I’m not what I hate. I’m not bigoted against men. I hold no power over men. They hold power over me. Me acknowledging that abuse in society is gendered, and that you yourself are from the gender who disproportionately abuses the other in a unique way unlike anything else in society, is not bigoted. I’ve not said I hate men, nor have I said that there’s anything wrong with you being a man. I’m sorry you’ve been a victim of abuse. I have been too, all by men. So have all my friends. And studies show consistently that nearly every single women will be abused in one form or another by a man in her lifetime. It’s not just the acts themselves, it is the structure those acts create when pieced together, it is the power those actions reinforce and the subservience they force onto others.
You’ve repeatedly mischaracterized me and chosen to ignore every part of my comments that you couldn’t chop up into a neat little narrative about me. I chose to separate myself from the discussion because there is nothing to be gained from talking to you. You think that it’s okay to joke about abusing your wife. You think we shouldn’t criticize men for joking about abusing their wives. I don’t care what the punchline is, or what he was saying about himself. Saying “she’s so pretty I have to daterape her to get her to stay with me” isn’t funny. It’s not. Just like holocaust jokes aren’t funny, just like jokes about slavery, and so on. They’re not funny, objectively. They’re wrong.
You called me out for making my point and bailing, well this is what i have left to say and thats it. I have a job to go to in the morning, I have other things I have to do before bed, and I’m done talking to someone who thinks that those things are fine. This conversation has nothing to be gained for either of us in it. You’re never going to convince me that saying that you abuse your wife, even in a jesting context, is okay. I’ll never be fine with that. I’m not open to any other perspective on that. And you appear to have pretty well the same disposition towards it sometimes being okay to say that you abuse your wife, at least in a jesting context. We have nothing to gain from each other, and will always be on opposite sides with regards to the way that men (yes, men specifically) trivialize the suffering of women at their hands. All too often it takes the form of a punchline for plausible deniability.
Respond how you will, it’s your right, but I’m done. I was less than patient in previous messages. Myself and many other feminists are frequently accused of hating men for acknowledging that women suffer uniquely at the hands of men, and that this dialog was always about a man joking about abusing his wife. You chose to bring up male victims of abuse in a conversation about how women felt about men joking about abusing women. That’s a frequent strategy by misogynists, meant to derail discussions of women suffering at the hands of men. So I responded how I would to any other anti-feminist. I don’t regret that, but in the effort to make my point I’ve taken my time writing this last comment.
I’m not what I hate. I’m not bigoted against men. I hold no power over men. They hold power over me. Me acknowledging that abuse in society is gendered, and that you yourself are from the gender who disproportionately abuses the other in a unique way unlike anything else in society, is not bigoted. I’ve not said I hate men, nor have I said that there’s anything wrong with you being a man. I’m sorry you’ve been a victim of abuse. I have been too, all by men. So have all my friends. And studies show consistently that nearly every single women will be abused in one form or another by a man in her lifetime. It’s not just the acts themselves, it is the structure those acts create when pieced together, it is the power those actions reinforce and the subservience they force onto others.
You’ve repeatedly mischaracterized me and chosen to ignore every part of my comments that you couldn’t chop up into a neat little narrative about me. I chose to separate myself from the discussion because there is nothing to be gained from talking to you. You think that it’s okay to joke about abusing your wife. You think we shouldn’t criticize men for joking about abusing their wives. I don’t care what the punchline is, or what he was saying about himself. Saying “she’s so pretty I have to daterape her to get her to stay with me” isn’t funny. It’s not. Just like holocaust jokes aren’t funny, just like jokes about slavery, and so on. They’re not funny, objectively. They’re wrong.
You called me out for making my point and bailing, well this is what i have left to say and thats it. I have a job to go to in the morning, I have other things I have to do before bed, and I’m done talking to someone who thinks that those things are fine. This conversation has nothing to be gained for either of us in it. You’re never going to convince me that saying that you abuse your wife, even in a jesting context, is okay. I’ll never be fine with that. I’m not open to any other perspective on that. And you appear to have pretty well the same disposition towards it sometimes being okay to say that you abuse your wife, at least in a jesting context. We have nothing to gain from each other, and will always be on opposite sides with regards to the way that men (yes, men specifically) trivialize the suffering of women at their hands. All too often it takes the form of a punchline for plausible deniability.
Respond how you will, it’s your right, but I’m done. I was less than patient in previous messages. Myself and many other feminists are frequently accused of hating men for acknowledging that women suffer uniquely at the hands of men, and that this dialog was always about a man joking about abusing his wife. You chose to bring up male victims of abuse in a conversation about how women felt about men joking about abusing women. That’s a frequent strategy by misogynists, meant to derail discussions of women suffering at the hands of men. So I responded how I would to any other anti-feminist. I don’t regret that, but in the effort to make my point I’ve taken my time writing this last comment.