World’s first ‘superfast’ battery offers 400km range from 10 mins charge::Tesla, Toyota and VW supplier CATL says production will begin in 2023

  • GenderNeutralBro@lemmy.sdf.org
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    184
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Not once in the entire article do they measure energy in a unit suitable for measuring energy.

    Measuring batteries in km is misleading and nonsensical. Batteries do not have a distance range. Cars have a distance range, based on many factors, only one of which is battery capacity.

    Similarly, please stop measuring light output in watts that an imaginary incandescent bulb from 30 years ago might theoretically have used to produce that amount of light.

    • audiomodder
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      36
      ·
      1 year ago

      I remember having the light-measured-in-watts discussion years ago when LED lights were still considered a novelty. Of course, this was with a videographer who actually understood the issue. He complained that it wasn’t a good idea to limit car headlights based on their wattage, which is how all the laws at the time were written. 5 years later, suddenly there were LED headlights blinding everyone.

    • TenderfootGungi@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      29
      ·
      1 year ago

      I actually like the compatible watts for light bulbs. They should absolutely also prominently list a correct measurement (I assume linens?), but I only know how bright it is based on the old watt comparison.

      Just like crop frame cameras list lens lengths in full frame equivalent because that is what people understand. But they also need to lose the actual mm.

    • Hamartiogonic@sopuli.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      22
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Stopped reading after: “increase in battery capacity and charge time was achieved through a “brand-new superconducting electrolyte formula” that results in improved conductivity.”

      I guess the source, author or both don’t really care about technically accurate terminology. If it’s good enough for Star Trek, it’s good enough for us.

  • imgonnatrythis@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    69
    ·
    1 year ago

    Show me an article promising substantially better battery tech in less than 5years and I will show you a steaming hot pile of crap.

        • dbilitated@aussie.zone
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          5
          ·
          1 year ago

          always. but saying “oh there’s all these developments and they’re all vapor” - i get sick of armchair experts telling everyone they know better every time on-the-horizon announcements come out. I get not all of them ever get produced, but by current phone has 10 times the battery capacity of my first one, and the quick charge really does give me something like an 80% charge in 15 minutes or so.

          some of these claims are pretty out there but development keeps going and by the time something with high levels of performance is in your car these guys will be smugly crapping on something else to assert nerd authority. i guess it’s just a social niche thing and nothing about batteries 🤷‍♂️

    • frezik@midwest.social
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      21
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      We’re past that point. Every claim you heard in the last 10 years has been researched to its end. Some worked out, some didn’t, but we didn’t need all of them. Just one or two breakthroughs are enough.

      These are going into production this year They’re not lab experiments anymore.

      • imgonnatrythis@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        7
        ·
        1 year ago

        Want to join me on an online betting platform and wager against my statement that you will not be able to purchase what is described here in 2years? We’ve seen these kinds of promises over and over again with battery tech. Slow incremental changes yes. These types of breakthrough reports are consistently garbage regardless of how close to market they claim they are. I presume they put these out to stir up investment.

        • frezik@midwest.social
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          ·
          1 year ago

          I don’t bet, but CATL is a company that already manufactures tons of batteries for EVs. It’s not some fly by night operation hoping to live off venture capital. If it’s not in actual BEVs within 2 years, it’ll be because car manufacturers themselves take longer than that to integrate it into existing designs.

        • Cethin@lemmy.zip
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          I agree that some of it is marketing, some of it is tech bloggers trying to get clicks, but some of it is also real science that does have an effect. You probably won’t notice when it goes into effect, just that battery technology will slowly get better. It doesn’t really matter how fast this can charge until it’s supported in the infrastructure (and most people will charge at home overnight anyway), so you’ll only hear that charging is slowly getting faster over time, not sudden leaps. It doesn’t mean it’s all smoke and mirrors though.

        • Phil@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          1 year ago

          But is this not the tech that Toyota is bring to market ?, they have a working prototype I believe.

          • Roboticide@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            This isn’t. Toyota is claiming they’ll have a solid state battery production ready in a few years, which is a substantial improvement over even what this article is claiming.

            Toyota’s is being developed largely in house it seems, and while they do have prototypes, they’re not really expecting them to be in consumer vehicles until 2027.

            This article is talking about the same old liquid technology with just an improved chemistry.

    • Phil@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      9
      ·
      1 year ago

      But in my lifetime battery tech has improved tremendously. Even in the last 5 years charge density and speed of recharge has had massive improvements.

    • xuniL@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      24
      ·
      1 year ago

      Other challenges include access to battery materials and battery degradation, though CATL claims this second pain point is not an issue with its latest battery.

      • aidan@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        27
        ·
        1 year ago

        If true then that’s the real innovation for me. I don’t want a car that I basically need to replace 70% the cost of every 4-5 years.

        • Player2@sopuli.xyz
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          25
          ·
          1 year ago

          That’s already not the case. Not only do you not need to replace the battery (the range is just slightly reduced over time), the degredation is a lot slower than that.

          • aidan@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            7
            ·
            1 year ago

            Yes reduced range is very important- especially when you live in a cold climate where range is already significantly reduced from that. The cold climate also speeds up the degradation of the battery.

            • Cethin@lemmy.zip
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              4
              ·
              edit-2
              1 year ago

              Do you have experience? Adoption of EV vehicles in Norway is really high without much issue, and it’s likely colder than wherever you live. Plus, 400km is a lot. The average commute in America is 66km. 400km might be used on a fairly long road trip, but if you can charge in 10m it’s not really an issue. The everyday experience is just plug it in at home and it’s done by morning. No gas station visits or anything else.

              • aidan@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                Most Norwegians also have much more disposable income than I. I wouldn’t buy a new gas powered car either.

                • Cethin@lemmy.zip
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  5
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  Sure. That’s probably true but has nothing to do with the viability of EVs on a cold climate.

        • A2PKXG@feddit.de
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          ·
          1 year ago

          Current batteries can do 1000- 3000 cycles before the capacity drops below 80%.

          With ranges of several hundred km this gives us hundreds of thousands km of lifetime mileage, if not a million.

          Most ICE cars don’t get that far either.

            • Roboticide@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              3
              ·
              1 year ago

              That’s not really an honest comparison though, and also kind of simply doesn’t matter.

              Most vehicles will have some expensive component fail well before the engine, and after ~10 years almost any major replacement will cost $5k or more. My suspension gave out at year 8 and it would have cost me $5k to repair my Ford valued at $5k. Who’s going to want to spend that - on an engine or otherwise - on a 15+ year old car unless it’s a particularly well regarded model by enthusiasts? The average consumer doesn’t care.

              The average consumer wants a new car after a decade simply for new features (like sensors or safety), change of lifestyle (like going from a sedan to a van for kids or an SUV to a sports car), or even simply styling and aesthetic. If the battery lasts 5+ years than the average consumer wants the car in the first place, it won’t matter.

              Not to mention that in the coming years, the price of replacing battery packs will likely drop, while the price of replacing engines may likely increase, as OEMs ramp down engine production and ramp up battery production.

            • RandallFlagg@lemm.ee
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              This is probably the biggest reason why I won’t buy a battery powered vehicle right now, and when I try explaining that to people they’re like “well then just lease or sell it and buy a new one lol”.

          • aidan@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            It may have changed in recent years but several years ago when I was more into EVs it was a reasonable concern. But I do somewhat question the legitimacy of this seeing as how quickly small electronics Lithium batteries degrade.

            • DrM@feddit.de
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              4
              ·
              1 year ago

              There are now soooo many studies out showing that capacity in EVs drops significantly slower than ever expected. An EV that is used “normal” is basically best-case for Li-Ion batteries. You are charging the car once to twice a week and then you are charging it slowly over night or at your office, only using fast-charging when you are on roadtrips. You rarely drop your battery percentage below 30% and a lot of cars also dont go higher than 90% capacity without you explicitly activating it

            • A2PKXG@feddit.de
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              3
              ·
              1 year ago

              Do you mean phone batteries? Cause they are often cycled at least once a day. If you drive your ev for 500km a day, yes, don’t expect it to last five years. But I would think an ICE car would handle that either.

              • aidan@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                Electronics batteries degrade within a couple years even with very few cycles in my experience.

  • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    47
    ·
    1 year ago

    Which is great. No need to poo poo it.

    However. Fast charge isn’t really necessary unless you are on a long journey over 400 km and need to charge on route or you drive a lot. Eg taxi Uber etc.

    Best thing ever industry can do for planet would be a 350km car that’s cheap. That’s really what most car users require. They drive to and from work and most drive less than 100km a day.

    Just like a phone you charge over night and don’t need oooodles of range.

    Anyone going on long trips really should be using a train with another vehicle if required at the destination.

    Truckers are a different story and should be separated from the day to days if average car users

    • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      29
      ·
      1 year ago

      However. Fast charge isn’t really necessary unless you are on a long journey over 400 km and need to charge on route or you drive a lot. Eg taxi Uber etc.

      There is a large amount of apartment renters that don’t have access to the preferable overnight slow charging. Fast charging like this article is talking about could be a game changer for that segment of buyers.

      • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        1 year ago

        Huge issue I know. One of the largest barriers to owning Evs. On street charging needs an overhaul and this is where you’d run into a lot of problems.

        • hark@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          8
          ·
          1 year ago

          It would be easier to invent a better battery than to get landlords to do anything that wouldn’t maximize their profit.

      • fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        Given enough time and demand there’s no reason apartment complexes can’t outfit their parking spots with slow chargers. Slow charging a car is much less demanding (and efficient) than trying to fast charge.

        • scottyjoe9@sh.itjust.works
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          10
          ·
          1 year ago

          Our appartement block just voted down getting an engineer in to see what would be required to have car charging infrastructure installed. To be honest I get it, owners don’t want to pay for that for the hypothetical electric car owner in the future.

        • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Given enough time and demand

          You’re talking decades away. Until then better fast charging offers options for apartment/rental dwellers.

      • vithigar@lemmy.ca
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        7
        ·
        1 year ago

        I’m with you 100%. The people downvoting you must live in some idealized fantasy land where public transit is effective and rental cars are easily available and affordable.

        Like you, I live in the real world, where public transit is a mess, the rental market is completely overwhelmed, and charging infrastructure is spotty at best. So I went with a plug-in hybrid vehicle when I needed something new after my 11 year old Lancer got rear ended and written off by the insurance company. Enough electric range for all of my daily driving, but also a gas tank for when I need to exercise that 2% of my driving routine and go farther afield.

        It’s been over 500km since I last filled the tank and so far it’s still full.

        • mriguy@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          5
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Let me get this out of the way - this is my experience, other people may have very different needs and uses. I’m not saying my needs are your needs, or that your needs are invalid. I have a driveway and we were able to install a charger at our house. I don’t tow trailers full of lumber uphill all day. YMMV.

          Getting an EV really opened my eyes to how many wrong assumptions I had about how much I drive and what the pain points would be. I worried a lot that range would be an issue - we got a Bolt, which has a nominal 259 mile range (on the low side these days), it’s fast charging isn’t super fast, and we live in New England, and park outside, so the battery was cold for the first several months we had the car, but we figured we’d adapt. As it turns out, so far there really haven’t been any pain points, and adaptation has been minimal.

          In the winter on very cold days, when we’re running the heater, our realistic range is about 160 miles on a charge. But it turns out, I don’t drive anywhere near that far on a typical day. It’s more like 30-40 miles a day, sometimes a hundred, which is fine. The charger tops up the car in an hour or two, and could charge it all the way from empty overnight easily. Range is a funny thing - the thought of going to a gas station every 150 miles is offputting, but in reality, it’s the opposite - every morning I have maximum range, and NEVER have to go to the gas station, or a fast charger, which is a benefit I hadn’t considered. Now in the summer the range is substantially over 300 miles, and AC uses WAY less power than the heater, so it’s even less of an issue. In fact, I only charge the car to 80% every day to maximize battery life now because it’s fine (I do charge all the way prior to long trips).

          It also turns out we take fewer long trips than I thought (4 in the 7 months we’ve had the car, 2 in the dead of winter). There was a train that went somewhere near one of the 4 locations, at exorbitant cost. The first, 2 weeks after we got the car, was a little stressful as I learned how to find and use fast chargers, but it really wasn’t a big deal. Especially when I figured out how to warm up the battery first, and not to bother filling up, just charging in the fast part of the curve, and parking at level 2 chargers when possible. On our overnight trips, to place with no level 2 chargers, even the super slow 110v charging was enough to keep us from having to worry about charge.

          So the downsides turned out to not really matter (to me), and the plus sides (full range every morning, essentially silent, no smell, and by far the best performance of any car I’ve ever had) are pretty sweet.

          That said, if I got second car, I’d consider a plugin hybrid - that does seem to take care of most of the 2% cases. The knock on them is that they have pretty low electric range (like 30 miles or so) but it turns out that would be fine the vast majority of the time. I’d just have to remember to get the engine to start once in a while.

          • vithigar@lemmy.ca
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            I’d just have to remember to get the engine to start once in a while.

            I can’t speak authoritatively about every PHEV, but the one I have at least takes care of that for you and will run the engine at least once every three months or so if your regular driving habits are such that you manage to stay all electric all the time.

            That said, if your driving patterns are such that you can go 3+ months on the 40 mile EV range without ever dipping into the gas tank maybe you don’t need a PHEV.

        • Kerfuffle@sh.itjust.works
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          1 year ago

          The people downvoting you must live in some idealized fantasy land where

          I’d guess it’s probably because of the “Me, like many others, don’t buy a car for the 98% of drives, we buy it for the 2%” part which just makes no sense. Now, not being able to handle the 2% might justify the car not being the correct car for that person but realistically, people primarily buy a car for what they’re going to use it for the majority of the time.

      • ∟⊔⊤∦∣≶@lemmy.nz
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        Same. I don’t even want to think about the difficulties in transporting 5 mountain bikes without a car, and then hiring a car at the destination that also has a big enough bike rack.

      • jmp242@sopuli.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        Presumably you would rent a special vehicle for the 2% of drives. Of course that’s still inconvenient, and I don’t know where the crossover for others is.

        For an individual there are a lot of factors, and I don’t know all of them because I have never owned an EV or even a Hybrid.

        That said, if I could get rid of stopping at gas stations and oil changes, and have it cost less per mile, those are all plusses for me. But I still weigh it against the still much higher purchase price, and need for electrical work that would probably cost a lot, or 110v charging which would be slower than I’d like.

        I also don’t really want to have a “worse fit to me” next car just to get an EV. I think EVs keep getting closer, but I am still 50/50 if they’ll be there when I’ll need a new car in 5 years.

      • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        11
        ·
        1 year ago

        Absolutely. Has to be actually real life range. Not best case in a lab with nobody in it with everything turned off.

        350km up and down hills in hot/ cold weather with 2 adults and a child in back. Charging phones playing music acceleration and braking.

    • shashi154263@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      12
      ·
      1 year ago

      Fast charge isn’t really necessary

      Totally disagree. I think fast charging is the biggest roadblock we have in making electric cars more popular. Just think how much time filling cars with petrol takes, charging should also take similar time. 10-15 mins would be ok if you also can have breakfast in that time.

      • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        1 year ago

        But you don’t need it. You need a vehicle that gets you a to b. You can charge when you aren’t driving.

        Electric cars will be common once they reach price parity with ice. Why buy an ice that helps prop up the profits of oil cartels.

        If price can get close to ice with good enough range. Cuts out every going to a petrol station again and solar panels will reduce your transport costs. Plus added bonus of less moving parts and no oil changes ever again.

        Plus less noise.

        • wahming@monyet.cc
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          6
          ·
          1 year ago

          It doesn’t matter if 95% of the time you don’t need fast charging. When making a major purchase like a car, most people will consider their extreme use cases. Whether that’s logical or not doesn’t factor in

        • svellere@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          ·
          1 year ago

          Imagine I’m a car salesman who doesn’t give a shit about EVs. I just want to sell a car.

          “This car right here, you can fill 'er up in 1 hour! Oh but this feller, well she only takes 60 seconds, and has twice the range to boot!”

          The average person isn’t going to care that the first car is an EV and the second car is gas-powered.

          Most people can’t afford to get charging set up at home for overnight charging, either. You’re also not considering emergency scenarios where people won’t have time to wait an hour for their vehicles to charge.

          The scenario you’re imagining is an ideal scenario, not working with the current reality we have right now. The industry is working on making EVs charge extremely quickly because they believe it is a major selling point for their vehicles. Which, for the average person, it absolutely is. If EVs want to outsell gas-powered vehicles consistently, they need to meet the basics of being able to fill up quickly and having identical range.

          • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            Isn’t. Just like phone makers are pushing fast charging. Nice to have but not required.

            You and everyone else on this car forum forget. Cars are luxury products that have only been around 100 years.

            We managed before cars. Since the beginning of humans we’ve managed without electricity cars and most other things. We can change the use

              • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                You are making my point for me.

                These are use cases for the current system. A brand new system that didn’t exist 50 years ago.

                We have built our lives around cars. Doesn’t mean we can’t change it. You sound like the same people who refuse to change their habits while the world crumbles around us.

                Too hard not to use plastic for everything. Don’t want to be inconvenienced by anything. Great.

                I’m not selling you a car. Don’t care about you. Selfish people don’t think about anyone else.

    • crossover@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      1 year ago

      Charging at work via solar would be even better. If there was some way for businesses to be incentivised for it.

      • Kbobabob@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        I’d be curious just how much energy you’d get from this. I couldn’t imagine it would be very much. If the solar panels are on the roof and the roof is at least translucent then the efficiency would go way down. Not that i think an opaque roof would do a whole lot better though.

        • vithigar@lemmy.ca
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          ·
          1 year ago

          …why would the roof be translucent? I can’t speak for anyone else, but exactly zero of the places I’ve worked have had naturally lit ceilings.

      • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Why would you need that ? That makes no sense. Unless you drive 350km a day for work. If that’s the case. Stop.

        You aren’t doing any favours for your job your health the planet.

        Get a train or public transportation. Shouldn’t be commuting hours to work. That’s just nonsense

    • dave@feddit.uk
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      1 year ago

      Truckers are a different story and should be separated from the day to days if average car users

      Why not also move freight by train and use smaller delivery vehicles at the destination?

    • Phil@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      This , and I think the price will comedown a lot and soon, market pressure will see to that asap. We have yet to really see the economy of scale that is coming through and r&d for batteries is at a all time high. Plenty of promising developments in the very near future including the one cited in the op

      • Mojojojo1993@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Basically once price hits parity with nice it’s over. Why would you upgrade to ice when they are getting blocked for resale after 2030 in several countries.

        Running cost is cut in half. No oil changes less moving parts and so hopefully less maintenance costs.

        I think honestly for most people. It’s cost.

        If you need a reliable running vehicle and it can get you from a to b. A little of people will look at lowest price.

        Once you start earning more and need certain criteria you have to shop around a bit until you find that.

        Once the market gets flooded with evs the price will start to get pushed down. Second hand market will be great but battery is going to be selling point.

        Anecdotal I was just on a trading site looking at evs. Very few had range listed. Yet that is the most important part of an ev. I need to know range price and to some degree mileage. Batter check ups are going to be key. No point buying a dirt cheap car if battery replacement is 30k.

    • areyouevenreal@lemmy.antemeridiem.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      The issue with this mentality is that lots of people (or even most) can’t charge at home or at work. If you have fast charging cars and enough stations then you don’t need to address this issue and you now have a drop in fossil fuel replacement rather than something that needs lots of new local infrastructure.

      • SeaJ@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Lots of people, yes but far from most. If you live in a house you can at the very least do level 1 charging which will meet you 30-50 miles of range per day.

        • areyouevenreal@lemmy.antemeridiem.xyz
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Literally anybody who lives in an apartment block. Or anyone who’s front door is too far to run a charging cable. Then charging at work is even fewer people. In my country most people can’t park directly outside their house to begin with even if they own a house. This is very naïve.

  • buckykat
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    36
    ·
    1 year ago

    Know what’s better than a battery that charges fast? A train with a catenary that never has to charge at all

    • Ghyste@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      34
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s not remotely realistic to expect a sudden drastic change in infrastructure like that. While we should work toward such goals, statements like this are ignorant of the time and efforts necessary to affect such change.

      • oryx@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        18
        ·
        1 year ago

        I’m getting so sick of the anti-car crowd commenting this stuff on anything related to cars. Like yes, we know, public transportation is good and a great goal. But they’re just so out of touch with reality most of the time.

      • Trekman10@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Kinda telling on yourself by calling it “drastic”. What exactly is “severe” or “rapid” about supporting alternative methods of transportation?

      • randomtask@lemmy.sdf.org
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        It doesn’t. Public transportation only really works in dense environments. The rub is that the default mode of development across the US has been suburban sprawl, which basically makes the “last mile” - from the bus/train route to your house / business / shops - impractical.

        Best we can do given this state of affairs is build good transit and densify around the stops with infill development. Continuing the pattern of sprawl just makes every problem related to transportation harder - longer commutes, more traffic, higher amount of energy consumed to get from point A to point B.

        Anyway, hope this battery tech works out because a lot of us are stuck with expensive personal vehicles as our only viable option given the way our cities are laid out.

      • Trekman10@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        Ugh, me? Living in a SOCIETY where I have to PAY for things I don’t USE?! What’s next, paying for SCHOOLS when I don’t have KIDS?!

    • Trekman10@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Damn, you really incensed a whole bunch of people who seem to like living in soulless, identical car-centric hells. What normal person thinks you expect “a sudden drastic change” from a silly comment like this?

      • buckykat
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Thing about reactionaries, they tend to react