasn’t obvious, this was sarcasm. No shit being defined by (what others consider) a flaw is gonna be offensive. I thought my original comment was obvious.
Amazing how referring to people by their perceived flaws can be offensive
I mean, isn’t this common sense? If you work for me and bring me some sub-par work, I can call you a fucking retard, and you’ll probably be offended. On the other hand, if I pull you aside and say that usually you do excellent work, but I’m not liking this, and here’s a couple ideas to improve your work, you might look upon that more fondly.
In both scenarios, I’m communicating that I’m not happy with you and/or your work, but one is likely to lead to an HR incident and one isn’t. How is this “woke”? (I fucking hate that term, because it tends to be use as shorthand for “stuff I don’t like”, but no two people seem to share definition beyond that)
Yes, that was my point. I guess the sarcasm was lost
If a word is used with the intent to insult people, no shit that that word starts getting perceived as an insult.
It’s the euphemism treadmill
How this fucking australopithecus became a thought leader, I will never understand.
He’s a morons idea of a clever person. That’s how
I mean, i never really stopped calling people like Rogan and Trump retarded… But calling it a great cultural victory, is just… Retarded.
Rogan really being a gay retard here
I’m not american and don’t care about politics but I was watching a show the other day and when Rogan appeared as a guest I had to shut off after 5 minutes. This person is so annoying I couldn’t stand. Don’t know how you guys do it. I didn’t even liked him in newsradio and I loved the show.
That’s crazy. Anyway, have you tried DMT?
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Sorry guys, this one’s locked now. Y’all need to grow the fuck up.
Joe Rogan has really sold out to his mentally absent base. What a victory for them.
Lol, I’ll never understand these people. The word “retard” was never gone. At no point was it illegal or impossible to say it, similar to any other word. The worst consequence for saying something that’s bound to piss people off is just that, pissed off people. You never faced jail time and I can’t think of anyone “canceled” for it.
They want to drop the hard R with zero blowback.
Unfortunately for them they don’t get to control how others feel about it. They’re free to say it at any time though. All the redneck cowards I live near use it all the time, when no black people are around.
Racists and cowards. Lovely.
They’re usually one and the same. You don’t come to hate entire races of people out of logical thinking.
You should hear the ways they justify it when pressed. “You don’t have to be black to be a …”, “not all black folks are one, but this one is.”, “why do you care, you’re not black.”, etc.
Ain’t no-one calling me ginger and getting away with it!
Unless they have a tinge of the ginge in their fringe.
Ginga, please!
We all know they have no souls. It’s not like they’re real people anyways.
The word “re----” was
The gusp I gasped was so intense that I broke the pearls I was clutching.
Reported to the FBI for saying the R word
The worst consequence for saying something that’s bound to piss people off is just that, pissed off people.
There was a real moment during which celebrity reactionaries feared The R-Word would result in the kind of deplatforming and loss of advertising patronage historically reserved for The N-Word or any of the Seven Words You Can’t Say On TV (which, curiously, did not include the N-Word at the time).
So the worst consequences wouldn’t have simply been “pissed off people”. Perhaps they’d have endured lawsuits, de-platforming, or even vigilante violence (not uncommon in religiously-tinged censorship - like with the Piss Christ display or the Draw Mohammad contest).
You never faced jail time and I can’t think of anyone “canceled” for it.
Not when the current regime is friendly to your operation, no.
But if you look at what’s happening to pro-Palestinian activists and Women’s Liberation organizations, it’s obvious that state and civil institutions have lots of tools for fucking people over based entirely on their stated political views. The real defense that Rogan, et al enjoy is having their friends in charge.
It must be nice to have so much money and freedom from consequences that that’s the kind of thing that bothers you.
Or such little money and brain cells that that’s the thing that inspires you to go out and vote against your own interests
I’m absolutely convinced that there’s a certain threshold of money/power/privilege that just destroys a person’s humanity.
Nah, you’ve got it backwards. You don’t pursue that level of money/power/privilege unless you lack humanity. These guys were always shit, but power made them more effective at being shit.
Honestly, if the culture war has been going on this long and the “greatest victory” they can show for it is feeling comfortable using the r slur again, thats just deeply sad for them lol.
I think wayyyyy more people than you realize say it. Even people you think are raging leftists. Most of us got quiet because we in general agree with left leaning things. Feel free to skim my profile…
But man… fucking EVERYONE says retarded. I’m very left leaning. Once I got away from a few select people… it was genuinely kind of a culture shock for me how many people say it lol.
I’m not advocating for people to just sling it like crazy… and I know in a way that’s kind of what’s gonna happen to SOME EXTENT… but as someone who tried to push other folks toward not saying this in the past…
I 100% think it’s a lost cause. I don’t think it’s going away. I don’t personally think it’s ableist and never did.
To make a comparison, from my perspective, it’s kind of like turning the word “insane” into a slur… we did some reaaaal bad things to people under the veil they were “insane.” We put people in jail and mental hospital for most of their lives. We fried their brains with medication and lobotomized them both chemically and physically. It’s not as common, but it is 100% an insult to tell someone they are insane or acting insane (I mean if they’re bashing their skull into a tree or somethin that IS insane but that would also be an extreme example to call someone retarded over)
But we don’t get upset about calling people insane today… everything has context and I think the context of retard has moved on from why people are offended.
A more apt comparison is being equally mad you called someone slow… I mean… retard is literally a word for slow in French… it kinda really only become ableist when someone wants it to be interpreted that way. At what point is simply calling someone stupid not also then ableist? Are we gonna crucify people if they use any other insult beyond “ignorant” that doesn’t indicate the insultee’s willingness in their stupidity? Or is “you lack/display a lack of intelligence” (the definition of stupidity) somehow more classy than slow and retarded in your eyes?
My 2c is that unless you expect to erase the word (you’re not going to) you’re better off helping to change the meaning in common view (most of us just think it means ya RLY RLY fkin dumb but use a word beyond stupid or idiot) and steal it back from them. Grinding to death and dividing OURSELVES internally over shit this nonsensical is killing us.
It’s an easy code switch that uses their language against them and makes you more credible in their eyes 🤷🏻 as an ally I’m just saying not every battle can be won the way you originally wanted it to be
TLDR: bunch of different justifications for why I call MAGATs retards when they make stupid points in arguments
I don’t know if it’s the circles I’m around or what, but this is not my experience at all. As someone with a nonverbal autistic loved one who was bullied with this slur, I disagree with the idea that it doesn’t cause harm to continue to use it. If someone uses it I ask that they don’t use it around me and that’s been respected. Language evolves over time, and we need to evolve away from using what was relatively recently a medical diagnosis as an insult.
Personally, I think the problem was that they were being bullied, not what specific names they were being called.
I think it’s absolutely fair to ask someone not to use a word that you don’t care for around you. The problem arises when you attempt to make that everyone’s problem, not just yours.
Like don’t use it all? I mean I don’t know the last time I’ve said it but it does have uses besides calling people it. And why is it worse then stupid or slow dumb whatever as I imagine they where bullied with those words also.
Sounds like those bullies are fucking retards
The problem isn’t them being slow/delayed, it’s that they’re inhuman monsters. Hope this helps, words have specific meanings and all that :)
I also find it funny that calling someone a retard is considered less acceptable than calling someone an idiot. Especially when examined under an ableist lens.
Down syndrome, as a genetic condition, is out of their control
Being ignorant is a choice.
100% think it’s a lost cause. I don’t think it’s going away. I don’t personally think it’s ableist and never did.
I don’t think it’s ever going fully away. But it is still important to call it out when we see it.
It never left. Using it still makes you look like an asshole.
All these “free speech absolutists” still don’t realize that free speech does not mean immunity from consequences of that speech from your fellow citizens. It’s almost like they just haven’t paid attention for their entire lives.
I mean, their position falls apart when you ask them what they think about the college students being oppressed for protesting.
They do not care about free speech. They care about experiencing social consequences when using hate speech.
Yes. And it’s just hypocrisy all the way down: otherwise, as you say, we wouldn’t hear anything negative about the left exercising right to protest.
On top of r/conservative is a post about “the algorithm” flooding someone’s feed with news about US protests. Of course, the response wasn’t “hey great! Look at all those people exercising their right to free speech!”. Instead, it’s just bitching and claims of fake news (and no understanding that there really may be significant protests right now – just automatically, they must be false). There is no logic for people who can no longer discern facts from opinions.
I do not care about the word or what language people use broadly, as long as they’re using their “offensive words” to punch up.
If you’re punching up, if you’re attacking power, I do NOT care and genuinely wish people would pull the gloves off more. But Joe Rogan IS power, he is so high up that anywhere he punches is down. People with great power who use language recklessly need to be knocked down for abusing the power behind their language.
So calling Trump a regard is acceptable then?
That’s not a gotcha - tbh the “left”, to the extent there is such a thing in the US, would be more likable if it used the language of the actually existing working class to communicate its criticisms of capital. Tone policing is not an effective way to organize the proletariat or to spread class consciousness
You are a asshole for calling someone retarded. It is so incredibly offensive that you have to be a special kind of jerk to say it.
What about the word is offensive?
Is it just as offensive as calling someone stupid, moronic, dumb, or an idiot?
Is it that insulting someone’s intelligence is inherently offensive? Or is it just that it’s one of the most recent to become medically obsolete?
It is much worse as it implies that they are disabled due to there extremely low intelligence. The word by itself isn’t bad but you shouldn’t call someone retarded.
I believe it comes from the metal retardation diagnosis from 70 years ago or so.
Not trying to be an ass here, just genuinely curious, the words “idiot” or “moron” or “imbecile” which were also in the same diagnostic tools as “retarded” so what makes them different?
I have seen earnest attempts at starting movements to abolish these words as well, (and usually at that point a lot of people start tuning the conversation out,) so I’m wondering where people’s feelings are on the broader topic or if it’s the use of the singular word and how it’s used that bothers people the most.
I think, though I could be wrong, that when many of us were growing up, the words “idiot” and “moron” had already shifted meaning. So we learned them without the connotation of mental capacity and disabled people. But “retarded” still meant both things.
But calling someone an idiot is explicitly insulting their intelligence just the same.
i can only speak for my experience. growing up autistic, i was targeted due to my different ways of thinking and acting for bullying, using the r-word to belittle and demean me, far too many times, for hearing it used to mean ‘bad’ to feel like anything but an attack on me or those like me. when someone uses the r-word casually, it hurts, and a fully automatic system, borne of hard experience, files that person away as a probable threat. i don’t understand why people want to use the word so badly, knowing it hurts people, and knowing it’s not necessary or even all that useful of a word.
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The 90s: I used to use it back in the day, until one time I volunteered for a handicapped kids event, and saw how this one kid with Downs got really upset at someone calling him “the ‘R’ word” (I had never heard it put that way, or even considered it as truly harmful).
Anyway, I wiped it from my vocabulary after that. I still consider it a slur, unlike idiot, which is more generic, and not used as a specific slur against intellectually disabled folks.
Yeah, clearly many people in this thread have never spent any time around people with disabilities, it doesn’t take long to feel an innate disgust for the word and anyone who uses it, short of technical/scientific usages.
You’ve all been able to say it this whole time, just a lot of people agreed it makes you a shithead. That hasn’t changed, and it’s familiar territory for Rogan, so this is no surprise.
Good on you for making that change, and having empathy for others.
Idiot has the same entomology as retard though, does it not? As does stupid? They all start as medical diagnoses and then assholes turn them to slurs and then the medical field refines and renames and things start to repeat.
We had special education class, Special Ed, for kids struggling in certain ways, so if course the shitty kids would call kids “sp-ed” because of course they would.
I’m not sure when the line gets crossed or if we should have gone back or what, but retard, to me, has a very particular connotation that is useful for describing certain people’s actions. I don’t do it any more because I’d rather live in a peaceful society that fosters respect, but it is one of those things I “don’t get”
(I think the conversation here is more about etymology than entomology)
“Sped” is often how teachers refer to special education now too. I was a “sped teacher” for a bit. Referring to a child as “sped” would be gross and dehumanizing, but I think referring to a “sped class” isn’t considered pejorative.
It’s weird how worked up people get about “political correctness.” If you call someone ‘r-tarded’ you’re doing it to upset them, and you are also communicating that the status of having an intellectual disability is so degrading to be considered an insult. I’ve worked with lots of intellectually disabled adults and children - I don’t know that I would want to compare those people I loved and cared for to someone that I would want to insult.
fwiw Sped was used as an insult when I was in school a couple decades ago
i mean it is ONLY used to mock a very specific group of people and, historically, it was used to incarcerate and experiment on them.
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But language changes and evolves, and words get imbued with additional meanings over time through a bunch of complicated factors and contexts.
Just because ‘idiot’ and ‘retard’ were used similarly once, doesn’t mean they’re the same now
We don’t need to fully understand the process in which the word has changed to know that lots of people find it particularly insulting, degrading and oppressive, and to decide to stop using it because of this
Coincidentally, “Rogan” is also an r-word that’s synonymous with moron, imbecile, or idiot.
that’s not how i use it, but if that’s how you use it, than yeah sure. But i don’t.
It is how you use it, even if you don’t mean to.
If you use ‘gay’ as an insult, that doesn’t become OK if you only say it to straight people. It’s still some massive drive by homophobia.
The reason to stop using this as an insult isn’t to protect the people you’re insulting, it’s to protect a third group which has a dark history with the word
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I use it in reference to all Republicans.
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idk how they haven’t choked on their own spit tbh.
the difference between autistic and retarded is that autistic people can actually fight back and say that the use of autistic hurts people
Unfortunately retarded people can’t really do that, have to be the face and name called out at anything an individual thinks of as dumb
What? No.
Clearly you do not know anything at all about those two groups or the myriad of different functional levels the can come with those diagnoses.
Here is a thought experiment, do I need to know someone or something to use their condition as an insult?
Nah you dont.
The way you are using your narrow minded view of autism and the mentally handicapped is not only highly offensive, its also wrong. I have personally worked with and cared for people on the autism spectrum from the level of “nonverbal infant level” all the way to certified savant. Its a spectrum for a reason. I have also cared for people, for literal years, who are diagnosed retarded that are more capable and more functional than the “normal” people i see at walmart. And also hold steady jobs better than their non deficent coworkers.
Heres a thought experiment for you. If the things you say are so blatantly wrong that you get downvoted, called out, and ignored for your offensive views, but still want to double down, are you yourself retarded?
I dont know you. And i dont know your mental acuity. But i am using that word as an insult. That should answer your question i think.
You may introduce yourself as someone knowledgeable, I don’t give a shit, the word is frequently used has gotten bad connotations and influences how others think
I’m sure you’re a good person but you are trying to keep the use of a word up with no reason, using your experience simply to back up that these people are more than what their words claim to be, then using the public’s view of me against me without a proper answer
I don’t see these people as ill in the head, others may, but I don’t, and words DO hurt and they should stop being used
Stop being a dick over a word that gives bad rep to people you personally interacted with and no benefits from its use.
I am not going to change my mind, saying ‘retard’ and ‘austistic’ as an insult is bad and has its more decent alternatives, English doesn’t need to use very personal conditions as insults to begin with. why on earth are you DEFENDING ITS USE?
Bud im not saying that these words are not bad. I never said they weren’t. They are. Im saying that these words have power. Im hoping you get that now, especially now that ive hit a nerve enough, that maybe you can learn off of what you said in your initial comment.
Im asserting that your broad generalizations are equally bad. The spectrum of autism, retardation, and mental handicaps as a whole are so much bigger and more diverse than the assumptions you made. Thats my message. Thats the point im trying to speak. I hope you can eventually see that.
Yeah, it’s definitely not cool to use this word against mentally difficient people. It’s exactly the same as calling them “morons” or “idiots”.
Mentally disabled people are often such kind souls. They don’t need that.
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And i mean, you can make that argument if you want, but then like, where do we stop? Is telling people to kill themselves morally unacceptable
Yes. 🤦 Jfc, “asking me not to use a slur against disabled people is a slippery slope to asking me not to tell people to kill themselves.” Fucking, good!
Btw, you can make your argument if you want, but then like, where do we stop? If I call a straight person the f-slur, is that acceptable? I’m not actually saying it at a gay person, I’m just insulting someone by suggesting that they’re gay. Is it ok for a white person to tell another white person they’re acting like an n-word? Exactly how far are you willing to take this bullshit?
Yes. 🤦 Jfc, “asking me not to use a slur against disabled people is a slippery slope to asking me not to tell people to kill themselves.” Fucking, good!
how many times do i have to explain that im not using it against disabled people.
I like how you completely ignored my arguments.
Is it acceptable for a white person to tell another white person they’re “acting like an [n-word]?” Yes or no.
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I’ve got no stick in this fight but just wanted to chime in and say you’re losing this argument buddy
God, what a shit perspective.
Comparing someone to a category as an insult is also insulting the people in that category regardless of whether the person it’s directed at is part of the category or not. Calling a white person the n-word is offensive to black people, calling a straight person the f-slur is offensive to gay people, and calling neurotypical people the r-slur is offensive to the mentally disabled.
If I call you a “pasta eater” it would only work as an insult if there’s an unstated assumption that eating pasta is bad. If I call you “gay” it only works an insult with the unstated assumption that being gay is bad. This isn’t rocket science.
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That exactly is the verb (“to retard”). You might mean the noun “a retard” which does not have good uses I can think of.
Retardant, retardation, retarding, retarded and a ton of other drives words also do indeed have actual real world meanings and uses that have nothing to do with humans.
Just in case anyone had begun to consider that Joe Rogan is anything but an absolute infected boil on the ass of civilization.
The mother fucker double dips. Pay for his show and still get ads. Fuck that.
That’s your primary grievance with Joe Rogan?
You see, the problem with that word is that people who want to keep it around really make me wanna use it.
Of course retards like Rogan and Trump like that word.
