I’m dumbstruck as to what to do. The US is building literal concentration camps, and none of my co-workers care at all.

In fairness, I work in healthcare with an almost exclusively cishet white population who are financially well off.

Many of them espouse to be Christians, and no one cares at all that the American government is following the exact playbook from Nazi Germany.

What do you do? How do you make people care before it’s too late?

  • SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    3 minutes ago

    The Nazis started under MUCH different circumstances. Also constantly comparing everyone and everything to “Nazis” makes you sound hysterical.

  • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    2
    ·
    32 minutes ago

    In the case of my mother, I instituted a no-politics rule in 2020. However, as of last week, I’m sending her accusatory emails about the various articles of his fucked up actions. I’ve decided that she is partially a bad person for having full info about who and what he is and chose not to know. I’m very angry and she’s going to keep hearing about it. The relationship might be over.

    I know that doesn’t help your situation. I just needed to vent. As noted, I’m very angry. With her in particular. For choosing this again.

  • Anonymouse@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    9
    ·
    2 hours ago

    I heard something on a radio show during Covid on how to talk to people who have “gone down the rabbit hole”. It was discussing MAGA as a cult. The guest on the show was a woman who was raised in a cult in the 70’s and she “got out” and spent her time talking with others in the cult to help them to break free. I can’t find a reference to the show, but I think it was Carrie Miller hosting.

    My takeaway was that you can’t come at people and tell them that everything they know is wrong and you will show them the way. They’ll fight you. You need to deprogram them similarly to how they were programmed into the cult. Small bits, here and there to slowly guide them to questioning their beliefs. Once that happens, show them how to research and seek out information and let them know that they will be safe.

    If someone found a link to the podcast/radio show, I’d be super happy.

  • Float@startrek.website
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    7
    ·
    4 hours ago

    I mean, I care, but what can I do about it? There isn’t a CEO I can shoot to make it stop, nor can I make voting day get here any sooner. All I can do is stamp out ignorance when I see it.

    • Anonymouse@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      3 hours ago

      I think what we’re dealing with, in part, is a collective action problem. There’s a lot of people who want to do something but either don’t know what to do or don’t agree on what to do. It’s one way that a minority population can stay in power.

      What an individual can do is miniscule compared to a crowd. Also, some people are willing to break laws to make change and others are not.

    • Jediwan@lemy.lol
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      4
      ·
      3 hours ago

      There is so much you can do about it, here’s a simple suggestion: promote open censorship-resistant communication systems like Lemmy.

  • psyklax@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    6
    ·
    4 hours ago

    I care, you care, and many of us here on lemmy care. We should work on how to coordinate ourselves together rather than try to change minds.

    I’ve tried, a lot, to change minds. I started with the most difficult person, and recently a new hire at work is kinda centrist-left and I tried to convince him. No matter whether it’s a nazi you’re talking to (ahem… the first one) or a liberal, minds can only change themselves. They have to want it, you cannot hack their brain and override it.

    I gave up, because even the people who are closest to me politically seem to move further to the right when faced with uncomfortable reality. They don’t engage with icky thoughts like “What if police killed an innocent man?”. They rationalize it to keep their comfort zone intact. “Well, if they just followed police instructions…” blissfully unaware of many cases like Daniel Shaver.

    You point to an example that breaks their rationalization, and they will diminish it. “Oh that cop made a mistake”. Point to many examples and they suddenly got to go wash their hair. People’s psyche protects them from stress.

    And that is the default mindset in this society. Avoidance of discomfort and inconvenience. Fear of the unknown. They want their life to be neat and happy and to all make sense. They don’t appreciate it when someone tries to take that away from them.

    Do you think there’s something about people like us that makes us more accepting of challenging our own worldviews? I have some thoughts but I’ve written enough.

  • Viri4thus@feddit.org
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    31
    ·
    edit-2
    7 hours ago

    You can stop using stupid shit like “cishet white” for starters. Statistically, most people who do not care will be cishet white. Those who care, will also mostly be cishet white. With this type of exclusionary discourse bordering on racism, no one will ever listen to you because from the start, you already sound like you have nothing important to say. There’s three types of people in the US: Slaves working 2 and 3 jobs to make ends meet, middle class being pit against the slaves by the third group, the capital. By using exclusionary discourse, assimilated from bougie fake activism, you’re promoting infighting within the classes that should be hunting the capital like animals, the French way!

    Edit: your country has sacrificed countless children to never eschew the right to bear arms. Well, stop bitching online to make yourself feel good and use them.

    • mjsaberOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      13
      ·
      5 hours ago

      I used that term to show that they are privileged folks who likely won’t be directly targeted by the administration, at least at first.

    • tetris11@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      15
      ·
      6 hours ago

      By using exclusionary discourse, assimilated from bougie fake activism

      This is a totally normal, relatable sentence

  • curious_dolphin@slrpnk.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    14
    ·
    6 hours ago

    Lots of good answers here already. I’ll just add that Jon Stewart recently did a great segment that touches on this. Basically, he says if everything the government does is “OmG nAzIz FaScIsTz TrAiToRz!!!” then people who aren’t already paying attention will continue tuning it out. I forget at which time in the video he gets to this point, but honestly the whole 20-minute video is worth a watch.

    • Yardy Sardley@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      3 hours ago

      I love Jon Stewart but I think he’s a little off base with this take. Are we supposed to not call out the overtly fascist stuff the government is doing? Will that get more people to listen the next time we have to call out an overtly fascistic act or will we have to hold our tongue then, as well? How many grannies need to be eaten and impersonated by wolves before we’re allowed to move past the “ooh what sharp teeth you have” crap?

      With fascism especially, if you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the problem. The people going through life like everything is fine are implicitly supporting the fascism. I’m not going to stop yelling about how a pack of wolves has taken over the government, just because some people think the word is overused.

  • Contramuffin@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    2
    ·
    4 hours ago

    I think people tend to have a very narrow view of what goes on around them. And frankly, I don’t think that’s really a bad thing. Everyone does it. It’s just a fact of life. But we have to account for it. Talking about big-picture issues doesn’t work when people are focused their narrow view of the world. Even if they agree with the issue, they won’t be riled up and take action. I think there’s 2 takeaways to this:

    First, regarding talking to the people around you: narrow your focus. Focus on things that affect them directly, or frame things in a way such that they interpret it in a way that affects them. Don’t talk about concentration camps, talk about Trump retroactively rescinding birthright citizenship and how that might affect their lives (especially effective if that person happens to be an ethnic minority or is in a relationship with one). When talking about anti-immigration policies, focus on ICE arresting American citizens because they didn’t look American enough. You don’t have to convince people of everything, you just have to convince people of enough that they feel personally concerned.

    Second, regarding yourself: it’s easy to think that all Americans are similar to the people that you’re with. Society is a bell curve. You don’t need to shift the entire bell curve to the left to exact change. You just need to stretch it out leftward - pull the left leaning people more to the left. Trump didn’t win by convincing leftists to be right-leaning, he won by convincing the right-leaning moderates into shifting right. Consider the audience and pick arguments that would be most effective against that particular audience. Be more direct toward more left-leaning people. Republican? Sow seeds of suspicion toward Trump. Moderate? Make them fear for their way of life. Left-leaning moderate? Maybe we should punish the rich. Leftist? Hell yeah socialism baby

  • sylver_dragon@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    13
    ·
    7 hours ago

    The first thing I would ask is, have you made any attempts to really understand what motivates them and why they believe as they do? Given your flippant dismissal of their belief systems, I suspect you have just mentally bucketed them and, instead of really trying to understand them, you fall back on your per-conceived notions of what you think they believe. Without that understanding, you will never be able to “make people care”, because you are not treating them as fully formed people with their own beliefs and priorities. You expect that, if you just yell at them loudly enough, they will come around. They won’t and, if anything, they will just dig their heels in further. To them, you’re this guy:

    Not everyone has the same priorities you do. What you see as “the most important thing in the world” may fall much further down the list for someone else. They may not even see it in the same framing you do. Maybe they do care about your thing, but they have their own “most important thing” and if your thing and their thing are in contention, they are going to pick their thing. This is part of the reason we have politics in the first place, once you start dealing with other people and trying to decide what and how things should be prioritized and run, you are going to run into differing beliefs and priorities. It’s why most government polices generally suck and don’t get everything done. Because those policies are the result of compromise between people with different and often competing priorities. And yes, it may be that some of those other priorities come from bad information, though more often they will come from radically different base beliefs. And not understanding what those beliefs actually are means that you will not have any sort of basis for convincing them of anything.

    Changing peoples’ minds is hard. But, it starts from a place of understanding people and not dismissing their beliefs. Step back from your outrage for a moment and try to really get in their heads. You may not agree with their position, but you need to understand how they got there before you have any chance of getting them out of it. And, maybe you can’t. It may just be that they have some foundational beliefs which are completely at odds with what you want to convince them of. But, if you know and understand that, it becomes much easier to walk away from the situation and not waste time and energy on a hopeless fight. And while it feels good to yell at people, that basically never works and only serves to push them further away.

    • mjsaberOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      4
      ·
      5 hours ago

      Most of the folks I talk to hear agree with me that things are going wrong, or that x,y, or z is a problem, but not enough to do anything about it. I have heard a few times that, " I want to do something, but I have to protect myself."

      • sylver_dragon@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        4 hours ago

        Most of the folks I talk to hear agree with me that things are going wrong

        That’s not surprising, though be careful on what the definition of “going wrong” is. For example, Emerson College recently put out the results of some polling part of which found that 67% of voters think the US is on the wrong track. It’s highly likely that 67% includes voters from all over the political map. But, while both a hardcore Trump/MAGA voter and a Bernie Bro voter might each say that the US is on the “wrong track”, we’d probably have trouble getting those two voters to reconcile on the color of the sky, let alone what the “right track” would be. Also, be wary of coworkers who actually just want to be left alone and will “go along to get along”. They will tacitly nod and agree with just about anything, so long as you go away and let them get back to work.

        or that x,y, or z is a problem, but not enough to do anything about it.

        Ok, but what is the ask? What are you expecting them to do? And why do you believe that they should be the ones doing it? Again, going back to my previous comment:
        Maybe they do care about your thing, but they have their own “most important thing” and if your thing and their thing are in contention, they are going to pick their thing.

        You may view things as so bad that everyone should be out in the streets protesting 24x7. They may not see it that way. They may put “protecting themselves” at a higher priority than protesting whatever it is you are upset about. This might be especially true if they have families to care for and that can drastically change how people prioritize things.

        Once again, I’d go back to understanding their beliefs and priorities. Why won’t they do the thing you want them to do? It probably comes down to those beliefs and priorities being more important to them than whatever it is you are promoting. And again, I would note your complete dismissal of their point of view. They have given you some insight as to why they aren’t taking action:
        " I want to do something, but I have to protect myself."

        It’s clear they prioritize their personal well-being over the perceived value of whatever you are asking them to do. Why is that? What is it that you are asking them to do that they see it as risky? If your goal is to organize something, can you work to provide them the perceived safety that would get them over that hump? Do they have other issues and their answer is just a proxy to avoid an argument? I’m afraid I’m just repeating myself here; but, you need to really understand them if you want them to change their minds.

        • mjsaberOP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          3 hours ago

          I’m not being dismissive of their view, I understand the need for self-preservation. I think the crux of it is how do I get folks who agree things are going wrong to move from that space into one of more action? Almost everyone I’m talking to at work agrees with me, but no one is interested in organizing or preparing, and that’s what baffles me most.

          I don’t know myself - I don’t have some grand plan or idea. Im a regular person (albeit one with a better historical understanding of history due to education). I’m just scared about what’s coming next, and I’m completely isolated at the end of the day. Rather than buy a bunch of guns and ammo, I would prefer to connect with folks to build mutual support, or to prepare to strike/protest/boycott (or whatever seems most effective at the time).

  • IninewCrow@lemmy.ca
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    32
    ·
    9 hours ago

    Don’t waste your energy on people who won’t listen.

    Look for people, places and groups that support your own beliefs.

    If you can’t find those people at work, then just be nice to them but not too close. Them in your free time, use your energy to support those people and groups you believe in.

    Don’t waste your time on those who won’t listen.

  • ryathal@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    19
    ·
    9 hours ago

    Do you want people to care or do you want to lecture people who don’t agree with you. People like to give lectures on politics, but no one listens to them. If you want people to care you have to care about them.

    • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      9 hours ago

      As someone who admittedly is guilty of “lecturing,” many do enjoy it and have DM’d me or replied thanking me for it. Different people respond better to different approaches, be they the walls of text I am frequently guilty of or shorter questions trying to get them to elaborate on their own understanding.

  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    23
    ·
    10 hours ago

    I spend a good amount of energy trying to explain the merits of Marxism-Leninism and Leftism in general on Lemmy (and IRL, though that’s much trickier). Ultimately, you can’t make someone care. You can’t convince people of something they choose not to want to believe, either, no matter how much evidence you throw at them. Roderic Day wrote a great article titled Masses, Elites, and Rebels: The Theory of “Brainwashing” that perfectly encapsulates this process. People license themselves to believe whatever it is that they believe benefits themselves, regardless of evidence or empathy.

    What you can do, however, is explain the merits of that which you believe in, and this is far more effective with people already targeted by the current system. Those closest to the edge, those radicalized by their conditions but not yet organized or versed in theory, are the perfect people to talk to. The effort required to gain an ally in that sense is far less than someone who is convinced that the system is fine, but just needs a little tweaking. Building strength through organization helps legitimize your positions and expands the circle, so to speak, by moving the “line of radicalization” further. Person A, who believes the system is fine but needs tweaks, goes from comfortably mainstream into the new line of radicalization, one step away from working to supplant the system, when those who were radicalized near them organize.

    Further still, as conditions deteriorate, more people are impacted and more people are radicalized. This is both good and bad, bad in the sense that more are affected by the evils in society to a greater degree, but with the good being further chance of organization.

    Just my 2 cents as someone who has spoken with many different people about Marxism.

  • RotatingParts@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    16
    ·
    10 hours ago

    People won’t care until negative things start effecting them. Even at that point, many will still deny negative things are happening or they will put the blame somewhere else. This is why I believe things are going to have to get bad, really bad, before they can turn around. The biggest thing to go bad would be the economy. An economy so bad would be hard to deny and live with. Unfortunately, the more money you have, the longer you can “deal with” a bad economy, and still think everything is okay.

    • Chuymatt@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      3 hours ago

      That is a particular subset. There are people who see nothing g bad happening to themselves, but do have their eyes open and see the bad things happening around them. But, again, they are ready and primed.

      It is much the same as addiction counseling: until people are primed to change, there is little to do but leave your hand out stretched, not pushing any further than that.