US senators have urged the DOJ to probe Apple’s alleged anti-competitive conduct against Beeper.

  • Jessica
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    11 months ago

    I don’t get it. iMessage is Apple’s service. Why are they obliged to open it up for everyone to use? Would it be nice? Yes, of course. Should Apple be legally required to open up access to their service?

    • Zak@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      The US Federal Trade Commission puts it this way:

      a firm with market power cannot act to maintain or acquire a dominant position by excluding competitors or preventing new entry

      It further explains that “market power” means:

      the long term ability to raise price or exclude competitors

      Emphasis added. What the government might argue in this case is that Apple has market power in the online message space because it preloads its own messaging app on its smartphones, which I believe enjoy a majority market share in the USA. One remedy the government could seek is requiring Apple to allow third parties to develop clients for its messaging service.

      • surewhynotlem@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        They aren’t excluding competitors. Anyone is free to write a cross platform messaging app that has blue bubbles in it. The preloading thing could be an issue if you can’t uninstall imessage. Otherwise it would follow the IE/edge ruling.

        But we’ll see what the courts say.

        • Zak@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          We’re far from court cases. What we have right now is politicians asking the Department of Justice to investigate. I suspect that’s more likely to go nowhere than it is to go to court.

          If it did go to court, either side of the smartphone/messenger equation could be argued as anticompetitive use of market power, or both; they could claim that Apple used its market power in smartphones to popularize its messenger service, which it then used to increase its market share in smartphones.

        • holdthecheese@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          They’d have to allow any app to replace iMessages as their sms client.

          Alternatively, you could argue that their monopoly in messaging is being unfairly applied in hardware. That would have to be brought up by a hardware vendor like One Plus.

    • kpw@kbin.social
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      11 months ago

      Yes, they should be legally required to open up access to their service. No more walled gardens that hold a large number of users hostage.

        • Maggoty@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          Fun fact, a lot of parts are compatible between cars. But really this is like if they were able to stop a machine shop from creating a replacement part.

        • kpw@kbin.social
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          11 months ago

          That would be awesome, wouldn’t it be?

          Do you think we live in the best possible of worlds where nothing can be improved anymore?

        • KyuubiNoKitsune
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          11 months ago

          Bad analogy. It’s more like, Apple has its own roads that are exclusively for their cars.

          • Eggyhead@kbin.social
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            11 months ago

            Like someone’s private property that they can kind of do what they want with? Makes sense.

                  • Eggyhead@kbin.social
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                    11 months ago

                    I’d be more inclined to believe you if you weren’t throwing ad hominems around in what seems to be an amateurish effort to save face for some reason…

        • rdri@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          And when some developer comes at you and shows how they did some work to make a part compatible with your cars, you go “fuck it, redo all existing cars to make all 3rd party incompatible!” instead of “ok do that at your own risk”.

    • holdthecheese@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      You can argue that they’re unfairly using monopoly power. Same reason why MS was forced to allow windows to switch browsers.

    • akilou@sh.itjust.works
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      11 months ago

      I think the problem is that it’s unnecessarily hardware locked. They shouldn’t have to “open it up” insofar as anyone can access it from whatever app like beeper is doing. But it’s only fair that they support other operating systems. They can still control it or even charge a fee to access it from other OSes.

      • Uglyhead@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        I wish this kind of thing was more spotlighted when Palm and Windows Phone developers were trying to use Google API’s to make apps for their OS’s and got shut down at every turn, eventually killing off the Palm and WP because of device lock-in on apps.

        I still miss what Palm could have been before Google bent them over a barrel with their massively anti-competitive bs.

        • BearOfaTime@lemm.ee
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          11 months ago

          Palm terrified them.

          Palm apps were tiny, took trivial resources, and could provide a lot of what was done with new apps on Android. Dictionaries, calculators, games (I played monopoly on a Treo, it looked great). I watched Mp4 movies on a Treo.

          Imagine Android with a Palm Subsystem so all those old Palm apps could run. It would’ve majorly slowed Android app adoption, perhaps even giving enough support to allow PalmOS architecture to develop into a competitor to Android.

    • NOT_RICK@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      When imessage was announced they planned to bring it to other platforms. That died when they realized how much of a lock in it was

    • JoeCoT@kbin.social
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      11 months ago

      Because their practices are anti-competitive. School kids are getting bullied for using Android phones because they’re “green texters” in iMessage. But most importantly iMessage’s connection with SMS causes all interaction to be very low quality images and videos. And when people complain to Tim Apple about the experience, his only response is “Get your grandma an iPhone”. Our only saving grace is that the EU is requiring Apple to support RCS, which should solve these issues, except they’ll probably find some new way to be anti-competitive about it.

      • Dippy@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        How is creating a proprietary service anti competitive? There are many other methods of messaging and Apple is not stoping anyone from using them.

        Kids being bullied in school has nothing to do with being anti competitive.

        • bamboo
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          11 months ago

          Apple is not stoping anyone from using them.

          You can’t change your default messenger on iOS, so they’re not making it easy to stop using iMessage completely.

          • Dippy@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            You can turn off iMessage in settings and disable the phone number from messages. Then use whatever messaging service you want with the phone number.

            Still not sure how it’s anti competitive to not allow others to use your own proprietary software when there are alternatives available, and they are not being restricted.

            • bamboo
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              11 months ago

              TIL, I did not think it was possible to use SMS with another app on iOS.

              • BearOfaTime@lemm.ee
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                11 months ago

                I don’t think you can use a different app for SMS on iOS. Messages only.

                But u can disable iMessage functionality (iMessage is the network-based instant messenger component).

          • Gray@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            There’s a toggle to turn off iMessage, and the phone asks you when you set it up if you want to use iMessage or not.

            • bamboo
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              11 months ago

              But will you still receive SMS messages in the iMessage app? AFAIK, there’s no way to move SMS to another app, like Whatsapp, and delete iMessage from the phone completely.

              • BearOfaTime@lemm.ee
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                11 months ago

                You won’t receive SMS in the “iMessage app”. Messages is the iOS messaging app, it has the ability to send messages via SMS or iMessage.

                If the iMessage service is enabled and the recipient has an iMessage address/account, it’ll send the message via iMessage. Otherwise Messages falls back to sending a message via SMS.

                I know, we don’t usually make a distinction about Messages the app, and iMessage the service, and just say iMessage.

      • DirigibleProtein@aussie.zone
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        11 months ago

        School kids are getting bullied for using Android phones

        That’s a people problem, not a market-share problem. From experience, kids will always find something to bully others about — if it’s not the colour of the bubbles, it’s something else: the brand of shoes they wear, the suburb they live in, the sport they play (or don’t play). Bullies will do what they do.

      • rizoid@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        11 months ago

        Apple should 100 percent support RCS and Tim’s “buy your grandma an iphone” response was stupid and does show that they don’t give a shit. However the Beeper situation is something different entirely, if the reports I’ve read are too be believed it was a security vulnerability or a blatant disregard of apples terms. Also the kids being bullied thing is very overblown, and almost certainly a regional thing. I live in buttfuck no where and I not one kid gives a shit they just want to talk to their friends. My kid has an android and his friend group is like 50/50 on iPhones. Its weird adults and parents who inadvertently say things or give their children the idea that green bubbles are bed. Kids don’t give a fuck unless they’ve learned it somewhere.