TL;DR: We tried to move the community because of moderatorial concerns, but fumbled how we went about doing so.

First and Foremost:

We’d like to formally apologize for springing this on you all out of nowhere, and for taking so long to respond to the backlash. With retrospect, we understand that we should have notified you all beforehand to create an opportunity to give us feedback. We understand that a lot of respect and trust was lost, and we expect it’ll take a lot of work and a lot of time before we can earn it back, but we would be grateful if y’all gave us that chance.

What happened, and why?

The primary issue that incited this was because we don’t fully agree with the admin’s moderation policies. By and large they do a great job and align with us on mod actions, but there have been several cases where we strongly disagreed, and our choices were overruled.

For example, 2 months ago, Kolanaki reached out to us via email and said they were banned from 196 for “playing the victim” and asked us why we banned him, but we didn’t. Moss talked to them and realized that the ban was unjust after reviewing the comment he was banned for. If he had never contacted us, we wouldn’t have known about the ban, and they would have still thought we banned them.

There were a few similar events in a short time frame, leading to a few posts/comments in the community about the heavier modding policies. It’s possible some posts/comments were misunderstood by Ada, or she interpreted things differently than we would have, but it led to some bans that we felt were indeed heavy-handed, and would not violate our rules in even the most uncharitable of interpretations. We have found that this is an ongoing trend when it comes to moderation of our community from the Admins. We oppose this because it leads to many users who otherwise mean well ending up alienated and removed for reasons that are frankly completely unfair. This is, in our opinion, counter to what we set out to build in our community.

It was made clear to us that it was their instance, and that we didn’t have a say in who would be banned and what would be removed. This is, of course, perfectly valid. It’s their instance, therefore it’s up to them to decide what goes, but we no longer wanted to be the ones seen as accountable for moderation actions we have no control over. For this reason, we wanted to transfer out of lemmy.blahaj.zone. As much as we wanted to stay in the LGBTQ instance, we couldn’t come to an agreement with Ada, so we talked to her about transferring out and got her blessing.

How we messed up

The most major failing on our part is, of course, that we didn’t announce the migration beforehand. Besides that, we also didn’t explain why we made the choices we made and only gave very vague answers. We avoided sharing the justification for our actions because we didn’t want to cause drama and/or exacerbate the situation, but this lack of substantiating our actions only caused the situation to worsen.

Going forward (if we may), we won’t make the same mistakes again. From now on, we will attempt to be as transparent as possible.

FAQ

Why we chose lemmy.world

Many people have been asking about why we moved to lemmy.world. It already hosts the majority of large communities and besides this uncomfortable level of centralization, it has also been somewhat controversial as of late. Despite that, we still chose lemmy.world due to the following reasons:

  1. Moss’s communication with the admins, and their agreement to let us moderate the community as we see fit. Ruud, after looking over our rules, agreed to abstain from taking admin action to curate or otherwise moderate our community, unless absolutely necessary.
  2. The instance is large enough to support traffic without performance issues (other instances like lemm.ee, sh.itjust.works, and lemmy.dbzer0.com would have been fine too), and the instance has a certain degree of guaranteed longevity.
  3. Moss was given a list that was kindly made by the lemmy.world people as a part of our transfer detailing those who are banned on Blahaj.zone, but not on Lemmy.world, making moderation discrepancies much easier to clean up post-transfer.
  4. Our agreement with Ruud predated the now-rescinded policy changes
  5. It was, to the best of our knowledge, the most federated-with instance. We have come to understand that this is not necessarily the case.

Why not have another team take over the original 196?

This is a similar situation with what happened over on Reddit. 196 mods didn’t agree with admins and were eventually replaced (difference here is that we were not forced out, but chose to leave). As Lemmy was a large gathering spot for people fleeing Reddit, we felt it was better to try to keep the community together and move together. Having another team take over splits the community. The more fragmentation there is, the less longevity and volume of community each skew will have.

What about the possibility of more trolls, neoliberals, bad actors, sealions, and transphobes on Lemmy.world?

Another huge issue was that the mods and the community were not on the same page regarding lemmy.world, their admins, and their policies. We understand the concern about trolls/bad-actors/transphobes, but we feel well-equipped to handle these issues. In addition, we’ve been in contact with the lemmy.world admins for a while now, and they’ve assured us that they’d allow us to moderate our community however we saw fit. All this being said, we still failed to communicate that to the community before taking action, which has undermined any assurances that we have given after the fact. We cannot apologize enough for that.

What about the people who are using instances that are defederated from lemmy.world (e.g. Beehaw)

This is an unfortunate issue that we were not aware of at the time of transfer. We’re not sure what the solution is, but want to make our community as accessible as possible. Community solutions are welcome.

Did you migrate because of X? (addressing speculation)

  • We didn’t migrate due to anything related to neopronouns
  • We didn’t migrate due to us supposedly not wanting to use blahaj.zone lemmy accounts
  • We didn’t migrate due to us having friends who were banned from lemmy.blahaj.zone
  • We didn’t migrate due to us wanting to make the space less queer/leftist/etc
  • We didn’t migrate due to us getting secretly ousted by the Blahaj admin team

What now?

Well, we’re not sure. We could go back on our decision and stay on blahaj.zone, continue on lemmy.world, do both, or try something else. Truth be told, we don’t know what to do. For now, we will leave the comments open to civil community discourse, and choose our course of action from there.

Sincerely, Qaz, Rmbp, Greembow, A_Very_big_Fan, Peachy, and Moss.

  • Catoblepas
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    6 hours ago

    I understand they’re not an admin. In the page I linked you can see they’ve been put in the “Community Team” section. Are you saying that “Community Team” is a convoluted title that the LW admins have chosen to say “person who mods /c/lemmyworld”? Or do they have some other role that I can’t find outlined anywhere? (Which could be on my end, the site I linked doesn’t play well with mobile)

    • A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world
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      5 hours ago

      Ohh, dang my bad, I wasn’t sure what you were getting at. I only knew him as the guy that posted the thing that everyone hated but turned out to not be an admin.

      I’m…not sure what that means lol. But our agreement with Ruud was that we could moderate our community however we saw fit, so I think it’s a moot point anyways. I have no reason to believe he would go back on his word.

      And I’m sorry if I sounded frustrated. I am, honestly, but I didn’t need to direct that at you.

      • The Quuuuuill@slrpnk.net
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        41 minutes ago

        it’s not a good look for you to not know how lemmy.world is ran while simultaneously saying you can’t stay on lemmy.blahaj.zone and are moving to lemmy.world because of how it’s ran. it demonstrates a lack of understanding for the impact of the move, and the potential risks to the community of people you want to force the move on.

        you didn’t do your research and it shows. lemmy.world, of the instances mentioned in your post, is possibly the worst instance to move to, especially considering who is drawn to 196 specifically of any lemmy shitpost community. you this whole debacle has put on display a shocking lack of understanding from a mod team of how community building, the lemmy ecosystem, and the fediverse at large work. we don’t need you to be experts on this to talk with us, but we need you to own your shortcomings, which has consistently not happened throughout this journey.

        • A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.worldM
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          8 minutes ago

          I’m not familiar with the dynamics between LW staff because I’m not a member of LW staff. I don’t know who Ada’s staff are, either. It’s not something I’ve ever had to know to adequately do my job. But I’m also not the owner of 196 and I’m not the one calling the shots. I’m just answering questions and concerns where I can. Moss is the one who knows most about these things.

          However, from what Moss shared with us of her correspondence with the LW admins, I have no reason to believe that they would go back on their word when they said we’re allowed to moderate 196 as we always have.

          Owning our shortcomings was the very reason we wrote this post. I thought we were pretty thorough, but if there’s something we missed that you’d like us to address, feel free to voice that here.

      • Catoblepas
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        5 hours ago

        Yeah, I’m not sure what it means either, which means I’m not sure how many red flags the earlier thread I linked should be setting off. A random mod on LW being respectability politics about neopronouns is meh, someone higher up the chain than that and it’s brake pumping time IMO.

        Also like, presumably everyone else on LW thought they were allowed to moderate their communities how they saw fit before that announcement, you know? My understanding is the LW admins shelved the policy for retooling, not retirement, so personally it’s not something I would want to chance. I don’t think anyone is purposefully lying to you guys, but I also don’t think they’d make an exception just for 196 to do whatever it wants with any future instance rule changes.