Everyone knew that one of those two people would be president. It’s not like we get a do-over with new candidates if enough people stay home.
Yeah, that is fair.
So deciding to stay home or vote third party means they are ok with this outcome rather than having Harris in office right now.
That does not follow. If they voted for a third party, it’s because they wanted the outcome in which that party won. Call it unrealistic, but it’s not the voters’ fault that democracy is broken, that elections in the US are effectively a two-party system (even when there are others on the ballot), and that there is no system of proportional representation.
As for the staying home case, it does not at all imply that they are OK with Trump winning – just that they refused to play the game altogether. I understand that your point is that the outcome is the same and therefore that the means do not justify the ends.
As you say, if more people voted Harris rather than stayed home, she could be president right now. What I don’t agree on is that that is where the blame lies; there are a million good reasons to be disgruntled with the institution and not keep playing their game of “who’s less awful?”. Trump is president because of his MAGA cult/voters who put him there. If they didn’t vote for him, he wouldn’t be president. Blaming anyone else is not constructive, although ultimately, this is a philosophical difference, not a political one.
Suppose in the next election, Trump was up against someone who is somehow worse. I could not in good faith vote for either. There comes a point where picking the lesser of 2 evils is just falling for the trap, and you’re not really picking anything. There not being any candidate to win over a significant portion of the population is a sign that democracy is compromised. That is deserving of anger and blame. You’re supposed to vote for who you want, not vote tactically against who you don’t want more. That can get old pretty fast.
Obligatory “I am not American and do not live in the USA”; just an observer from outside. If I were, I think that I would have voted Harris, albeit begrudgingly. I just don’t expect everyone else on the fence to make that same choice.
Yeah, that is fair.
That does not follow. If they voted for a third party, it’s because they wanted the outcome in which that party won. Call it unrealistic, but it’s not the voters’ fault that democracy is broken, that elections in the US are effectively a two-party system (even when there are others on the ballot), and that there is no system of proportional representation.
As for the staying home case, it does not at all imply that they are OK with Trump winning – just that they refused to play the game altogether. I understand that your point is that the outcome is the same and therefore that the means do not justify the ends.
As you say, if more people voted Harris rather than stayed home, she could be president right now. What I don’t agree on is that that is where the blame lies; there are a million good reasons to be disgruntled with the institution and not keep playing their game of “who’s less awful?”. Trump is president because of his MAGA cult/voters who put him there. If they didn’t vote for him, he wouldn’t be president. Blaming anyone else is not constructive, although ultimately, this is a philosophical difference, not a political one.
Suppose in the next election, Trump was up against someone who is somehow worse. I could not in good faith vote for either. There comes a point where picking the lesser of 2 evils is just falling for the trap, and you’re not really picking anything. There not being any candidate to win over a significant portion of the population is a sign that democracy is compromised. That is deserving of anger and blame. You’re supposed to vote for who you want, not vote tactically against who you don’t want more. That can get old pretty fast.
Obligatory “I am not American and do not live in the USA”; just an observer from outside. If I were, I think that I would have voted Harris, albeit begrudgingly. I just don’t expect everyone else on the fence to make that same choice.