- cross-posted to:
- apple@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- apple@lemmy.world
All smartphones, including iPhones, must have replaceable batteries by 2027 in the EU::undefined
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Thank fucking god for the EU, for fighting for global digital rights where nobody else does.
We have a fake economy. All investments, researching and efforts could be decided by state (we/public). Protecting society interests and not “investors” interests is an obligation
One sensible right doesn’t overweight the never-ending bullshit coming from them.
And imo this is not a sensible right. To change a battery in phones is easy even now. All you need is heat gun (hairdryer), new battery, phone tape (2$ ali) and 30 mins of your time…
Also watter resistance will take a hit… I wouldn’t sink my phone under watter with detachable back cover even if it had ip68 by producer. They don’t even cover it in reclamation now.
Compare to how it used to be, removing the battery cover and replacing the battery on the fly. And water resistance with removable batteries has been and can be done. Stop with this nonsense.
One sensible right doesn’t overweight the never-ending bullshit coming from them.
True. Between the private healthcare, abortion rights, school shootings…
Oh wait, you weren’t talking about the US?
Does this mean we could potentially order phones from there as US folks?
Doubt Apple will have 2 different devices for each area.
Apple in 2027: This is not a battery, it’s a…umm … Ultra High Density Low Current Super Capacitor.
EU: Ok, then in addition to that UHDLCSC you also need a removable battery.
Yay! Another dongle!
And apple consumers will celebrate it.
Removed by mod
Introducing the UHDLCSC portable charger (which it technically a battery you can attach via USB-C-iLightningSpec©)
It might actually force them to develop inductively powered devices or some similar magic
All we need now is a headphone jack
We need SD cards more. They removed them so they can charge you 300 $ to upgrade 128gb and to force you into shitty cloud service.
Again, just anti consumer bullshit spearheaded by Apple and gargled by Samsung.
I have flashbacks to using external storage on Android. It was such a shit show of an API. That being said, external storage, to break away from cloud storage is the next needed thing. We need to own the data.
When you design an OS to pretend there’s no such thing as a file, it ends up being bad at handling files.
Yeah, even today, browsing through files on Android is a fucking mess. And there isn’t an SD card.
So the SD card wasn’t the problem
I was trying to figure out recently how do I copy files into application user data directory, it turns out you just can’t, lol.
You can with very basic root tools, but really that just solidifies your point. It’s an easy thing to do, but they’ve intentionally taken away the ability for no good reason
It’s perfectly fine on Sony Xperia.
Which did away with the headphone jack and asks €400 for crap performance.
Nah I’m sticking to my Samsung XCover
Xperia IV aren’t crap performance but they are 3x €400
It was the SOC that wasn’t great. Nothing to do with the manufacturers.
Mobile Linux seems to carry it really good
Again, just anti consumer bullshit spearheaded by Apple and gargled by Samsung.
Samsung was actually one of the later Android manufacturers to drop it is my recollection.
Yeh and fuck them
Agreed
Definitely. Never understood why some manufacturers removed jacks
I personally prefer my bluetooth headphones, but it’s not like bluetooth and jacks can’t exist on the same device…
Plus, pairing bluetooth in a car can be annoying as fuck. Looking at you, Nissan
I feel like BT pairing and functionality in cars has always been shit. I have issues in my 2020 Ford, had issues in my 2015 and 2018 bmws, and my gf has issues in her Toyota.
BT pairing in our Ram works fine, and it works fine with the aftermarket Pioneer radio in my car. I’ve never had a major issue with either one with any phone I’ve owned, iPhone or Android.
For our Mazda, though, BT pairing does not work reliably with my Samsung S21 - it’s okay for phone calls (in fact, the car “steals” my calls if I’m on the phone at home and my wife gets home with the car), but for music it almost never works correctly, unless I’m also using Android Auto, which is rare because I just don’t need it for most day-to-day drives. The BT phone and music works fine for my wife’s iPhone, though.
I blame the car - my phone works just fine with several sets of Bluetooth headsets, and the other two car stereos. I think Mazda just didn’t bother to do any debugging before they shipped that piece of shit to the dealers. (This theory is based on other bugs we’ve found in the infotainment system as well.)
Because they do the bare minimum to meet the spec so that they could advertise it then. They still do the bare minimum now.
Yeah I want a headphone jack, but the truth is that I can’t remember the last time I used mine. I have an old phone plugged into an old amp that I can play Spotify through, otherwise I use bt.
Yeah, they could coexist. I’m partial to non-bluetooth, but only because they come in shapes that I find more comfortable, and I’ve yet to find bluetooth ones that don’t make my ears hurt
You know there’s ways you can change that, right? There’s different sizes you can get for the piece that goes in your ear and they often come with the headphones/ear buds.
Yes, I just haven’t found any that I found comfortable with yet
Money from selling true wireless earbuds was too enticing. Even Fairphone made them and removed headphone jack and spat nonsense that it was a “point of failure.”
Headphone jacks are a 19th century invention, if having them restricts innovation then I am all for removing them.
We can’t only consider innovation today, we also have to consider its ecological impact. Jack plugs and headphones are way more durable than Bluetooth equivalent. I have 16 yo jack headset that still works perfectly, I only had to change the cushions twice.
It’s specifically the wire that always breaks first. How can they be more durable?
You can repair a broken cable fairly easily.
When you buy wireless headphones you know upfront that they will die within a few years and you will not be able to replace the tiny glued in, oddly shaped batteries they come with.
I like the convenience of BT at times, but I really miss having headphone jacks and hate having to bring adaptors with me.
If you can financially, buy (second-hand) higher-end material, it will come with stronger wires and stronger connections.
For example, see the difference in the constraints damper on these connectors:
vs Apple’s:
Jack being simple technology, it’s also very easy to get it repaired by the nearby tech enthusiast armed with a soldering iron.
To add to that, many IEMs (and many other headphones too probably) come with removable cables.
So stop making any technological advancement because of the potential impact of e-waste? Not saying it’s a bad thing but it will have have its own environmental implications. No new energy development, we have to rely on existing oil and nuclear technology rather than investing in making renewable energy sources cheaper and more efficient.
It’s not an either-or situation, we can do both at the same time, we just have to consider environmental impact as an essential component of innovation.
At the point we are at, yes we have to make a major change, e-waste is an immense problem for many years and we are only starting to fight it.
Inventions not thinking about e-waste at all shouldn’t be allowed anymore.
So are speakers and batteries.
True, but we don’t have any practical alternatives for them.
What’s the practical alternative to headphone jacks? Bluetooth is crap and carrying around extra dongles is annoying.
Bluetooth headphones are more practical due to not having wires. Jack is better for latency.
Practical for some scenarios, but impractical in others. A headphone jack also offers better sound quality overall and a less flaky connection, with no audio cutouts. It’s not just latency, it’s a superior and more reliable way to transmit high quality audio. And there’s no battery to worry about charging. And a standard set of wired headphones can last for DECADES while a Bluetooth headset will start to die in about five years or less because the battery is non-replaceable lithium-ion. And there’s no concern about whether your wired headphones are optimized for Android or iPhone, it’s a standardized connector with an identical experience on both. And there’s no issue with wireless interference on the 2.4GHz band that Bluetooth operates on.
I can come up with more if you want.
Technically 20th century, if I’m not mistaken? I just don’t see how they would restrict innovation, I guess
Apparently it’s based on a plug invented in 1878, according to the BBC.
Interesting! It’s cool to know how stuff we use/used was developed
By that logic let’s just replace the most superior household plug. The 3 pin UK plug.
A “19th century” technology that objectively produces better sound quality and uses less energy. And I already have wired earbuds and headsets.
Unless there’s an alternative, no it’s not restricting innovation.
The argument was saving space for other parts. That’s true in a way. But if things needed we should have this space. What’s next? Saving the space of the charger? /s
I’d be almost ready to say that we don’t need them any more if Bluetooth headphones were about 100x better and cheaper
At the same time, wired earphones/headphones are already just as good with a lot less parts/complexity.
You don’t need batteries, radios, and chips for coding/decoding a signal coming out of a headphone jack. You can just plumb it straight into the speakers. No need to mess with controls and all of that, which would make them a lot cheaper.
Don’t forget how new Bluetooth headphones require that you download an app to set up the headphone. So a whole new data harvesting broker forces itself right where an audiojack used to be.
Check on the AppStore’s the kind of personal data one has to handover to tune the headphones. Total fuckery!
Bluetooth 5+ definitely made wired headphones obsolete for me.
But now you have to charge two things rather than one. Some people would prefer not to have to do that.
Still too much lag. I love my QC45s, but there’s still just enough lag to bother me
Bluetooth headphones are solid now, as long as you have something that supports aptx HD and LL (HD for music, LL for movies/games). But yeah they’re not cheap.
Can’t imagine that getting mandated unfortunately
I came across this insane opinion piece the other day: https://www.laptopmag.com/features/mind-eurown-business-for-the-sake-of-the-iphone-apple-needs-to-fight-back
It’s so surreal, it feels satirical
Say, “We at Apple, Think Different.” and refuse to be shepherded into the flock with the likes of the dirty android heathens. You can’t give in so easily. First, they’ll take your Lightning ports, then they’ll take your internal battery and IP68 rating, and before you know it, they’ll take your blue iMessage bubble too.
At that point, why even bother? You might as well throw a Qualcomm Snapdragon in the next iPhone and call it a day. Congratulations Apple, you have the best UI of any Android phone on the market.
What the actual fuck?
You swear this isn’t satire?
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I haven’t heard of this. What does it mean?
Messaging services need to be interoperable.
I love how higher IP rating is always the argument, it looks like everybody in this planet is doing daily deep diving and needs its smartphone to do that 😅
Phones with IP67 or even IP68 exist with easily replaceable batteries.
You’d think they’d figure out a way to have those high IP ratings and have removable batteries (they have afaik)
Are you sure it isn’t satire? I prefer to believe it is.
I… Couldn’t even make it through the whole article. Absolutely insane.
I sure hope it’s satire, but that pun!
“Mind EUROwn business?” chef’s kiss
Man, Tim Apple sounds pissed.
Looking at this guy’s other articles, unfortunetly it does not feel as satire.
truly astounding levels of corporate simping
it feels satirical
That’s because it is satire.
The fact that some of the gen Z crowd think it will be horrible have forgotten that it was much easier to carry 2 batteries and swap them out vs carrying a charger and cable with you everywhere. Pop in the new battery, power it on and carry on with you now full battery phone. Being tethered to a wall so you can have 10% from 20 minutes of charging is crazy.
Don’t forget the option to carry a 30lb battery bank everywhere with you so you’re at least tethered to something marginally more movable than a wall.
Seriously though, I miss my phone+battery in one charger and the ability to restart with full battery at around 4pm.
I know you are intentionally exaggerating a bit, but they do make pretty small portable chargers. I have an Anker PowerCore 5000, it has 1-2 full charges depending on your phone, and easily fits in a pocket
Yeah, definitely joking. Mine is 24,000 mAh and weigh less than 1.5lb allegedly.
I used to do this. I thought it was awesome but I was literally the only person I ever knew who did this. It was not a popular thing to do.
Zero lemon had them so cheap that I had 4 extra batteries (they also had the extended batteries that would last forever but the cases were janky). I would keep one at work, one by the door to take with me and two at home if you include the one in my phone that I would swap out. I rarely charged my phone at all, just the batteries. I loved it.
Most people did not do this nor needed to since the very beginning of cell phones
We literally do not need replaceable batteries in 2023
Maybe, but you have to admit that battery live used to be longer (specially pre-smartphones), if your phone could comfortably last a couple of days there was less need to have portable power.
I fondly remember the convenience of having a flat, replaceable battery in my pocket even in the early Android days, and I’ve missed it ever since it went away.
The main reason I’m thinking of upgrading my mid-range phone now is the battery is on its last legs.
In fairness it’s lasted 6 years, which is two years more than my Nexus 4 got. Pokemon Go eventually killed that.
I don’t know when we all just collectively accepted that batteries should last one day and not a second more. Sure, it’s doing more than a Nokia 3310 ever did, but sometimes you really do need it to last more than that, like when travelling.
I’d much rather just have a bigger battery. Replacement is more useful for longevity for me.
You’re not going to get a bigger battery though. Battery size is a pretty much maxed out, the only way to make a battery bigger would be to make the battery physically bigger. This would make the phone bigger / heavier. So it’s not going to happen.
If you are waiting on some magic new battery chemistry it’ll come along eventually but you’ll be waiting a while, and stubbornly not having a replaceable battery in the meantime isn’t going to make any difference.
There’s some huge battery breakthroughs going on right now. You’re right though, I would give it another 5 or so before they’re widespread among phones.
It will also likely mean easier repairs. Louis Rossman just did a video on this
This. People read this and think about the removable batteries of Nokia bricks and plastic hardshells, but this would really hamper with IP68 rating. It probably just means the users must be able to replace the battery themselves, instead of artificially locking it down with DRM. And maybe provide some documentation. Otherwise phones would become so much worse, than they have been for more than a decade.
Louis was saying ‘Does everyone have collective amnesia?? We had IP68 phones with removable batteries already!’
I only remember the Samsung rugged ones, which do not look great. Some compromise will be needed to get removable batteries into phones. Compromises the buyer of a gold iPhone Pro Max to flex their wealth won’t appreciate. Not DRMing batteries and giving users access to documentation and tools for replacing the battery requires almost no compromise from no one (except a tiny dent in Apple‘s balance sheet, which they will recover from, I’m sure).
The Samsung galaxy S5 were IP67 rated with removable battery.
And was one of the least successful S series phones.
They also featured optional wireless charging, despite you being able to pop open the back and replace the battery.
Stand back everyone, I’m going to attempt nuance.
Industrial design is about tradeoffs. Making the battery easily replaceable will come with drawbacks. Maybe it’ll be size, or water resistance, or durability, but something will have to be compromised. The extent of the compromises remains to be seen, and people will have different opinions about whether it’s worth it.
Ordinarily I’m not a fan of regulators making product design decisions, because that’s exactly the kind of thing market forces are supposed to be good at. In this case, though, there’s a demand that’s clearly not being met, and companies clearly have a vested interest in pushing consumers toward replacing their old hardware rather than repairing it, which creates externalities markets are unable to account for. Market failures like this are exactly the kind of situation where government regulation is needed.
If by size you mean it’s going to become fatter, I’m all for it. PSP Slim was basically as slim as I need for things which go into my pocket. Laptops don’t, so these can be twice fatter than that.
About “market failures” … This particular “market failure” is strongly connected to patent law, which cuts down most of the potential competition. So maybe it’s not a “market failure” at all if you have monopolies and oligopolies because of patents. Because patent law is not a market mechanism, obviously.
Industrial design is about tradeoffs
Nope, for battery removal, nope!
Are you going to say that pentalobe screws is also a trade-off.Also, smartphone are just too thin and it’s because you use a case that you tend to forget about it.
It’s fine to say that the tradeoff doesn’t matter to you because you’re fine with the extra size, but it’s kind of absurd to claim that there’s no tradeoff and also claim that the tradeoff isn’t a big deal in the same comment. Some people may prefer the slimmer size that non-removable batteries allow, and we should at least accept that a downside of this regulation is that those people will be left with fewer thin options, even if it doesn’t seem like a big deal to you or I.
My phone has a removable battery and it’s like 7-8mm thick.
I take in account what has been done by the past in the last decade, a Samsung Note 4 (8cores, 4Gb, etc…) had its battery easily replaceable and it is not any bigger than an iPhone 14!
Sorry, but that’s an awful comparison, and it isn’t even true. The Note 4 was actually ~10% thicker than the base iphone 14, despite having a smaller screen, slightly smaller battery, and not having waterproofing. Obviously most of that discrepancy is because the Note 4 is 8 years older than the iPhone 14 so it really isn’t a fair comparison, but I wasn’t the one that tried to make the comparison in favor of the Note 4.
We really don’t have any reason to disagree, we’re both in support of the new law. I agree with you that the drawbacks are probably going to be minimal and that the tradeoffs will likely be worthwhile, I just still think that it’s dishonest to say that we know for certain that there will be absolutely no drawbacks, or that phones with no drawbacks have existed. I’m just asking for a little bit of nuance instead of dogmatism.
I am not fighting you, pal. I just want to avoid the argument “it’s not because you don’t need it that bla-bla”, of course, I prefer protection but we need to find the right tradeoff, Glueing case, removing and risking to break a glued expensive and serialized screen to reach the battery: nope
Sorry, but that’s an awful comparison, and it isn’t even true. The Note 4 was actually ~10% thicker than the base iphone 14,
You don’t get it, first 10% (actually ~6%) is pretty ridiculous and I took the biggest phone at the time that people were buying and using, actually I still have it. :) We could take the Note20, which is 0.830mm thick (0.785 for the 14 Pro Max and as big). Clearly, in this model, the backplate wouldn’t have needed to get glued, if +0.020mm is all it needs to get a removal plate, let’s got for it. I take extreme high-end smartphone as a ceilling, smartphone too big to my taste but which people buy and use.
*When I’m back from traveling, I will compare my wife’s iPhone Pro max and my Note4, to see if this one is unacceptable. :)
You’ll still want a case even if the phone becomes thicker, so in the end you’ll still end up with more bulk?
where did you live the last 10years when battery were replaceable on highend smartphones?
Replied to the wrong comment?
Considering Samsung during their cost cutting days designed Galaxy Xcover Pro 2 without drawback just fine, I think everyone will be able to do it without drawback just fine as well.
Maybe it’ll be size, or water resistance, or durability, but something will have to be compromised.
definitely size at the least. We’ll probably have to go back to removable backs so I imagine water proofing will be difficult without adding at least a little size.
It’s NOT just phones.
It’s EVERYTHING with a battery. Including cars, laptops, e-bikes, video game controllers, headphones etc. (im not even sure if there are exceptions, such as tiny tiny “airpod” like things… ?)
And they must be (with a few exceptions) replacable by a “layman”, without the use of special tools - which means no heat pads, to soften up glue etc etc. (and for gods sake, i hope it also means apple can’t hardwareID lock a battery)
an exception mentioned in the EU document about the law says, high power batteries for example in an electric car, must be done by a profesional - but of course it still has to be “replacable” and not… tear the whole car apart and rebuild it using new batteries.
replacable batteries in headphones, bluetooth mice, laptops etc, is gonna be awesome.
and lets not forget, they have to recycle the old ones - and produce new batteries using recycled materials.
in fact, i will try to hold on replacing my current (2 year old) phone, and wait to get one before 2027. Usually the battery turns to shit in 3ish years.
Coming soon from Apple. Screws that require a 4D tesseract shaped screwdriver to undo.
But if you can undo them, feel free to change the battery.
The EU defines user replaceable as you can remove the batteries with common tools. Common tools is defined as a Phillips or flathead screwdriver. So even Nintendo and their stupid try-force screw thing won’t be acceptable.
If that’s really the definition, it’s an awful definition and exactly why we shouldn’t regulate stuff like this. Torx are objectively better than Philips or flathead in every possible way.
As long as the tool isn’t proprietary it’s acceptable. If I can go to a hardware store and buy the interface tool then it’s fine, but it’s not fine if I have to get it from a special manufacturer or if it’s proprietary.
In the case of Nintendo I gave; Nintendo have their proprietary tri-headed screw. They do not make The tri-headed screwdriver publicly available, of course companies have copied them and so you can get one that way, but they’re not official, so my understanding is that that would not be acceptable. Nintendo would have to officially release the tri-headed screw design, and they’re probably just more likely to switch to a different already public screw design.
I also think they are allowed to just glue the batteries in as long as they have pull tabs. Which is probably the better option.
My point is Apple won’t be allowed to just come up with some brand new screw design that no one else has ever seen before. Unless they open source the screw head. In which case I guess it doesn’t matter. But they’re not going to do that because there would be no point.
Well if you broaden the definition that much, then it sounds like iPhone batteries are already user replaceable since I can easily purchase the necessary tools from iFixIt.
Again, this is not official. Just because somebody has grogged a way too interface with their proprietary screw heads doesn’t mean that the design is public domain, and the requirement is that the tool set is public domain. Apple’s screw heads are not better than Phillips heads so they’re only doing it to be awkward that’s the point, they’re not allowed to do that anymore. So just because you can technically get the screwdrivers doesn’t make it acceptable.
You’re acting like I’m being unreasonable I’m just telling you what the law is it’s not my fault you haven’t read up on it
That’s the reason I bought a set of screwdrivers for apple and there was also the tri-headed included. It was just 5 bucks and I am really happy with them.
Anyway, I just hope they go further in their law like a replacement without any screws. Why not just use the way a laptop battery will be changed? Just click it out easy.
It’s pre-drilled holes and small screws, Phillips is perfectly fine.
Most batteries are currently held in with some sticky glue, so I’m sure 4 random off the shelf screws would be sufficient. We’re not mounting plasma screen TVs to plasterboard here.
As someone who works with small electronics, Phillips is NOT perfectly fine at small sizes. Below a PH1, the torque required to unscrew a long thread and the torque required to cam-out and strip the head get very close together.
I agree that Torx might be better for things that require a lot of torque, but mobile phones?
I just stripped half the screw head in my steam deck because none of my bits would fit just exactly right. I’d have been thrilled about finding torx there.
I’m sure apple will happily sell you the proprietary tool to turn their proprietary screws for a very reasonable price.
They’re not allowed to do that. The tool design has to be freely available for any manufacturer to fabricate free of charge, they’re not allowed to try and use this as a profit making exercise.
I don’t know why it is that every single time the EU comes up with a law there’s always people in the comments that say it’s a bad law and that they haven’t thought it out, when they’ve not read the documentation. All of the little tricks that the companies might come up with to turn this to their advantage have already being thought of and protected against. This is exactly what happened with the mandating the USB-C port.
Laws being made in good faith and corporations taking advantage of ambiguities or loopholes for “compliance” has been the staple of western corporate lore. I’m sure many of those commenters would love replaceable batteries with usb-c port on their phones too.
Sure but if anybody clicks through to read the article they can see the full wording of the law. It goes on for pages and pages it’s far from ambiguous. This isn’t just something they thought above on a random Friday afternoon this is something that’s been worked on for a few years now.
Yes, but then there’s this decades-long tradition of Lemmy/Reddit/Digg/Slashdot/etc users not reading the actual article and comment based only from headlines often crafted to maximize engagement.
Exactly, the law definitely defines that the tools have to be commonly available with no restrictions or proprietary rights, and that any tools that don’t fit under that definition must be provided free of charge. It also lists a few practices that are outright banned regardless of availability, like needing thermal or chemical tools. They’ve been very thorough.
Ahh yes, screws that can only be unscrewed using The Force
Honestly good. Usb C is so good.
I have a couple of 100w chargers around the house, no messing about can charge nearly everything at full speed.
You can already replace your own iPhone battery without any technical expertise. I hope the law is more specific than that, because there are many things OEMs can do to comply and still make it a giant pain in the ass to do.
Can you, though? No, you can’t. Its really hard to get right and super easy to fuck up. Source: Me.
So is changing out any part on your car. It remains to be seen how this is applied.
With my shaky hands and clumsiness? I’d kill my phone just by touching the innards.
Technical expertise includes really basic things like being comfortable using a screwdriver on delicate equipment. Lots of people lack that level of expertise.
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*batterie exists out of two parts. One of them is fused to the screen.
Pesky EU throwing their weight around giving consumers more rights! --Brexiteer logic
Oh well hopefully we’ll (UK) still benefit from it. Easier to design one phone than “EU” and “Rest of world” versions after all.
Easier to design one phone than “EU” and “Rest of world” versions after all.
I mean … sometimes those companies consider it preferable to actually have two versions.
That’s already happening though. The US version of the IPhone doesn’t have a physical Sim while the “rest of the world” version does.
That’s a fairly minor alteration though compared to the redesign required to have a removable battery …
Not a bad idea but there are flaws and this also doesn’t seem to address the issue of pricing or availability.
- So you can remove the battery, will you be able to buy one.
- They could prevent 3rd parties from making batteries that work.
- They could just not sell battery replacements.
- They could add more parts needed, like seals, screws that strip too easily, that annoying sticky tape etc.
The your last point the text specify that batteries can be safely removed and replaced using “basic and commonly available tools” and “without causing damage to the appliance or batteries.”
Yes, with basic and common tools. Doesn’t mean they have to be of quality, cheap metal screws for example. Hopefully not the case but it’d be annoying.
For example if they opt for the screw method, over the pop-off back (which I’d prefer). There will be screws to remove, most likely a gasket to replace, tape or something that ensures the battery doesn’t move around etc.
Even with current battery replacements, there is more parts then just the battery during the replacement. And of course “without causing damage” except if you have to remove the back that is glass and knock it off the table, that’s a +1 for apple, same if you loose a tiny screw or something else that is 1/1000 chance but Apple still makes money.
We already have regulations about spare parts availability and pricing for some devices (mainly household appliances) - and it is planned to slowly enforce regulation for other device types over time. They’ll watch the market, and if apple decides to be stupid that’ll come pretty quickly.
Just like with the appliances where some vendors had their shops ready way before regulation we already have some phone vendors prepare for that - like Nokia selling some spares via ifixit. So if apple decides to play stupid games it’ll be up against vendors that’ll be completely fine pushing regulation through quickly as hurting apple will only benefit them.
I had a washing machine where the price of the replacement motherboard (ludicrous this is this even a thing, btw) was triple the price of the entire washing machine.
Making parts available doesn’t make it realistic to repair stuff.
replacement motherboard (ludicrous this is this even a thing
A lot of energy and water savings in modern machines are due to the electronics used. Also, replacement of weight to keep the machine from wandering around during spin cycles with sensors and attempts to rebalance laundry, if necessary.
was triple the price of the entire washing machine.
The EU commission is aware of that, though for now hopes their ecodesign initiative for repairable products will be enough to push vendors in the right direction. Given that all of this is pretty new it’s quite impressive to see how some vendors are embracing it already - I first noticed it when replacing an ancient kitchen oven, and in the shop next to spare sheets I could get all electronic components used in that thing.
I imagine they’ll monitor the situation, and will have a chat with problematic companies based on that, or consumer protection complaints - like they did with the switch joycon drift thing, which I think was one of the first instances where eco design was referenced as reason for taking action.
Information like this gives hope for a better tomorrow.
Just like with the appliances where some vendors had their shops ready way before regulation we already have some phone vendors prepare for that - like Nokia selling some spares via ifixit. So if apple decides to play stupid games it’ll be up against vendors that’ll be completely fine pushing regulation through quickly as hurting apple will only benefit them.
You mean like Apple’s Self Service Repair, which has been available for a few years now?…
You mean like Apple’s Self Service Repair, which has been available for a few years now?…
Sure, if you call 1.3 years a few years…
This insufferable shit is exhausting
Back in 2014 you just bought a spare and replaced it, nowadays they all want to play the same bullshit games Apple innovated on. It was was about time an authority that ruled over a market with significant purchasing power made a decision against it.
Although I think it’s too expensive, this is why we need frame.work to make a phone too (or any company to do this). Great idea, good products, their markup just seems too high imo.
Is the glass half full or half empty? For you, I guess it’s half empty.
Rules can be updated and tightened if needed. This is a good step, another could be taken if they don’t play nice.
I don’t see how you decide what my beliefs or views are by a single message, interpreted by you. Pretty unfair to assume not to mention when I already stated “Not a bad idea”. But your message makes a great point, the glass is half full and they have more work to make it full.
Of course it’s a step in the right direction. However, it could be better if they included more than just requiring the battery to be removable before hand. As is we have to wait until 2027, and then further delays for adjustments to be made etc. Why not spend the time now to add to it to ensure an available market.
You made 4 points about things that may or may not happen. For some of them you made the worst assumption possible (eg: batteries may not be available to buy. As if China won’t go brrrrrr making them :P ). And that’s why I said that “I guess” that for you the glass is half empty (aka you’re focusing mainly on possible issues).
You might be right of course, but keep in mind that the main players (eg: Samsung, Apple) already sell some components to 3rd parties or are starting to do so. Even Apple, with all their control, don’t disable 3rd party batteries on their phones, they just show you a warning inside the settings menu. So, from a slightly different point of view, the glass is actually half full and you may not need additional rules. I guess we’ll have to wait and see if someone wants to piss off the EU and have more rules imposed on them.
Anyway, it was a quick reply to the top comment on this thread (when I opened it at least). I didn’t spend much time trying interpret your comment :P
The neat thing about EU regulations is that they are iterated over constantly, so even if they don’t get it 100% right the first time, they’re able to nail things down in subsequent iterations. Look at how quickly they struck down any fantasies Apple had of still fucking people over with their own type c implementation fuckery. The direction the EU is taking is already doing plenty good for the entire world.
If i remember right, all those shitholes are addressed?
To be honest, some may be to an extent but I’ve heard of issues. The last one, I don’t see how it can be address “add more parts needed, like seals, screws that strip too easily, that annoying sticky tape etc.”. Because they may take extra steps to ensure durability and integrity (mainly to just make more $$ from those doing it themselves.).
I also find it odd because for me at least in the US, it cost me less than $100 for a iPhone 13 Pro Max battery replacement after a little more than 1yr of use, primarily went out due to extreme cold weather. Is the problem more towards a lack of authorized repair locations or their pricing? I’m sincerely curious what is the root issue here.
You paid $100 for a battery replacement!?!? My Galaxy S7’s second battery cost us $12!
“it must be easy to replace a battery without any kind of technical expertise.”
Yes, and it would still not require “any kind of technical expertise.”. That doesn’t mean the battery replacement process couldn’t include replacing gaskets, screws, tape during the process to ensure a safe and functional device since it’s still being opened. They may even sell it as a kit?
There is still so much left vague or not even mentioned, I just wish it was better off the bat. Of course, as mentioned it’s a step in the right direction but there are holes that could be filled before people get screwed over.
They could start selling tiers of battery quality which TBH sounds awful if they make the best battery life duration paywalled.
Making them easily replaceable will create a market, a better one than we have today, almost any battery you can buy today as end-user are trash-tier.
Quality 3rd party batteries will rise up if the phone manufacturers fuck around.
Yeah, that’s possible. I’m more worried about a built in battery chip preventing users from sharing batteries, like once it’s installed, it’s activated and it’s locked to that device. Meaning you’d have to buy only from that manufacture and the price will be higher.
I’m hopeful that the EU would put a stop to this. They are pretty progressive on that front generally.
It needs to meet spec though.
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I should make a business out of that lol
You can literally do that with any business. Start up a business and hire people from abroad to work for you in the country and just sponsor their visa while they go through the process. That’s one of the more common ways that people use, that and marrying a native.
That sounds like work… I’ll go the marrying route instead, there’s more butt stuff that way
I’ll marry you. How much?
Edit: fuck I’m not EU anymore.
